Given the scum that the ADF is fighting, it is insulting an moronic to accuse them of atrocities.

No one knows how they will react under fire or if placed in extreme danger 24/7.

Or wondering where or who the enemy is or is hiding.

Or is a complete stranger to the truth in illuminating alleged atrocities. And a case of the kettle calling the pot black?

And how many tours of duty and unremitting fear does it take to break our finest and most fearless? Or their normal moral compass?

If the enemy uses human shields as his first and or only defence and in order to survive you must return fire!

Who is to blame if there are some unsanctioned deaths among innocent civilians?

Or do you expect those we send into harm's way, to cower like cowards and refuse to return fire on the grounds that kid or woman with an AK47 firing at them is not a real terrorist but rather a civilian?

Time to end this fifth column inspired witch hunt, extend extenuating circumstances and pin a few medals on these unsung heroes!
Even if one or two of them have to be pinned on a few bare asses?
Alan B.

When their adversaries play by the same rules then perhaps criticism can be made.
Until then they are doing a top job in a nasty tribal war.

Recommend as a read Fred Smith`s "Dust of Uruzgan" and Chris Masters` book mentioned in this essay.

Prosecute them BUT start with the people who sent them there in the first place.

Especially if the wars were started on lies. WMD etc.

Before anyone is eligible to criticise those fighting for us in any way, they should go & do a six month tour of duty as a private foot soldier, in a war zone.

Once they have gain this required qualification to have even an opinion, & if they have survived, then we may listen. Prior to that it is simply an uninformed mouth flapping, not a considered opinion.

Firstly we are in Afghanistan purely to bolster our relationship with the US. The Afghanistan people, even the Taliban do not have the reach, resources, nor inclination to do any harm to Australia. A two tour soldier I spoke with admits that those trying to do him harm just wanted the invaders out of his country, something he felt quite in sympathy with if the shoe had been on the other foot.

Secondly SAS soldiers are operating in our name. There were more than a few times Australian pilots refused orders given by the US command because of unacceptable risks to civilians. The SAS should be held to a similar standard. If any of them slip the leash and commit unacceptable acts then they should be appropriately dealt with, removed from service if needed.

There are those in our society, media, and particularly on this forum who are so utterly cowardly that they would accept indiscriminate killings and torture if it made them feel a little less fearful. They are the true disgrace in this equation.

Wow! Steely spoke to an SAS soldier & now knows all about it!

What a waste of space.

Dear Hasbeen,

How's it going old salt? Here's the usual tip mate, try and read posts before you comment. No where did I say the person I spoke to was SAS.

Now what is your beef exactly? Oh yeh, that's right, you don't want any one in our armed services criticised unless it is by one of their own. Wonder how that would work out.

Now I can do little to calm your terror mate except to say condoning or even celebrating torture and extra-judicial killings aren't going to help no matter what you think. The only thing that will is for you to hop back aboard the yacht of yours and make yourself scarce again. We will send a message when we think it is safe for you to return.

Or maybe we won't.

The question that should be asked, is "What the Hell are we doing there in the first place?" We went in there under false pretenses, we reamain there just to appease our U.S. masters. These people have a right to run their own country without interference from outside. They should be allowed to go back to their tribal existence and our people should all come home. In Afghanistan, the Talibsn are just as legitimate as any other local group.

David

To some extent, I agree with Steele Redux in that there are rules of engagement, and they need to be adhered to, and where the high-level commanders have misjudged a situation perhaps through insufficient information, it is the responsibility of the man on the ground. Deliberate killing of civilians or prisoners is not allowed under any circumstances and civilian casualties must be minimised.

On the flip side, given that many Taliban combatants deliberately mingle with civilians to hide, this makes civilian casualties impossible to avoid entirely.

Those who deliberately kill civilians or prisoners need to be punished.

The whole mess in the Middle East is an atrocity. We should not be there. Meanwhile, when you take young inexperienced men full of testosterone and belittle the compassion and soul in them, train them to be killers, unleash them in a hellzone where gratuitous violence is a normal day, THEN you have set the standard expected and have no right to complain about what happens when your creation can't stop being human. Worse is when the traumatised soldier is dumped back into society where he is expected to pick up where he left off.

Oh, and by the way - they are NOT there fighting for our freedom. We already have that.

Shadow Minister Quote "Those who deliberately kill civilians or prisoners need to be punished."

The people who need to be prosecuted are the people who start these wars with lies.

I was asked quite a few times by sincere Police officers that I should become one too. My reply was that I appreciated their faith in me but I could not trust my own tolerance towards many of the immoral culprits I would have to deal with.
It is therefore quite easy for me to understand when soldiers see fit to override some Geneva desk jockey's views of what should happen on the battlefield in the heat of the battle.

Dear individual,

Pretty turgid reasoning as has become normative of you of late.

So when soldiers override the Geneva conventions and torture and kill unarmed civilians or fighters then don't they then become immoral culprits deserving of torture and death even when prisoners themselves?

Steelereedux,
Your comment would be totally different were you to have some life experience outside the academic Public Service PC cocoon.

//Your comment would be totally different were you to have some life experience outside the academic Public Service PC cocoon.//

OK, now I'm curious as to how it is you come to know so much about his life.

Psychic or stalker?