Dear runner,

Indeed, as spelt out in Luke; "I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left."

To SteeleRedux

You've really got misinformation down to an art don't you? Let's clean up a bit. Afterword I have a simple question. What's your point in all of this.

Your case for Christians try being elitist starts with Christianity's elitism being harmful to the rest of you. When that is challenged that the church was welcoming, you backtracked on the harm and went with a technicality. Defining elitism by how Christians view Jesus as the head of the church. My counterpoint is that if that is what counts as elitist then every nation that holds a leadership in it, such as an MP is an elitist. It's a worthless complaint backtracking from what you said originally to hanging on a technicality. I decided to not chase down a worthless point. Calling it a worthless complaint and rubbish is enough.

As for the theocracy, what was your point in this? Originally your "simple question" asks if we should live in a theocracy or if we should live in what we have now. My reply is in the context of the topic of the thread, that A) the MP going to church does not make it a theocracy so there's nothing to complain about there, and B) that everyone even the leaders should be allowed to love by their convictions, including their religious ones. I'm not sure if you don't remember what your point is or if it's just a challenge for you to create more misinformation. Either way you've changed gears, to say that now you live in a theocracy, (which the point was challenged) and you again backtrack to say it's a theocracy technically in a legal way, even if it is not in a practical way. Not a solid argument but hanging on by a thread. One that I'm still not sure you meant to argue or that you just got caught up in for the sake of arguing. No reason to chafe your tail on this one. Again I'll call it a worthless complaint and rubbish.

(Continued)

(Continued)

As for Folau and Rugby Australia, I still stand that Folau said nothing wrong. However the verse that his Instagram post is loosely based on does include homosexuality. It's not in Galations, but instead in 1 Corinthians 6. Look it up if you want, but in either case it's not an exact quote, and what's missing, misquoted, or summarized in error were not about homosexuality, which became the focus of the post. Folau even had a text portion below the Instagram picture explaining that people need Jesus to be saved. The comment was not hateful even if the pictured post included atheists, drunks, homosexuals and adulterers as going to hell unless they repent. That part of the message within Christianity. Turn from your sins and turn to God. Repent and seek forgiveness. And that we are saved through Jesus. You might not like it but active homosexuality is included as a sin to turn away from. Folau did nothing wrong here and was not bullying anyone.

Regarding the elitist intent, everyone sins. And everyone has a need to turn from our sins and have Jesus rescue us. Christians count themselves in this boat as much as they count nonchristians. It's not an elitist attitude causing division. The only division going on is that they know that Jesus is the answer and to actively try to turn from our sins. That doesn't sound elitist, divisive or even harmful.

As for Rugby Australia, if they want a moral brand to brag about, then homosexuality and inclusiveness should be way down on the list. If they want real action try to tackle domestic abuse. Too many athletes have that issue. The pro-homosexuality brand is not inclusive, it actually adds more division as we've seen happen again and again by the homosexual agendas that crop up every so often.

So Steele Redux. Are you arguing just for the sake of arguing, or do you have a point that you are trying for?

ateday,

<<I do suspect though that there may be a lot of people disappointed after they die. Me, I`ll just lie there and help a new tree grow.>>

God's view is very different: 'Everyone must die once. Then they are judged' (Hebrews 9:27).

It's time you got God's perspective and not one out of your own mind, http://truthchallenge.one/blog/2012/06/04/what-is-the-nature-of-death-according-to-the-bible/

Dear NNS,

You write;

“Your case for Christians try being elitist starts with Christianity's elitism being harmful to the rest of you. When that is challenged that the church was welcoming, you backtracked on the harm and went with a technicality. Defining elitism by how Christians view Jesus as the head of the church.”

You are doing it again. Is it just that you can't help yourself?

This is what I actually said; “Fundamentalists are the ultimate elitists. You are either with Christ or you are not. They do not believe other denominations like the Catholics are Christian. If you are one of them then you can be directed via sometimes quite toxic interpretations of the word to believe and behave in ways which are not all that edifying to the rest of us.”

I clearly delineated fundamentalists from the rest of the Christian flock yet you have painted my response as referring to them all. Why do you continue to be so disingenuous when you are trying to make your case?

The rest of what you have written is equally duplicitous. You are like a little octopus squirting ink for cover not clarity. Here is another example from you;

“However the verse that his Instagram post is loosely based on does include homosexuality. It's not in Galations(sp), but instead in 1 Corinthians 6. “

Here is the exact verse Folau attached to his instagram post;

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these , adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Galatians 5:19&#8237;-&#8236;21 KJV “
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-11/israel-folau-slammed-over-latest-anti-gay-comments/10991574

You are either doing this wilfuly or through ignorance. The first makes you a liar, the second just sloppy. Both are wrong convictions and I encourage you to disavow yourself of them which ever one afflicts you.

SteeleRedux,

<<Here is the exact verse Folau attached to his instagram post>>

Then Izzy gave us the KJV version of Galatians 5:19-21.

The facts are that Izzy Folau's citation is closer to 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 (NIV):

"Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God", http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Cor+6%3A9-11&version=NIVUK

This list of wrongdoers (unrighteous, wicked) includes "men who have sex with men". 'The words men who have sex with men translate two Greek words that refer to the passive and active participants in homosexual acts' (NIV footnote).