Why are professional and ethical standards so important for universities?

The universities don't seem to think they are important at all.

Good point. I suppose the article could be re-titled something like: Why Universities should take professional and ethical standards seriously.

Why are professional and ethical standards so important for universities?
ttbn,
Because they're a proven & very effective smokescreen to hide the lack of merit !

It appears universities are more concerned with the mighty $ than anything else except for maybe the lunacy that is PC.

"Yet perhaps the most important challenge is to retain, or in some cases reclaim, the importance of professional and ethical conduct within the University."

Most universities have failed outright by supporting the unsubstantiated hypothesis of anthropogenic global warming (AGW). There is no empirical scientific evidence to substantiate AGW. It only exists by way of invalid computer models.

What gross deception on the part of those universities that unquestionably promote AGW!

What is clear is that if you want a job in mainstream journalism you need to lie, have no morals and be able to paint anyone interested in decency or truth as a bigot. There are one or two exceptions. Ethics in the unis is an impossible task unless much of the swamp is drained. Look at the liars the lefties have turned out in America. Our national broadcasters need to be in favour of promoting the gw fraud, perversion, Islam if they want to be promoted. The unis have progressively dumbed people down to a few sick narratives Credibility at the moment for unis is close to zero.

If this persists our university degrees won't be worth the paper they are written on.

Academics pressured to pass struggling international students.

Academics say they feel pressured to pass struggling international students as concerns grow about universities enrolling students with little English.

One scholar said this “moral and ethical quandary” was behind his decision to leave Australia and find work overseas.

“Once international student enrolment in our course surpassed 50 per cent, there was significant pressure to pass work which we would not have only a few years prior,” he said.

“Beyond the fact that no academic wants to fail a student, failing a significant proportion of a class reflects poorly on the teaching staff and the program.”

He is among more than 60 academics, tutors, students and parents who inundated The Age on Wednesday with their concerns about the inadequate English skills of some international students.

It follows revelations in The Age that the Victorian government is calling for a review of English entry requirements for international students.

The academic, who did not want to be identified because he fears it will damage his career, said there was a four-fold increase in international students enrolled in his course during his three-year stint at a Victorian university. Many of these students struggled significantly with English.

“We knew, and were consistently told, by university administrators that international students brought much needed revenue which was supporting our employment and research activities in a time of funding uncertainty,” he said.

“However, we also knew that many of our international students did not have the English language capabilities to meaningfully engage in learning activities, or satisfactorily complete assignment tasks.”

Another academic spoke of how international students shared miserable stories with her while begging her to pass them.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/academics-pressured-to-pass-struggling-international-students-20190123-p50t6j.html

Dr Page,

As a grammatical aside, I was surprised you capitalised the common noun, universities, as Universities.

The grammatical rule is:

"In the middle of a regular sentence—not a title—only proper nouns should have the first letter capitalised. A proper noun is a name; the name of a person, place, official name of a person of office or position of state or government, the title of a creative or non-fiction work, etc." http://www.editoraustralia.com/styleguide_capitals.html

Therefore, it would be appropriate to capitalise the proper nouns in University of Queensland and not the common noun of universities.

Further conformation of this grammatical rule is found at: http://www.plainenglish.co.uk/capital-letters.html

Dr Page,

<<an equally important function for Universities is the search for truth, what we might otherwise call research. Both in the research function and in the teaching function, Universities may well be described as truth institutions. Here too it is difficult not to overstate the importance of adherence to professional and ethical standards.>>

Two questions emerge for me from your statement:

1. The limiting of truth to research is short-sighted in my view. Truth is more than that which is discovered by research. It also involves disclosure and an investigation of that which conforms with reality - the meaning of the Greek, aletheia.

I was invited to a university presentation jointly sponsored the Dept of Health and the Dept of Law. I was interested in the topic of euthanasia presented. This was not a presentation of truth but a pro-euthanasia indoctrination of only one view. That is not an example of a university pursuing truth.

2. What are 'ethical standards' in universities that don't present the various views that encourage students to engage in their own investigations of truth?

What is right or wrong in a university's ethical stance? What view of reality will the university present as its view of truth?

To encourage universities to promote their doctrinal understandings of truth that reject careful inquiry into truth, is a big ask for a secular university.

If I were to attend another university, I'd ask, 'Which professional and ethical standards do you promote?'

Hi OzSpen, and thanks for those insightful comments:

1. Capitalization. Yes, point taken, and guilty as charged. The reason I opted for capitals is that implicitly I was referring to specific institutions, that is, those in Australia. But yes, you're correct, the current trend is to not use capitals.
2. I like your description of research as seeking information "which conforms with reality". Your citing of the Greek word for truth tells me that you may have a philosophical bent, and thus you may be interested in the stream of contemporary philosophy, critical realism, which emphasizes this.
3. Your description of the seminar which was effectively "pro-euthanasia indoctrination" is concerning. Clearly, universities ought not to be institutions of indoctrination. The educational philosopher R.S. Peters is very good on this.
I think I've run out of 360 words, so will continue in another post

OzSpen, to continue:
4. On the importance of hearing both sides of an argument, I like Gandhi's dictum that it is always important to see the truth in your opponent's argument. Or J.S.Mill, where he says that if you only know your own argument, you don't even know that.
5. Good question about where to access standards. That's a PhD in itself, but a starting point are Codes of Conduct and (for public universities) published standards by relevant State Government authorities.

By sheer coincidence I had a great yarn with the Chancellor of a very reputable University just a few days ago.. From the very start I told him & he would've realised within seconds by my lack of command of academic jargon that I am an utterly uneducated bloke. Nevertheless, we had a great time discussing things. He agreed that without merit a lot of the education is well, in my words of not much point.
I told him of my experiences with highly academically decorated engineers & medical people & that I was surprised at their general ignorance even in their own field of expertise. He again agreed & more or less & said that without practical/logical merit we're pushing the barrow uphill.
After many, many years of shaking my ugly noggin at the average Academic's ignorance I was utterly delighted at that man's view of things outside the academic square. The most satisfying part was that he, unlike many others ,actually listened, digested & then offered his view at what I said & he mostly agreed.

Dr Page,

<<I like your description of research as seeking information "which conforms with reality". Your citing of the Greek word for truth tells me that you may have a philosophical bent, and thus you may be interested in the stream of contemporary philosophy, critical realism, which emphasizes this.>>

I am a critical realist in my theory of knowing and pursued it in association with my university PhD examination (in New Testament) of the presuppositions concerning Jesus' resurrection used by John Dominic Crossan.

For the benefit of those on this forum who don't know what we are talking about with critical realism, it is a theory on the process of how people know things. How do I know my house consists of some HardiePlank weatherboard, tiles and carpet? I acknowledge that the reality of the thing known - the tiles - is something other than OzSpen, the knower. Thus it is realism.

I realise that the only access I have to the thing known - the tiles - lies in appropriate dialogue between / about the thing known (the tiles) and OzSpen, the knower. Thus, it is 'critical'. Since I can't talk to the tiles to know what they are made of and to inquire of their durability, I need to talk with the seller of tiles.

Thus, I am able to critically examine reality. This knowledge (e.g. tiles) is separate from me, the knower. It is not independent of me. The exception, self-knowledge, proves the rule but that's a complex case to demonstrate (Wright1992:35).

Critical realism is separate from other theories such as:
+ Positivism, i.e. we can have definite knowledge of certain things.
+ Naïve realism, i.e. I can know things straight, without explanation.
+ Phenomenalism, i.e. I can only be really sure of my own sense-data.
+ Etc.

Dr Page,

<<On the importance of hearing both sides of an argument, I like Gandhi's dictum that it is always important to see the truth in your opponent's argument. Or J.S.Mill, where he says that if you only know your own argument, you don't even know that.>>

Those are excellent examples of the need to have listening ears and understanding of the arguments of both sides.

The fellow whose teaching I examined in my doctorate claimed to not read his opponents. This created considerable problems when he came to his conclusions. He did read some opponents as he debated them.

<<Good question about where to access standards. That's a PhD in itself, but a starting point are Codes of Conduct and (for public universities) published standards by relevant State Government authorities.>>

That only pushes the standard for standards further back. From where were the Codes of Conduct derived? What drove the values for choice of certain codes over others.

As for published standards of state governments, we have the same dilemma. From where did those standards originate?

At some point we need to stop and consider: Are there basic standards on which this nation was built that apply to state governments and universities?

Or do universities create their own values and follow Frank Sinatra's dictum, 'I did it my way'?

Hi again Ozspen: Sounds like a great thesis topic. Did you, perchance, complete this thru the University of Pretoria? I've published on Pannenberg and critical realism, although not as in-depth as your own work. Hopefully this link will work - https://eprints.qut.edu.au/3612/. Universal standards? Wow. In my own PhD I had a go at articulate an ethical basis for peace education, and I came up with virtue ethics, consequentialist ethics, conservative political ethics (interesting one), ethics of care, and aesthetic ethics. Don't know if that counts as a universalist basis for ethics.

critical realism,
Dr James Page,
Would that be the kind of scenario if the average Academic were to be required to survive on income based on their merit ?

Dr Page,

<<I've published on Pannenberg and critical realism, although not as in-depth as your own work. Hopefully this link will work - https://eprints.qut.edu.au/3612/. Universal standards? Wow. In my own PhD I had a go at articulate an ethical basis for peace education, and I came up with virtue ethics, consequentialist ethics, conservative political ethics (interesting one), ethics of care, and aesthetic ethics. Don't know if that counts as a universalist basis for ethics.>>

Yours was a challenging published article. Do do have a link to your entire dissertation online? I'd be interested in reading it, along with your conclusions.

This is a link to my dissertation completed after 5 years of research in 2015 in the New Testament Department of the University of Pretoria, 'Crossan and the resurrection of Jesus : rethinking presuppositions, methods and models.
Available at: http://repository.up.ac.za/handle/2263/50510

individual,

<<critical realism, Dr James Page,
Would that be the kind of scenario if the average Academic were to be required to survive on income based on their merit?>>

Geoff Eaton stated: 'Critical realists propose an ontology [nature of beings] that assumes that there exists a reality “out there” independent of observers'.

This has practical value in many jobs, especially in the human services and pastoral sectors.

When you consider the nature of human beings, do you take the view that people are nothing but fleshly matter?

Or do you consider they have a dimension of reality (soul, spirit, mind, conscience) that is independent of what you observe? If you met me in person would you see my soul or conscience or would their existence be separate from what you observe?

These are some of the aspects of human beings that a critical realist examines.

What impact does that have on my life in the here and now? You'll encounter it when you try to console parents who have lost their son in an horrific accident. What is it inside them that causes these emotions to overflow?

In 34 years as a counsellor and counselling manager, I was pleased that I understood a critical realist ontology so I could bring comfort and compassion to the grieving.

What causes me to reach out to a homeless person living on the streets in my suburb? I understand people are more than the physical. This is a critical realist understanding.

For me, it also comes with a renewed mind through Christ's eternal life.

reach out to a homeless person living on the streets in my suburb?
OzSpen,
If I could have my way there wouldn't be a homeless person in the whole Nation !
If I could have my way there would be more fairness in the distribution of the nation's wealth.
How would I do that you might ask ?
I would have a Flat tax for a start & do away with the Commercial welfare that is negative gearing. That alone would create enough revenue to abolish poverty.
Only educate people do the standard they're capable of attaining not what they can be pushed to by other's money.

individual,

I used the example of the homeless to demonstrate a critical realist ontology by which I understand that people are more than the flesh that you see. This is a critical realist perspective that causes me to reach out to the homeless in my suburb.

My purpose was not to demonstrate how to reduce the number of homeless through government policy.

Why don't you write an article and submit to the editor of On Line Opinion to expound on your views?

ttbn,

<<Why are professional and ethical standards so important for universities? The universities don't seem to think they are important at all.>>

I'd like to know your evidence for these two statements. They seem awfully biased against universities to me.

What leads you to that conclusion? Are you a uni graduate who has experienced the disappointment of compromised professional and ethical standards at unis?

Or, are you reiterating what others say?

To OzSpen,

Ttbn can answer your question. But I've an answer for you as well.

The exponential cost to attend a university stinks of corruption in my opinion. Even if taxes help out with that in Australia, there should be no reason for the costs to dramatically increase as they do, or to be as high as they are as a whole.

The same goes to other markets like housing or medicine as well, with regards to unimaginable costs. But colleges and university, as far as I can tell, go unrestrained with raising the costs to attend.

to demonstrate a critical realist ontology by which I understand that people are more than the flesh that you see.
OzSpen
That is exactly the nucleus of my comments throughout the years. Unless we can convince people to be people instead of mere humans then I'm afraid all efforts are wasted.
I am getting bored with my constant suggestions of the importance of a National Service but I can not think of any other way to make humans to revert to being people. Such a service would give people a sense of belonging (the prime principle) & a sense of respect & responsibility.
Reward effort, re-introduce incentive & we'll be a better society overnight !
And, it'd be cheaper than the way we're going presently !
Imagine a media in which it's reporters have had the benefit of a National Service. No fake News, no hype etc.
People could actually become happier.

Do Universities have ethical Standards.

Hmmm... It has been my experience that, no they haven't. They seem to have lost that. It's called going with the Flow & Universities are run buy that rule.

Here are a couple of examples of my own personal experience. I won't mention the University for fear of being sued.

1. In discussions with an ex-neighbour. He was a Professor of Ecology or something. He couldn't tie his own shoelaces without help. He told me that if any of his Students didn't attend x number of the Demonstrations he organized without a really good excuse he would fail them regardless of how good their Papers were.

2. In recent discussions with a professor at the same University on exactly when Aboriginals arrived in Australia. The new figure quoted now is 40000 years ago & only one invasion.

I showed him other studies done a few years ago quoting a minimum of 70000 years ago based on Fluorescence. A cave in North Western Australia & a Stone Axe head & fires with burnt bone.

Other Studies cited three movements. 80000 years ago from the direction of the Malay Peninsular. They were a Negrito type people whose ancestors ended up in Tasmania.

The Second Group, an Austronesian Group, was about 45000 years ago coming across the Land bridge from SE Asia to Borneo thence to Australia. Spreading westward & through the Centre.

The Third Group about 15000 years ago, a Melanesian Group, coming from Indonesia & Papua New Guinea settling in Arnemland & Cape York & down the Eastern Seaboard.

Now this Professor denyed that there was any such studies. I gave him the names of the people who did the study. His argument was that that had all changed now. I asked him if if was for the sake of Political Correctness & keeping his Job. After some coaching he finally admitted that it was.... sort of.

Well that's two. The others I had thought of have slipped my mind for the moment. Getting old. But two good examples of PC v Ethical Standards.

Interesting comments indeed thus. Just some brief points in response to discussion thus far:

1. In response to OzSpen's thesis query, easiest step is to search-engine "Peace Education: Exploring Some Philosophical Foundations" and "International Review of Education", and an online version of a summary journal article will come up. BTW, I like much of what Crossan says, but I think the train goes a little off the tracks on the resurrection.

2. In response to Jayb posting, I believe that if you make adverse comment about a University as such, there is no right for the University to sue for defamation. It is only when you make specific comments about individuals associated with the University that adverse comments become potentially defamatory.

Dr Page,

Thanks for your suggested topics for a Google search for your dissertation.

<<BTW, I like much of what Crossan says, but I think the train goes a little off the tracks on the resurrection.>>

Do you support his postmodern, deconstruction (reconstruction), reader-response hermeneutics?

In response to Dr James. I guess I won't name names well.

The other bloke worked at AIMS & contradicted the Greenies there so they sacked him. He pointed out what the Boaties in North Queensland had been telling them for 40 years. One part of the Reef is healthy, another part starts to die another part is dying, another part is dead, another part is starting to rejuvenate another part is rejuvenating another part is healthy again & so on down the line. It's been this way for millions of years.

They thought they might lose their funding if the supported him. They told him to keep his mouth shut & he didn't so they sacked him. Seems to happen a lot at universities. Ay. Go with the current flow or get tossed out.

Then something closer to home. All of my brothers are Boaties. Two of them owned Trawlers. One brother while waiting in Upstart Bay was watching some Giant Manta Rays, He went swimming with them & noticed they were Mating. So he took photos on a Polaroid. When he was passing AIMS he called in & gave the Photos to a Professor there. The Professor tols him the Photos were fakes & no-one in the World knew where Giant Manta Rays Mated. They ordered him off the Wharf or they would call the Police. 12 months later this Professor make an amazing discovery & it's written up as his discovery.

Apparently this happens a lot at AIMS. When AIMS first started up all the Boaties & fishermen came to help them with information as to where thing happen & what happens. This was a great help to the people at AIMS. Then a few years later they took that information & closed down the Fishing Industry. The Boaties won't even let them look at their Bycatch now-a-days.

Cont.

My other brother hit a reef near Princess Charlotte Bay & was stuck there for a few weeks until another Prop Shaft could be got to him. He had a lot of time on his hands & went exploring. He came across a sort of rock jetty built into the side of a cliff face. The rock had been cut away & the was a flat piece forming a jetty. There were long, what he said looked like wheel ruts & a type of Crane using a single Post in a deep cut hole (he dug one out) & a semi circular where mark where a weight had used to maneuver the crane. On the back of the cliff face there were, what he said looked like Hieroglyphic. He took photos of the whole thing & measurements.

When he got back to Townsville He got the Photos developed & took them out to the Uni. The History department took the Photos & said they'd look at them & get back to him. Months later he rang the Uni to find out what the verdict was. He was told to forget he's ever seen the place because if they investigated & found them to be factual they would have to change the whole history of Australia & no-one wanted to do that. He asked for the Photos back & they said they'd keep them for future reference.

Do I think Universities are ethical. I don't think so.

Ospen. I read you dissertation. My personal Opinion. Load of old Codwollop.

First you have to assume it's all true. That dictionary must have tasted delightful.

Another Opinion. People who use an excess of big words to impress people only makes them look stupid. It's a quote I heard on T.E.D. You succeeded spectacularly. Ay.

OK. Before I commence, apologies that typo in my previous comment. Anyways:

1.OzSpen. I probably don't know enough about Crossan to respond sufficiently. I did read The Greatest Prayer, and I found it was one of those books where you could only read a little at a time, because you needed time to reflect. I think he is on the money with his comments on justice and nonviolence in the message of Jesus. But, in my humble opinion, I think he goes off the rails with the resurrection. BTW, the writer who I think today has a great deal to say is Franciscan priest Richard Rohr. Insightful and highly readable. He heads a Centre for Action and Contemplation in the US. Love that name!

2. Jayb. Gee, you're a bit tough on OzSpen! I think you're kinda correct regarding the big words thing. But then again big words can be a short-hand that those within a specific field understand. For instance, OzSpen used the word "hermeneutics". I understood exactly what he meant. And if it comes to big words, then I probably need to plead "guilty as charged" as well, at least in my academic writing. You raised another important issue, but I think I've run out of word limit.

Jayb,
I'd like to know more about your brother's find, any chance of making contact somehow ?

I know what you mean re the history outfits of Unis. I've had my own experiences in that field.
Much history & artefacts are lost as no-one wants to report anything because all the credit goes to these academics. My mate found a highly historic wreck & Tax cost him 3/5th of the puny reward. Regarding the finding, his name is only brought up when there's no other way around it.

Jayb,
would RR mean anything do you regarding the find you mentioned ? If so, I'm aware of it all.

Indi: I'd like to know more about your brother's find, any chance of making contact somehow ?

Michael died of Throat Cancer a few years ago. The Boaties in Innisfail did a Surfie thing for him. A circle of Fishing Boats & they placed his Ashes on the Reef. Michael was extremely intelligent unfortunately an bad alcoholic & heavy smoker. That's what killed him.

A Russian Chess Champion was doing a tour of Australia when he visited Townsville. He invited people to have a game of Chess in the Mall. He set up about 30 boards in a semi-circle & when you were beaten you had to vacate. Michael watched him for about 30 minutes & sat down. He beat the Guy time after time until he got bored & left. The Russian guy rushed down the street & offered Michael to come with him on tour.

Michael was on one of his benders at the time & refused.

Indi: RR

No, haven't a clue. All I know about it was what Michael told the family. He'd talk about it when something would come up, like the wreak at Mackay, which the Uni doesn't want to talk about either.

He was always pi$$ed off at the Uni for keeping his Photos. He gave them the Pack complete with the Negatives.

Jayb,
cheers for the reply ! Possible I knew him, will check with the fishing blokes. I spent years on the Cape & Reef.

Indi: I Possible I knew him,

Michael Barr, out of Innisfail. Tall & skinny.

Dr Page,

<<OzSpen. I probably don't know enough about Crossan to respond sufficiently. I did read The Greatest Prayer, and I found it was one of those books where you could only read a little at a time, because you needed time to reflect>>>

I'm guilty as charged with my use of 'hermeneutics' = interpretation. To get a better handle on J D Crossan's postmodern, reconstructed interpretation, I suggest a read of one large and one small book of his: (1) The Birth of Christianity (1998 HarperSanFrancisco) - 653pp, and (2) Jesus: A Revolutionary Biography (1994 HarperSanFrancisco) - 209pp.

You know that a PhD dissertation, the highest degree in my discipline, is designed to be evaluated by academics. I had 3 of them who reviewed my hard copy and each gave a mark. Then I had to engage in a tough verbal examination of my thesis. That was not a lot of fun, but I passed.

Ozspen: You know that a PhD dissertation, the highest degree in my discipline.

Well, that's great, but what do you actually do that benefits people? Do you have a useful day job?

I was an Engineering Tradesperson (Mechanical). You know, A Fitter, Turner, Boilermaker, Electrician & Carpenter & I've got more tickets for Heavy Machinery than you can poke a stick at. A Certificate 111 in Computers & Certificate 111 in Business Studies. An Instructor in All Weapons, Map Reading, Military Tactics (Jungle) & Military Law & ahh Drill. You know, really useful things.

An ex lady of mine had an Arts Degree in translating Ancient English into Old English. Couldn't get a job anywhere for love nor money. She became a Nurse & still was last I heard.

JayB,

<<Ozspen: You know that a PhD dissertation, the highest degree in my discipline. Well, that's great, but what do you actually do that benefits people? Do you have a useful day job?>>

I contemplated not responding to your cynical, disparaging comments. I also have a Cert IV in Training and Assessment.

All my life I've had useful, encouraging and beneficial employment. Before I retired - GET THAT - before I retired, I was counselling co-ordinator and counselling manager for 17 years with difficult youth and their disillusioned parents. I've had many years of practical counselling experience with marriages and families.

Even now I could walk into a job that pays well and uses my PhD qualifications to advantage.

You need to take off the blinkers that close your mind to high degrees leading to useless jobs.

Ozspen: Even now I could walk into a job that pays well and uses my PhD qualifications to advantage.

I get the fact that you are a very intelligent person with a very high degree. As I said, I read your dissertations, One & a half Reams of paper, I'd say it's very good, for what it is, but doesn't actually prove anything other than you can critique someone else's work. It's not like finding a cure for Cancer, something useful. I know you are proud of your Dissertation, you keep letting people know you have done one, often. That tells me, in my opinion, that you have an Inferiority Complex & have to prove to people how good you are.

I don't, I know. I don't have to prove anything to anyone.

I have noticed that if anyone new come on here you have to inform them about just, how great thou art.

Someone could do the same with "Alice I Wonderland & get a PhD."

Have you done any "Original" work. I have noticed that when someone does their Masters in Uni. they seem to just rehash older work by several authors. Later someone will include your work in their work & so on & so on. No Original work. Not just on Religion but on every subject.

I have been to Councilor's & I have a Niece who is one. Loony Tunes. She had head problems so she became a Councilor. I have noticed that most Councilors all started out that way. It must involve a lot of training to say to a client, "& How do YOU feeeellll… about that? ah Hummm…." The first time I heard that I burst out laughing. Much to the dismay of the Councilor.
Cont.

Cont.

It's like everything is scripted now-a-days. After my first Operation I had to go to a Physio. I got the speal about what to do & how to do it. If I interrupted she went back a few words, like a rewind on a tape, & start4ed again. Then after my second Op. I went to another Physio & got exactly the same speal. Then he went to the next patient & he gave her exactly the same speal as he gave me. Both of them were more interested in selling their "Products."

My wife & I went to buy her a car & the Sales manager came out & gave us this big scripted speal about their Product & how good it was. He must of spent hours in front of a mirror to get it just right & all the hand gestures too. I burst out laughing about half way through. We didn't buy that car.

I'm not saying Councilor's don't have their place, they do. They have to do something with all the Education. I suppose.

As for taking up where you left off before you retired. I'm retired as well, & yes, so could I, In any number of my various roles in life. I still Instruct (teach). I have grand children & a street full of kids who need help from time to time. Building a Cubby, fixing a Skate board/bike, learning to read, play nicely (sorting out their little scraps). I never do it for them. I make them do it themselves, just a little guidance & advice. That way they learn & build confidence. "You can do it."

See, you never really retire. It's just a new phase of life.

No-one really cares if you have a PhD. Other people have skills that are much more valuable to the World than "Ahaaa Hmmm...."

Hi Jayb: Again I kinda agree with you. I think it is important to have practical goals in mind. But equally it is important to ask questions, and this is what intellectual work does. Interestingly, you are making some important intellectual points in your post, such as that effective education and training does not involve doing things for people. In fairness to OzSpen, though, I don't think he really was flaunting his qualifications - rather, that was my fault, due to some search-engine work on my part!

DR JP: it is important to ask questions,

Agreed, but some people don't like the questions I ask. I'd never get on the ABC because the questions I would ask no-one would want to answer. Regardless of which side of Politics they were on. There would be diversion after diversion.

I believe that if you don't ask question you'll never learn anything. Even a desperate diversion can teach you something. I you get my point.

Dr JP: effective education and training does not involve doing things for people.

But what you do with the result does.

Dr JP: I don't think he really was flaunting his qualifications.

He has in other Posts & mentioned it again in this one.

I do tend to be a bit blunt in my Posts & cut to the chase. It come's of old Sig. Training in the Army. Short & precise. I've never been able to flower thing out. I guess I have a Precis type of mind. Sort of, "Zero Niner, this is, Two, Two, Alpha, Target, Over.

Oh, my Call Sign, & Zero Niner, is Mortars. I thought I'd better explain that. ;-)

JayB,

<<I have been to Councilor's & I have a Niece who is one. Loony Tunes. She had head problems so she became a Councilor.>>

You can't even spell the word, counsellor.

Ozspen: counsellor.

Co un SELL or. If you break it up that's what they do. The first thing they do is tell you how marvelous they are. Sound familiar?

JayB,

<<Co un SELL or. If you break it up that's what they do. The first thing they do is tell you how marvelous they are. Sound familiar?>>

There you go again by avoiding admission of error.

In the post to which I referred from you, you referred to a counsellor but spelled it councillor.

Why can't you own up to your error?

OzSpen:
<<Co un SELL or. If you break it up that's what they do. The first thing they do is tell you how marvelous they are. Sound familiar?>>

There you go again by avoiding admission of error.

Gee's mate, lighten up, you'll have a heart attack.

Ok, Yes, I spelt it wrong. Please ask God to forgive me & not strike me dead for making a spelling mistake. Anything else you wanna whinge about?

Yes. I want to whinge about the Broncos letting Wayne Bennett go to the Rabbitohs.

Dr JP: Yes. I want to whinge about the Broncos letting Wayne Bennett go to the Rabbitohs.

Well, if you have to make a deflection, make it a good one, Ay. Good onya. };-)

Hi Jayb: No worrries. Happy to have made your day.