The Forum > Article Comments > God has a human face > Comments
God has a human face : Comments
By Peter Sellick, published 21/12/2015While it is popular to say, in an intended peace-making turn, that Christianity, and Islam believe in the one God, it is apparent from close inspection that this is not true.
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Posted by Loudmouth, Thursday, 24 December 2015 3:17:56 PM
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AJ
My first post that you answered was about violence against women and you commented on its cherry-picking. Your quote has 'Other prosperous democracies do not significantly exceed the U.S. in rates of nonviolent and in non-lethal violent crime'. So OK it's crime in general but the theme was rape , in GlenC comment. Posted by nicknamenick, Thursday, 24 December 2015 3:20:23 PM
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Gee's AJ, the old Magistrate must have a fun time with you in a Court Room.
AJ: Jayb, I have no idea what the point is that you’re trying to make. Should Moses, & Arron be charged with Murder or maybe even Genocide for the whole sale slaughter of Baal Worshippers? I notice there were 10 or 14 Commandments but no mention of Penalties to be given to transgressors. How say you? Posted by Jayb, Thursday, 24 December 2015 3:26:56 PM
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Dear Peter/Sells, . Though, at the time of the events related in the New Testament, there were many people called Jesus and possibly several from Nazareth, and presuming that all the events concerned just one of them, the same Jesus of Nazareth, there is no reason to doubt that he was a human being. The doubt is whether he was god – not just a representative of god - but god himself. I can understand the negative reaction of the other two Abrahamic monotheisms, Judaism and Islam, when Christianity decided to raise that particular human being to the rank of divinity, four hundred years after he was purported to have been executed. This was mainly due to the Roman emperor Constantine (the Great) who, to quote the Encyclopaedia Britannica: « not only initiated the evolution of the empire into a Christian state but also provided the impulse for a distinctively Christian culture that prepared the way for the growth of Byzantine and Western medieval culture »: http://www.britannica.com/biography/Constantine-I-Roman-emperor The doctrine of the Trinity was adopted by “the Church” as you call it, in the year 325 AD. As the World Timeline puts it : « Christianity is receiving state support, new churches, more wealth and more elaborate rituals. Christianity's bishops defer to the authority of Constantine, who wants to heal divisions within the Church. Constantine presides over the Church's first ecumenical (general) council, at Nicea, to decide the nature of Jesus Christ. Bishop Arius and Arian Christianity lose. The doctrine of the Trinity is accepted ». The Trinity was a concept that was adopted on purely political grounds, not just on its theological merits as you indicate. http://www.fsmitha.com/time/ce04.htm Political differences are evolutive and “negotiable”. From a purely theological point of view, this departure from “exclusive” monotheism to “pluriform” monotheism could probably have been avoided had the Church decided that god appeared as a human being temporarily in order to achieve atonement, instead of raising him permanently to the status of divinity, equal to god himself. This would have avoided having to invent the holy ghost and the virgin birth. . Posted by Banjo Paterson, Saturday, 26 December 2015 7:48:22 AM
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Banjo: there were many people called Jesus
Well, no there wasn’t. The name Jesus is Greek & didn’t appear until after the Council of Nicaea. It is not a Greek equivalent of Joshua. Banjo: I can understand the negative reaction of the other two Abrahamic monotheisms, Judaism and Islam, when Christianity decided to raise that particular human being to the rank of divinity, four hundred years after he was purported to have been executed. Woops! Islam wouldn’t be around for another 350 odd years. Banjo: Constantine presides over the Church's first ecumenical (general) council, at Nicaea, to decide the nature of Jesus Christ. The Councill of Nicaea wasn’t a solely Christian affair. Constantine call the leaders of ALL the Religions of the Roman Empire to the Council. He wanted a religion that would be accepted by the people. When the Council started Constantine placed his Praetorian Guard around the Great Hall with the express orders that anyone that stuck their head outside was to have it lopped off. They were eventually put on Bread & Water rations. The final decision took a year & a day. The decision finally came down to three Christian Sects. Paulean, Manicheans & Priscillians. Constantine dismissed the Pricillians, Two were left Pauleans & Manicheans. When Constantine started to favour the Manicheans St. Augustine stepped in & sent emissary to Constantine with a matching Brace of four Arab stallions. Constantine chose Paulean Christianity. The first thing the Pauleans did was to start executing all the non-Pauleans if they didn’t accept the ruling. That was bad news for most of the Christians in Britain as they were Manicheans. Posted by Jayb, Saturday, 26 December 2015 8:51:34 AM
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The name Jesus is a combination of Zeus, Hesus & it was spelt Yesus as there is no J equivalent in Greek or Latin. Zeus being the head Greek God & Hesus being the Sun God from Britain where Constantine was born & grew up. His mother was a Christian. A descendent from John the Younger & his wife was also a Christian.
Interesting note. When Constantine was on his deathbed the Christian Bishops came in, Dismissed his Praetorian Guard, closed the doors & waited for him to die. When he did the Bishops came out & announced that Constantine had been baptised & died a Christian. Convenient eh. Constantine worshipped “Sol Invictus.” It wasn’t until about 380 The Roman Emperor Theodosius the Great declared Christianity the Only Religion of the Roman Empire & condoned the destruction of all Temples to other Gods. The Christian Bishops set about destroying & looting the Temples & persecuting the remaining people who were not Christians. Posted by Jayb, Saturday, 26 December 2015 8:52:21 AM
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Nick put his finger on something: the similarity of the barbarities between the ISIS fascists and the Japanese fascists during the War. Both regard non-whatevers as sub-human, unter-menschen, to be raped, butchered, used as target or bayonet practice, blown up, machine-gunned, used as 'comfort women' or sex slaves.
Both utter scum. And yes, religion was at the core of both these fascisms: Islam in one case, and Shinto in the other. In both cases, each thought they had the right to rule the world and exterminate whoever didn't/doesn't fit in. I remember finding banknotes in a tin for use by Japanese thugs once they had invaded Australia. I'm pretty sure that my family would have been exterminated if they had, just as I expect to be if Islamists prevail in Australia.
Even as a fairly slow-witted atheist, I can dimly trace the indirect links between Christian teachings (and Greek and Roman notions) and, through the Enlightenment, to my own grab-bag of fuzzy principles. I don't mean the Crusades or the witch-burnings or the extermination of the Cathars, but just the general and imperfect trends: the separation of church and state, the rights of the person (Magna Carta, post-Westphalia, etc.) and the opening-up of the opportunity for people to think for themselves, to offend without fearing death for themselves and their loved ones.
I look forward to the day, if I live long enough, when Muslims can also think for themselves, question the Koran, reject what they think is total bullsh!t and select what they want to live by. Or reject the lot, of course.
Joe