May I quote from the guidelines for the administration of Holy Baptism released in the Diocese of Perth. I assume the Diocese of Melbourne has similar guidelines.
" Baptism is not "done" to the child as an isolated individual , nor can it be expected to impart "instant grace" in a mechanical way in isolation from the continuing life of the church. The two sacraments of the Gospel, Baptism and the Holy Eucharist, are organically related: Baptism is initiation into the Eucharistic community and makes no sense in separation from it..... The Sacrament should be administered in the context of public worship. On occasions other than the principal Sunday service, care should be taken to ensure that the congregation is adequately represented.... When parents desire Baptism to take place other than in their Parish church, this must be arranged through their parish priest, who may well wish to encourage them to consider the desirability of the Baptism taking place where the child will be nurtured in the faith....The rite of the Baptism of Infants in APBA should be used in such a way as to emphasise that it is, in fact, the rite of admission into the Church of God." It is obvious from the last line of my article that I did not know all of the circumstances of the Crowe baptism and I apologize for any slur on those involved. However, my point still stands, that when the church accommodates itself to prevailing culture it does itself great harm by dissipating the meaning of its rites. Whether that was the case in the instance of the Crowe baptism I am unable to say.

David accuses me of making "wild" statements and then challenges me to " try and take just one of these statements, quantify it and then we can compare with the Christian belief."....and fair enough too. I select a quote from a Christian website found almost at random using Google http://www.fmc-canada.org/Scod%20Pages/scod_baptism.htm
"Baptism, and religious rites involving the use of water, have been around a good deal longer than the Christian Church. At least three practices involving water were in use among groups who had contact with the early church."
I couldn't think of a theological scholar that would not agree with this statement. Every cleric I have spoken to has agreed with it. Does David think that John the B invented baptism? If so where is the evidence? David also asks why Paganism crumbled before before Constantine & what was different about Christianity, a religion that the pagans flocked to. The answer is that Paganism was not one religion it was a multitude of beliefs belittled and named "Pagan"(meaning "from the countryside") by the Christian church. Many of these Pagan beliefs involved ritual and myth that closely resembles many aspects of modern Christianity. These Pagan beliefs did not "collapse" they were incorporated into Christianity. Paganism is alive and well in the the church at the end of your street. David also asks the pertinent question about the collapse of Paganism before Constantine. The answer can be found in virtually every book on 4th century European history. Paganism did not collapse. The number of Christians in the Roman empire by Constantine's time was very small and were fractured into sub groups. What was different about Christianity was that it had the good fortune to recruit Helen (Constantines mother) to their ranks. This murderer and power player had a great deal of influence with her Pagan son. Constantine absorbed many Pagan beliefs into the religion and succesfully introduced it as the state religion. There is no evidence that Constantine had any respect for Christianity and behaved all his life like a typical murderous bully of his time.

"when a church accommodates itself to prevailing culture, it does itself great harm." Does this mean it can never learn, is immutable? Do I take it to mean you still approve of slavery then? I guess that was a change in the prevailing culture.

No church with integrity should change its teachings just to suit prevailing opinion. But no church with intelligence should ignore evidence challenging the validity of its dogma.

As for that horrendous sermon: Raising any child to be so narrow-minded as to only ever believe one 'shepard' should qualify as abuse. Why would God make humans intelligent, questioning and creative if all s/he wanted from us was blind obedience to dogma?

It's futile to rage against the progress and freedoms humans have made since the Enlightenment. The Age of Reason continues -- thank God

The Russell Crowe debate kinds of negate all the lofty stuff happening. He's not going to Heavean or Hell, he's in Hollywood! (Which would seem to be a mixture of the two, but doesn't quite equate to Purgatory or Limbo in my book) Being dragged up Catholic by nuns and had the good book thrown at me ad nauseum. One must remember that it was written by men and not god and was a sign of the times. If the Church ain't gonna move, so be it, but the people will always vote with their feet. Rituals are groovy, I find it amazing that the Catholic Church is the only church that still practices exorcism. So pagan non? Whilst I can admire the cathedrals,stonework, rituals etc I will always prefer patchouli incense over francinsense (too many benedictions) and will always see

the Bible (old testament) as the most sexist and racist book ever written. To the point where I'd prefer Hugh Hefner and Oprah to give a more balanced view in this society!

Homo au Go-go: Don’t equate “shepherd” with “dogma”. The rule of the shepherd is one, not of oppressive stupor, but of empowering love. In the flock the intellect, the questioning, the creativity are all free to function – in fact, they may even be given more energy – but as a channel for love rather than for selfishness or lazy obedience to the prevailing trends of the world. And that also means the baptised “Craig” is free to question and reject current dogma of the church if he comes to that point intelligently and driven by love.

Peter, you have excelled yourself in putting the point so succinctly and dramatically. The sermon is an inspiration, and I’m going to keep it for future reference at those times when the everyday world’s voices seem too much to deal with.