And the Chinese regard non Chinese as Barbarians............

Seeing as the virus has been found in the stools of a percentage of people with corona it’s totally reasonable to assume that faecal spread of the virus is likely, as well as the other forms of spread.
However, it’s far easier to protect against this form of infection than the droplet spread. Simple hand washing is enough.
I do not believe the figures coming out of China at all, especially in view of the hygiene issues pointed out in this article. Without access to clean running water and good sewage it would be impossible to prevent widespread infection, which means millions have been infected and who knows how many deaths. The figures from Italy would be far more accurate and a death rate of 6% which is in Italy, is a scary thought indeed.

Once this doughnut opined that Trump was guilty and exposed himself as the usual leftie idiot I lost all interest! What that had to do with his all over the place article who knows. This is really a useless sort of "We hate Trump" nonsense article, try harder!

Regarding the figures from China, according to their official numbers, there have been no deaths in children under 9, yet an ABC article giving the stories of three survivors from Wuhan tells a different story. One man, who was hospitalised, described how a whole family in the room next to him died, a young couple in their thirties and their two small children!

Dear JBowyer,

Mate, stop being such a bloody snowflake. One adverse mention of your president and off you flounce in a huff. In truth it was pretty innocuous.

The real worry is whether the Trump administration are up to the job and early indications are not good. The last three cases in Victoria all came from the US. It may well end up being the world's primary 'infector' if they don't shape up.

Having a zero policy for any criticism of Trump really doesn't help Australians. Perhaps you might reconsider it.

Spread by poop. You do know, don’t you, that Chinese farmers still use human waste as fertiliser? Think about that when you buy frozen vegetables packed in New Zealand instead of Australian ‘Birdseye’.

I have never been to China, and is will certainly never go; but my wife has, and she brought back some horrific tales about Chinese lack of hygiene and general filth.

Should we be worried about what mass immigration and foreign students are bringing to us?

In the meantime, how convenient the virus has been for the scaremongering press, now that interest in bushfires has waned.

One recalls how two courageous researchers in W.A. were pilloried from dawn to dark by the medical fraternity for daring to suggest that stomach ulcers were caused by a bug and therefore treatable with antibiotics. And this condemnation by big pharma's puppets in the medical fraternity (most of them), given at the time antiacids were big pharma's top moneymaker? And the howled derision continued until the researchers won a Nobel prize for medicine and for proving beyond a reasonable doubt, their theory.

This brings me to covid-19, Some doctors have it seems, been treating it successfully with antivirals, those that suppress HIV virus. On the understanding that a virus is a virus and an antiviral is an antiviral.

Certainly more productive than collecting and correlating statistics as an exercise in quarantine procedures. Better we never get nor spread this disease ad I for one would not go where Peter did to put himself and all he then had contact with, in harm's way. Some of which could lead to cross-contamination fatalities?

Peter makes some obvious points about personal hygiene and folks forced to live inside unventilated domiciles/rooms/workplaces, due to the daily pollution levels? Thereby assisting the breeding and cross-contamination of this bug.

Which could be treated with nuclear medicine as could anything else that make immune system antibodies?

And where an alpha particle, i.e., bismuth 213 is attached to the antibody and sent with it on a search and destroy mission and done in just over an hour, without harm to healthy tissues as occurred in numerous, reported cancer treatment trails, with bismuth 213! And with far less rads than a stock standard X-ray!

It'd be a huge comfort to overburdened health workers if they knew they could be treated time and again if they themselves fall victim to something someone like a nosey reporter brought back and unintentionally spread.

We don't have bismuth 213! No, we don't and only because the troglobites in charge won't lift their (coal protecting) ban on for peaceful purpose, nuclear power!

IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID!
Alan B.

Dear Comrade

Mate, stop being such a bloody snowflake. One mention of Trump and off you flounce in a huff. In truth it was pretty innocuous.

Your statement that " The last three cases in Victoria all came from the US. It may well end up being the world's primary 'infector' if they don't shape up.' is weird , extreme and downright silly.

Having a zero policy for Trump really doesn't help Australians. Perhaps you might reconsider it.

You're all wrong, it's all Joh Bjelke Petersen's fault !

The number of confirmed cases in Australia has doubled from 50 to over 100 in about 4 days.
What concerns me most it that firstly they ARE NOT testing everyone that has flu symptoms;
Right now they are turning many people away;
They're only testing people who say they've been to an affected country or had contact with someone who came from a seriously affected county.

So their response is inadequate, and the statistics and situation is likely far worse than reported.

They're deliberately lying, because they don't want to cause panic.
News reports are starting to become more serious now.
http://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/coronavirus-victorians-warned-to-brace-for-extreme-response-20200310-p548p6.html

Also you said 2 theories, but you mentioned 3.

"nearby government lab that studies dangerous viruses."

Now seriously people, if you do nothing else today then take the time to find out the whole story, they're lengthy videos, but at least people will stop talking rot, and we can all be on the same page instead of being fed crap.
It's the most informative stuff you're likely to listen to all day anyway so you may as well.

Coronavirus Event Creates Perfect Storm To Push Big Gov Agendas
http://youtu.be/Kw-mCm5jJyc

How The Coronavirus Is Being Used To Control You And Remove Your Rights
http://youtu.be/yVGXN6GR_PI

I'm watching the latest video from today
Iraqi Doctor Claims US Gov Sent Coronavirus Infected Hats To Iraq & NY Calls In National Guard
http://youtu.be/RotUBnivPrI

C'mon everybody, I don't post this stuff so you all stay dumb.
There's links in the video description (or the first comment) to show a source for every single thing discussed in each episode.
The corporate media will never give you these facts, they just tell you whatever and you're supposed to believe them.

- Get the facts -

China has a lot of issues, with pollution being only a secondary concern for the Chinese Gov. Their dominance of world manufacturing and energy use is the main issue for the rest of the world. Sanitation is critical around the world and even China is starting to grasp that. If that waste human sewage didn't fertilze crops, it would add further to China's river pollution.

However, Tbbn needs a wake up call, like most urbanites. Where do you think all the tonnes of wastewater sludge (sewage solids) go to? Yup 100% reuse on the soils used to grow our food! RIGHTLY and SAFELY so.

Also, all the pooh and slurry produced by cows/pigs etc... well that is often sprayed all over farmland as a natural fertilizer being full of phosphates and nitrates,.. the essential food for good crops!

Dear Aspely,

You say: “Your statement that " The last three cases in Victoria all came from the US. It may well end up being the world's primary 'infector' if they don't shape up.' is weird , extreme and downright silly.”

Mmm. Okay, happy to tease this out.

After Wuhan, Iran and the Diamond Princess the other sources flagged were;

“39 cases are reported to have had a direct or indirect travel link to countries including the United States of America, United Arab Emirates, the United Kingdom, Italy, Iceland, Singapore, Thailand, the Republic of Korea, Japan, Indonesia, Philippines, Taiwan, Cuba, Trinidad and Tobago, Nepal, Egypt, Austria, France, Spain, Hong Kong.”

The USA is at the top of that list because they contributed more infected travellers to Australia than any of the rest.

Yet there is no travel warnings in place for it, no self isolating requirements, it isn't even featured on the moderate risk list.

“The Australian Government considers the following countries to be at moderate risk for COVID-19:
Cambodia
Hong Kong
Indonesia
Japan
Singapore
Thailand
If you have recently travelled to these countries, monitor your health for 14 days after leaving that country. If you develop a fever or cough, seek medical advice urgently and isolate yourself.”

So should decisions be based on official figures from the USA or on the number of cases presenting to Australia. I would suspect the latter.

From the NYT.

“In California, where thousands are being monitored for the virus, only 516 tests had been conducted by the state as of Thursday. Washington health officials have more cases than they can currently process. And in New York, where cases have quadrupled this week, a New York City official pleaded for more test kits from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
“The slow federal action on this matter has impeded our ability to beat back this epidemic,” the official said in a letter Friday.”

Let's say you are the PM. It's your call, what do you do to protect Australians?

Dear Comrade ,

Thank you for your Epistle . Cut and Paste really is fun , isn't it , especially when it is from the NYT ? Next will be The Guardian , I suppose ?

To respond , here is another C & P .

"Let's say you are the PM. It's your call, what do you do to protect Australians?"

If I were PM , I would listen to medical experts , not an C & P practitioner online somewhere .

Simples ?

Here is evidence this pandemic is spreading much faster than any news anyone has been told, via aerosol transmission. If so, infection rates are likely to be much worse than we are being told!

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2020/03/09/covid-19-and-aerosol-transmission-some-thoughts/

Workers paradise.

I suppose holding all those contradictions would have an effect on the mind.

Dear Aspely,

Well shame on me for expecting anything but a toady for Trump response.

The main reason I did a cut an paste, my little hive mind friend, was that it was a subscription article.

The New York Times is a respected paper. You could have retorted with a source of your own but that would seem to beyond your obviously limited capacity.

So anyway, the Chief medical officer in WA has recommended banning school excursion to the USA and Canada effective yesterday. Here's another little cut and paste to assist your comprehension, even though this is freely available.

Quote;

West Australian students and staff will have to cancel any school-planned trips to Canada and the United States after Education Minister Sue Ellery extended the travel ban due to the coronavirus outbreak.
The announcement came on Monday as the state recorded its sixth case of the potentially deadly disease and less than a week after the minister banned overseas school excursions to “all countries except the USA, New Zealand and Canada”.
Ms Ellery said the decision to extend the ban to include the additional countries was made from the advice of chief health officer Andrew Robertson.

http://www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/international-school-trip-ban-for-wa-students-to-include-usa-and-canada-20200309-p548f4.html

Yet the federal government hasn't raised the risk level for the USA. Why do you think that is?

End quote.

SteeleRedux

*...Let's say you are the PM. It's your call, what do you do to protect Australians?...*

Q. Which Australians?

A. Not the poor on welfare. Short answer.

Let's consider Armchair Critics conspiratorial theories, which postulate the virus is spread by the US, as an opening round in a biological war against China and Iran.
And consider that within three weeks, the Israelis will offer a vaccine for its control.

Conditions are ripe for the controlled spread of the virus in our own countries of the West, with a design of reducing numbers dependent on welfare from taxpayers, and offering a huge windfall for Western Governments bogged down with welfare budgets which are a huge and growing proportion of it.

Dan

Dear dyslexic Comrade ,

The New York Times is a What ? You lost me there .The Illawarra Mercury and even the Northern Territory News would be held in higher regard.
You haven't quoted The Guardian yet .. but close an ex Fairfax , now NINE source WAtoday. as in this release from the Western Australia Soviet .

"West Australian students and staff will have to cancel any school-planned trips to Canada and the United States after Education Minister Sue Ellery extended the travel ban due to the coronavirus outbreak.

The announcement came on Monday as the state recorded its sixth case of the potentially deadly disease and less than a week after the minister banned overseas school excursions to “all countries except the USA, New Zealand and Canada”. "

So, every country on EARTH appears to be on the list , bar , New Zealand and Canada .

How exactly does adding the USA to a list covering 99% of all countries justify your strange statement .. "" The last three cases in Victoria all came from the US. It may well end up being the world's primary 'infector' if they don't shape up.' is weird , extreme and downright silly.”

Also , I assume by your non-rebutal that you agree with me as to where the PM should be getting his medical advise ?

Peter goes from talking about Chinese filthy toilets and trashing of the Yanzte to his predictable Trump derangement syndrome followed by talking about the Liberals love for fossil fuels. What a foolish rant. The vast majority of people prefer cheap reliable fuel and its only the naïve and dumbed down that think mining and using coal changes the temperature. I have no doubt that along with all other Australians that Peter's life has been much improved by fossil fuels. I suspect strongly his tax funded trips to Wuhan required fossil fuels unless of course he rowed. Peter just shows how group think hate has permeated all our institutions. Try writing an article without your usual disguised hatred.

1. The first 5 paras of Bowden's article were on point. Then it gets sidetracked and a little strange.

- Especially the apparent admiration for mass murderer Mao "It takes a different person, perhaps braver, smarter or stronger, to succeed in a revolution," in Bowden's 3rd last para.

2. Xi visited Wuhan http://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/10/asia/china-xi-jinping-wuhan-coronavirus-intl-hnk/index.html after Bowden's article was written.

SR wrote: "The USA is at the top of that list because they contributed more infected travellers to Australia than any of the rest."

Well actually, nowhere does the Guardian article or the release from the Dept of Health say that the list is in any particular order. So did SR just make that bit up? Is that why there was no link? Perish the thought :)

I know in the land of Trump Derangement Syndrome, everything Trump does is, by default, wrong, but just for the fun of it....

The Countries Best And Worst Prepared For An Epidemic...."The United States was named as the country with the strongest measures in place and it came first with 83.5 out of 100."

or

"WHO Chief Praises Trump for Leading Coronavirus Response From the Top".

Not to mention the Great Arse* Paper Shortage (GAPS)!

* Toilet

Dan: Well spotted and possibly why effective already trialled elsewhere, treatments are withheld? Given even as generic medicine the cost would be astronomical?

That said, my preferred approach would be, to take out some T cells, multiply them in the lab, then inject them back multiplied a thousandfold.

Thereby allow your own much amplified immune response to get you past and with an acquired level of natural, immunity.

Which like the black plague e.g., is a genetically transferable immune response, which may even protect against other pathogens.
Cheers, Alan B.

Dear Trump sycophant,

The New York Times is the recipient of more Pulitzer Prizes than any other media outlet in history, so yeah, deeply respected except by the Trump Cult.

The WA Today directly quoted both the Minister and the chief health officer. That to you is somehow biased reporting? Nick off.

Dear mhaze,

Of the 39 there are newspaper reports which tell of at least 11 of them having come from the USA. If you really felt there was another country more likely to beat that then please let me know. It is what is called a pretty safe bet.

As to your "The United States was named as the country with the strongest measures in place and it came first with 83.5 out of 100." if you follow the links to the assessment it flagged a couple of critical areas.

The USA is ranked 125 out of 195 nations for Healthcare Access. For Socio-economic Resilience it was ranked 59th and 54th for Exercising response plans.

“There is no evidence that the US has undergone an exercise to identify a list of gaps and best practices through either an after-action review (post emergency response) or a biological threat-focused IHR exercise with the World Health Organization (WHO).”

This is what Trump tweeted on the 25th of last month;

“The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!”

It had dropped over 10% in the week before he said this then it went and did the same afterwards.

There were 27 cases of the virus at the time, there are over a thousand now.

That is somehow suppose to be 'very much under control'?

When are you Trump cultists going to wake up. The bloke is a buffoon. Note I didn't say lying this time because I think he actually believes some of this, which makes it even more scary.

The Chinese have a unique opportunity to upgrade their hygiene, and as a lesson taught them by this pandemic? And retrofit millions of domiciles, with millions of made in china, Aussie innovation, as individual two-tank biological digestors that treat and thoroughly sanitise human waste.

These things can be buried under roads etc. if space is paramount? Or under basements/public parks, in some cases. the treated waste produces endless biogas that can be scrubbed and fed into another Aussie innovation, i.e., ceramic fuel cells also made in China.

And from that light, heat and cool domiciles, refrigerate food, fire up the TV and laptop etc/etc, with a 50 or 60% saleable electrical energy surplus.

And endless free hot water.

This would require mountains of steel, iron ore and metallurgical coal, for this massive economic boosting change. and end forever coal-fired home heating or coal-fired electrical energy wherever this plan is adopted as widespread implementation.

Reduce the huge smog problem that is Bejing, Shanghai etc!

Only the pragmatic Chise could do it and massively reduce their carbon footprint at the same time, given this 80% energy coefficient, combination, produces mostly water vapour!

Seriously, the fuel cell does not burn the scrubbed biogas, but rather, converts it via a catalytically assisted chemical process.

Sob, weep, Gnash teeth, rip garments, pull hair, will probably kill our thermal coal sales to them, but massively increase our metallurgical coal sales and in sufficient quantity, to more than, completely offset the lost thermal coal sales and for a least five years and beyond!

The by-products are thoroughly sanitised and reusable irrigation water, and sanitised, carbon-rich, soil improver. And given it is a closed system, is smell free.

If poo is the problem, then turn it around and make part of a pragmatic, doable solution, that can be progressively rolled out! All while massively turbocharging their economy and putting the entire nation into monumental, productive work!
Alan B.

Alan B the Plague is caused by a microbe not a virus. There is also an inoculation for it. A workmate had the inoculation in India in the 1940's and described it as the worse bout of flu multiplied by ten. She said she was desperately sick for a week and her fever caused her to hallucinate.
The people who have died have mostly been elderly and before anyone has a go I am 73!We really have to accept these diseases are just another part of life. Viruses are just a dna spiral in a protein envelope and it is not in their interest to kill us but just to live in us in a benign way.
I am now in a quandry I read it is terrible and will really get a lot worse and that is containable and not an existential threat (Which apparently a couple of degrees temperature increase is). See if the usual suspects had not blown their own reputations by forecasting that we died ten years ago that we may have actually had an idea what was going on.

Comrade ..

You cannot sustain your ramblings .

" Nick off " makes you a loser ..

SR wrote: "Of the 39 there are newspaper reports which tell of at least 11 of them having come from the USA."

I call bullsh!t. Note again there are no links to these supposed newspaper reports. Making up numbers to cover for being outed for making up numbers is never a good look.

http://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/486671-coronavirus-shows-donald-trump-was-right-all-this-time-about-china

Trump was one of the first to institute travel bans against China. When he did it the usual suspects said he was wrong and it was an over-reaction. Now the same bozos say he's not doing enough. Standard stuff from the TDS crowd.

SR has been as anti-Trump as it is possible for one person to be. As each of his erroneous claims (Russian collusion, 'owned' by Putin, will destroy the economy, warmonger etc etc) are shown to be so much ignorant rubbish, the need to ferret out any minor issue becomes manic. Its all pretty funny really.

Oh btw, did you know that calling it the Wahun or China virus is racist? So the 'progressive' elite now inform us?

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/calling-coronavirus-wuhan-virus-isnt-racist-but-china-wants-you-to-think-it-is

Which of course means that we are obligated to call it the Wahun virus...you know, just to piss the so-called progressives off.

'Oh btw, did you know that calling it the Wahun or China virus is racist?'

yeah just like the regressives made up the term 'Russian' collusion. What a bunch of hyppcrites.

Dear mhaze,

This was after a quick scan of the headlines for just my state Victoria showing 4 cases from the US. The figure of 11 country wide was made on ABC drive radio.

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au/news/geelong/geelongs-first-coronavirus-case-confirmed-as-waurn-ponds-shopping-centre-worker/news-story/61be761873cab544fb247a5175bec692

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-11/melbourne-school-closes-after-coronavirus-diagnosis-for-staff/12044594

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-09/victoria-records-new-coronavirus-covid-19-cases/12038048

I really can't be bothered doing all the other States right now but will get back to you when I have the time.

As to Trump did you really just claim an opinion piece from Madison Gesiotto, an attorney who serves with the advisory board of the Donald Trump campaign, was proof that your president is on top of things? Up until recently the US had performed around 5,000 tests with much publicised shortages preventing more. The UK is performing 10,000 test per day but only has a third of the confirmed cases of the US.

As to the opinion piece this sycophant and you are somehow conflating trade tariffs with the coronavirus. It is pretty idiotic.

That you can be so far up this bloke's backside that you think he is doing a good job is gobsmacking. It is quite distasteful and not in the least recognising the threat to this country from travellers from what is quickly becoming a world hotspot for the virus.

Right now http://covid19info.live/ has the US at 8th on the list of confirmed cases. If Trump is doing such a good job we would expect that to go down. My bet is it will instead hit 5th in a week. Reason, because Trump can't slow roll this forever. Freedom of the press in the US means Trump can't control the media like Chinese authorities. Limited test kits serves his purpose admirably. If cases aren't verified by testing they don't make the list. Keeping the numbers of confirmed cases low keep pressure off his precious stockmarket and helps in his election chances.

There are still some people at a high enough level to push back against Trump in the US. My hope is that they prevail and the American people are given every chance to get through this despite your president.

Hello Comrade ,

Remember me ? Are you ignoring me because you have nothing sensible , as usual , to say?

That was an excellent speech by the President of The United States of America , Donald Trump , this morning ! A speech made by a genuine Statesman .

Correct Comrade ..?

Oh, news just in, Tom Hanks and his wife have tested positive for the virus while on the Goldcoast.
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/tom-hanks-and-wife-rita-wilson-test-positive-for-coronavirus-while-in-australia

And Trump has just announced travel bans for Europe;

"United States President Donald Trump has announced a 30-day ban on all flights arriving from Europe, excluding the United Kingdom, in a drastic measure to stem the spread of the coronavirus.

In a televised address on Thursday, Mr Trump blamed the European Union for the rapid spread of the virus throughout the world, accusing them of "[failing] to take the same precautions and restrict travel from China and other hotspots".

"As a result, a large number of clusters in the United States were seeded by foreign travellers from Europe."

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/donald-trump-announces-europe-travel-ban-to-stem-coronavirus-spread

Dear Aspley,

How's it going old chook? Good.

I'm sorry but I'm going to have to pass on the invitation to join you on your knees drooling over your president. You have a good time though and remember to wipe up after you have finished, good hygiene will be essential to combating the virus your idol is so determine to downplay.

Why more Corona Virus in Italy? Same as China

Italy, which has one the world’s oldest populations, could be facing a higher mortality rate as a result of its above-average elderly population. “Italy is the oldest country in the oldest continent in the world,” Lorenzo Casani, the health director of a clinic for elderly people in Lombardy told TIME. “We have a lot of people over 65.”

Casani says that pollution in northern Italy could be a factor in higher death rates. According to a report by the Swiss air monitoring platform IQAir, 24 of Europe’s 100 most polluted cities are in Italy. “Studies have shown a high correlation between mortality rates from viral respiratory conditions and pollution,” Casani says. “This could be a factor.”

Dear mhaze,

It isn't just me asking the question. This is from the Australian subreddit.

http://www.reddit.com/r/australia/comments/fhlvsp/why_havent_we_closed_borders_with_the_us/

Dear mhaze,

Here you go.

"Authorities have provided information about specific destinations in only half of the cases acquired overseas.

Among those cases, the United States was the most common country visited, followed by Italy, China, Iran and the UK."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-17/coronavirus-data-reveals-how-covid-19-is-spreading-in-australia/12060704