You guys need to keep up-to-date. It might not be a criminal offence in Australia to criticise religion, but it is already illegal in the ACT http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/act-parliament-passes-religious-vilification-laws-20160804-gqlagu.html and I look forward to taking Joe to court for his scurrilous attack on me as a Christian.

I strongly object to people claiming that all religions are backward. Not only is it a misreading of Christianity, amongst others, but it denies the very rights that Joe and others enjoy by living in a Christian society. It was Christianity that invented the idea of universal human rights, as well as the idea that everyone is equal.

We are still struggling to get people in the world to accept these principles, with most living in countries where the principle that humans should be treated as equals is not even accepted in theory. So Christianity is still on the leading edge, unlike backwards philosophies, like, say Marxism, which, while paying lipservice to universal rights, insist on taking them away, such as in China, in the interests of the greater good, and privilege members of the party over all others.

BTW, relax Joe, wouldn't take you to court in the ACT, even though I probably could. As a Christian I'm also a member of a religion that invented the idea of free speech.

What a truly dreadful waste of space and money Canberra is: a mini-North Korea, plomped down in good sheep country. I'll bet there will never be any action or fines against anyone taking a swipe at Christianity,there. Ratty vilification laws are not there to protect religion; they are there to protect Islam, which is not a bona fide religion in any case. Islam is a whole-of-life doctrine, based on fear and hatred.

Christianity, like it of leave it, is a genuine religion of love. It is what has made us white, Western democrats what we are. Whether or not we call ourselves Christians or not, we have all been touched by it, we have all benefited from it - unlike all non-Christians, many of whom are still living in ignorance and POVERTY two millenia after the 'word'.

I never ceased to be amazed by people, who have had all the benefits of Christianity bestowed on them, rubbishing Christianity and comparing it to an insult-to-humanity like Islam. I'm not a good Christian. I do not 'witness' my faith. I am not a better person than anyone else. But I am a much better person than I would have been had I not been privileged to be born into a society based on Christianity.

Hi Graham,

Yes, I was bending over backwards not to attack that 'other' religion, knowing that Christianity provides, even for atheists, the moral foundations for the freedoms that we now enjoy. Christianity is robust enough to take a few back-handers :)

The Enlightenment, and its elaboration of human rights and freedoms, was, one way or another, an eventual outgrowth of the long history of conflicts between various Christian-based philosophies, and even we atheists should acknowledge our parentage. Would - can - Enlightenment values arise from any other religious foundation ? They don't seem to be making much headway so far, up to 2017.

Cheers,

Joe

yep the fundamentalist secularist to blind to see that their faith has produced putried man hating feminist, baby murderers and spiteful hateful bigots. As said many times they have more in common with Islam than they would like to admit.

I personally regard the author as a particularly nasty piece of work.

His latest offering was to tweet this little gem within an hour of 3 people being run down in Melbourne; “Probably one of those semi-automatic assault cars”.

http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/melbourne-cbd-david-leyonhjelm-slammed-for-semiautomatic-assault-cars-tweet/news-story/390871e0e1cd9f2f7d77ef352cde8940

Even One Nation Senator Roberts had the good sense to dial back his own contribution.

It is very hard to escape the obvious, Leyonhjelm wants to be free to trot out whatever bit of bile that takes his fancy without sanction.

When the Lyntt cafe idiot was sending letters to the widows of dead Australian servicemen there were those on this forum who defended his right to do so, based largely on their hatred of this law. While I think it could be tweeked I wanted 18C and the accompanying passages to retain the ability to sanction someone like Monis, to investigate hate speech emanating from fundamentalists in our Mosques and Churches, and empower people looking to rein in those flinging racist barbs over the boundary fences of our sporting grounds.

There are those who wish to incite and inflame and in doing so harm what we have managed to build in this country. That there should be sensible rules in place to deal with them is to me a given.

“It is very hard to escape the obvious, Leyonhjelm wants to be free to trot out whatever bit of bile that takes his fancy without sanction. “

You think so, Steele? Seems to me that you and your media mates have done a very good job of sanctioning him.

I must say, though, the tweet was tasteless and unforgivable. The Senator, like all politicians, should be examining their consciences and thinking about the fact that is they, the political class, who are responsible for allowing maniacs into the country.

But you, Steele, and the rest of the barking Left, need to realise that freedom of speech is for everybody in Australia, not just you.