Michael, I shall leave aside all the obvious howlers and lies in your piece. One thing is clear to me after my almost 60 years and it is that until aboriginal people start taking responsibility for their own lives they will not get ahead. Government money and programs cannot and will not heal their woes.

Yes sure, an inherently fair go is on the table; but not if you withdraw into isolated communities as visible as the dark side of the moon; or refuse to send the kids to school!
Rhrosty.

The rubbish you get from the inner city chattering classes.

Aboriginals on settlements, after all their allowances are added receive above the average wage in welfare.

Not only do they have too much money, they are not penalised for non payment of rent, electricity etc.

Half of their problem is too much sit down money to spend on grog, as they have little else to waste our taxes on out there.

Do try a little research Michael, before bleeding all over the place, for false causes.

Dear Saint Michael, is the view from the cross up there any good? Stigmata wounds particularly bad today? Please let me know when you want to come down - the Third World needs the wood.

God helps those who help themselves. These people don't have any intention of helping themselves.

Aboriginal Academics stand to gain too much from their peoples self inflicted misery. If they fix the problem their generous gratuities' will end. We can't let that happen, eh mate! As told to me by one of the Educated Academic Aboriginal that run one of their organizations.

People need to want to help themselves. If people in those camps simply picked up the rubbish strewn everywhere, which would seemingly be quite within their capacity to do so, things would already look a whole lot better.

Forty-odd years ago, I lived with my family in a community up on the Murray. Some years later, I did my Honours research on community development there, and tacked on an income study. I was appalled to discover that the median family income was equal to the Australian median. But the place looked poverty-stricken ! I went over and over the figures, but there they were.

I would like to challenge Michael to pick a 'community' at random and do a thorough income study of it, and also an effort study of the same place, if it were possible. I suspect he may find a mismatch.

Ten-odd years ago (hope springs eternal), my wife and I went back to her community on Lake Alexandrina to try to get projects started, any projects, tree-planting, working in the dairy, on the farm, anything. No go. At a later council meeting, the chairman congratulated everybody on maintaining the CDEP numbers at 52 (almost all adults on the place), and that not a single job had been created in the previous twelve months.

A few years later, when their CDEP program had to close, scurrilous rumour had it that the CDEP members paid themselves out a million dollars in leave entitlements, long-service leave, sick leave pay, etc., and set the debt against the farm. DEEWR, as the debtor of last resort, got saddled with the debt, so they stripped the place of all equipment, tractors, the dairy, silos, etc. Fair enough. Now everybody there is happily unemployable.

In spite of everything, would I do all of that again ?

No.

Joe

We are "comforted by the financial support of the government and our fellow Australians"

What about the billions of dollars for support and comfort taxpayers have forked out to aborigines? What about most Australians who actually work for their money?

Are we to give more to a small group of Australians (massive costs for infrastructure and in situ support services in remote areas) just because they claim a "spiritual link" to the land?

Most aborigines have successfully moved into towns and cities to WORK and live without too much problem.

Have China and Korea spent as much money on their people as Australians have on aboriginal people? Korea wants to get rid of their starving and homeless. How dare Michael Costello compare Australia with these countries!

"Work(ing) out a way how to best spend taxpayers' dollars in general" is no way at all. Enough is enough. If, after 200 plus years, certain Australians haven't left the Stone Age - tough! If they want to continue to live an isolated, dysfunctional life, let them.

I don't see the book being a best seller.

Maybe the indigenous people also have a little "unprocessed trauma" such as Annabel McGoldrick spoke about in her article in relation to the Palestinians and Israeli's a couple days back.

- If anyone in this country has a right to be racist then its them.

Or maybe they're just lazy or don't want to be a part of the society we created on their island.

Who knows...

I actually wanted to respond to the headline for this article about human rights in China, there's more to the story going on there and I think everyone should be made aware of how things play out in the real world.

There definitely are human rights issues going on in China, but the pro-democracy and human rights organisations aren't what they seem.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-08-03/washingtons-fifth-columns-inside-russia-and-china

Indigenous leaders have roundly ignored my attempts as a 'white fella' to get justice for one of their own children as it just appears to be "in the too hard basket" to even raise a protest to the govt, the media, Indigenous bodies and organisations, plus Indigenous politicians on both sides of the political fence.

I would dearly like to be able to identify just one of the many 'respected Indigenous leaders in Australia who I have written to, including the Indigenous NT Chief Minister, have got off their rear ends to take up the fight for a young female Indigenous child effectively unlawfully discriminated against but apathy appears still to be the order of the day! Details will follow this post:

Dear Kirstie
The under described imbroglio details a travesty of justice against an Indigenous family in Ngkurr and Katherine, Northern Territory.
I hope and pray that you and your colleagues of the First Peoples' Congress will do what you can to rectify the sad and unlawful travesty.
I ask that you email me to advise me what, if anything, you intend to do?
For over 3 years I have been trying to get the NT Govt and now the Federal Govt via the Attorney-General's Dept to right a wrong committed against an Indigenous family when a young child was removed from their Dept of Children & Families-approved care and placed by myself, under orders, as a child protection officer in the care of a non-Indigenous woman who self-styled herself as a "traditional grandmother" to the child. In Court this was shown by affidavits to be arrant nonsense but the Magistrate decided to ignore the Act and ordered that the child should be transferred from the capable care of her aunt to a non-family person.
I eventually resigned in disgust at the lack of ANYONE wanting to get involved in this sad travesty of justice.
I hope that you will do what you can to bring this saga to a satisfactory conclusion by raising it with whomever you know that can put pressure on the recalcitrant bureaucracies that essentially want the matter to "be swept under the carpet".
12 Feb 2015 (5 months ago)
to senator.peris,
From:Peter J. Johnson, Director <citizensinitiatedaction@fastmail.fm>To:senator.peris@aph.gov.au, senator.peris@aph.gov.auCc:editor@koorimail.com, Chief.minister@nt.gov.au
Senator N. Peris
Senator for the Northern Territory

Dear Senator

The current NT Chief Minister and his predecessors plus relevant
Ministers plus all NT Indigenous parliamentarians also have not bothered to meaningfully address nor correct this disgraceful injustice.

I hope that you, as Indigenous citizens, may share my outrage?

. . . .and ACTUALLY do something?

Hmmmm, you don't say exactly why the child was removed.

By traditional, do you mean this Grandmother lives as they did before the arrival of the white man?

Why was the child living with the Grandmother in the first place?

Did the Magistrate decide to give the child a chance to live & grow up in the 21st. Century?

More than a century of misinformation and disinformation has manifest veils and layers between many Australians and the First Peoples of this continent.

Effectively, the oppressor has a responsibility to redress to the best of ability the damage - psychosocial and material - to the First Peoples of this nation - who have endured hits on their person, identity that people should not be hit with.

For the record, if you are an Aboriginal and/or Torres Strait Islander aged 15 to 35 years, nearly one in three deaths in this vast age group will be reported as suicide.

The leading cause of death for First Peoples aged 15 to 45 years is suicide.

A third of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander population is marginalised in extreme poverty. In the homeland communities - 'the remote' and regions - Aboriginal communities have been degraded by one government after another - manifest economic inequalities - shanty town existences - this is the making of governments and not of the communities. This is racialisation and racism. Aboriginal communities have the right to social wealth and economic equality, to an equivalency of services that non-Aboriginal communities are availed to. We have a moral obligation to redress wrongs in tangible and real ways - we have done the opposite as the statistical narratives demonstrate and as the failed reductionist policies of one government after another also prove. Of all middle and high income nations with relatively recent colonial oppressor histories Australia, one of the world's wealthiest nations per capita, has the widest divide of all measurable indicators between its First Peoples and the rest of its population. This speaks for itself - and indicts.

Gerry Georgatos

'Is it not too much ..that we afford the same dignity, respect and assistance to our indigenous' Is this guy for real? Not all indigenous are dependent on the Govt. Many work, pay bills, buy their own homes etc. The rest of the 3% of population receive numerous forms of assistance from the Government and are not comparable to those in third world countries, They really have nothing and appreciate anything they get. Which communities in the Kimberly are living in third world conditions? If the reference is to towns where houses are smashed up, beaten up cars everywhere and basically rubbish tip looking, they did that all by themselves. As for the very remote, smaller communities, even though they might live in shanties, as Michael pointed out 'we cannot grasp their spiritual link to land and culture and they cannot just up and leave..' so cant be relocated but they still rely on Govt assistance. If the Govt had an ulterior motive for wanting to move them like- 'mineral deposits', as with the other mines they would receive millions in royalties.
As for Govt spending on 'infrastructure for their future prospects' is there a shortage of housing? Havent heard that one yet.
$30.3 billion funding for 2012-2013'not truly representative..alot of the money for basics that are a right and given to every Australian' Gerry Geogatos. What is our right and what have we all been given? I didnt get it. Come on!

Hi Jodelie,

With respect, you're forgetting that many settlements look like rubbish tips for a reason - none of that junk-food packaging, used Kimbies, busted-up cars, plastic bottles, paper, etc., is Indigenous - it's all been produced by non-Indigenous people. So whose job should it be to clean it all up ? Obviously, non-Indigenous people: they created the problem, they solve the problem. You know it makes sense.

And after all, as many Indigenous people believe, whitefellas not only get their houses free but also get them cleaned up by the Government - you don't see many of their places covered in rubbish, do you ? So that must be why. And if the Government gives whitefellas houses, and cleans them up for free, why not Blackfellas' ?

Seriously, many Indigenous people seem to believe the above: It's amazing that, once a settlement is cleaned up, a lot of what looks like poverty vanishes. In a study I did thirty-odd years ago, I found that at one settlement where I had lived for years, believing that poverty was rife, [rents: between two and six dollars p.w., with some people in arrears by two years], median income was equal to the Australian median. Squalor is commonly confused with poverty.

I remember driving some women into town on a Saturday morning, (I think in 1975), going past a house on the outskirts where the bloke was doing his lawn: the women all looked quite resentful and one said "[Sniff] .... he's got a [ - ] nice yard." I didn't understand why the resentment for many years. Now I think I do.

I hope this helps :)

Cheers,

Joe

Joe. Well said thankyou. I find it very 'unbelievable' for someone to say "A third of aboriginal/ torres straight live in extreme poverty." Unless they are full blood 'first peoples' choosing to live off the land and independently, every aboriginal/TI not gainfully employed receives govt assistance. Dole, medical, housing, schooling the list goes on as does the lists of billions of dollars in funding. For anyone to suggest housing and infrastructure be build to accommodate those who chose to remain in remote areas 'homeland' is stupidity, hypocrisy even. They have chosen to live on the land, remain connected to their old cultures which is their right, but by they must accept some responsibility for themselves. As for those living in townships and cities, their right to 'social wealth and economic equity' is recognized and met. Every opportunity is handed to them to have an education, gain skills for employment same as every one else. Weather or not they make the most of these opportunities or remain defiant and govt dependent is also their choice. Its time to stop playing the victim.

Aboriginal Academics stand to gain too much from their peoples self inflicted misery. If they fix the problem their generous gratuities' will end.
Posted by Jayb, Wednesday, 12 August 2015 12:44:01 PM

So very true!!

The indigenous people of Canada and the U.S.A seem to fare better than our own indigenous people. Their governments let them run casinos and by all accounts they do quite well off them. Since most Aussies would bet on two flies crawling up a wall, maybe our government could take a look at this as a solution.

Hi Toni,

Are you suggesting that casinos should be allowed to operate on (presumably) some larger Aboriginal settlements ? That's an interesting proposition.

Who do you think might be the main clients ? How quick do you reckon the local ATMs would be cleaned out every pension day ?

At the risk of offending god-knows-how many people, do you think there may be incentives (i.e., for the men) if their wives prostituted themselves ? After all, casinos and prostitution are not strangers to each other. Ditto drugs. Ditto, money-laundering.

No, Toni, this may not be the magic bullet. As my son used to say, after he had listened long enough to me and the missus expounding passionately on some Brilliant New Initiative, 'Yes, just add the magic ingredient - effort.'

Effort is indeed the magic ingredient for Aboriginal people. Effort may be the secret wonder-component for things like getting vegetable gardens and orchards and chook-yards going, tree-planting, etc., and even for more immediate tasks, such as feeding one's own kids, cleaning up one's own yard and ultimately getting off one's own arse.

Nobody else can do THAT for them. Effort - the secret ingredient. And it doesn't even need to be patented, or highly funded ! It can be used now ! Today ! And what's even more amazing is that even Blackfellas in remote settlements can actually apply it !

You don't believe it ? Just wait until you use it in action ! At ....... ummmm ........ at ........ give me a minute, I'm sure there must be somewhere where people are actually putting some of it to use.

Nope, can't think of a place. I'll get back to you.

Joe

//Are you suggesting that casinos should be allowed to operate on (presumably) some larger Aboriginal settlements ? That's an interesting proposition.//

Larger Aboriginal settlements? That would be Sydney and Melbourne at a rough guess. I think we already allow casinos to operate in those places.

//Who do you think might be the main clients ? How quick do you reckon the local ATMs would be cleaned out every pension day ?//

Word on the street is that rich Asians love a punt. But that's a bit racist.

//'Yes, just add the magic ingredient - effort.'//

1980, Tennessee:

BJ: Hey Billy-Bob, you heard about them Injun casinos they's getting started up North?
BB: Sure have, Billy-Joe. Why, those casinos will never make no money. Them Injuns is just too darn lazy to work. All they wants to do is sit about drinkin white man's firewater and eatin that peyote of theirs.
BJ: Yep, reckon you're right. Say, what time we gotta leave for our Klan rally?
BB: Well, shucks, I done forgot our Klan rally. We was too busy sat here fishin. Open me another can, would ya?

2015, U.S.A:

Indian casinos are generating annual profits in excess of $25B.

I'm not saying that casinos are the magic bullet. We aren't the U.S. or Canada and the situation is different, but the suggestion that Indigenous people are so disadvantaged compared to non-Indigenous people is because they are inherently lazy is offensively racist bullsh!t.

Hi Toni,

I'm certainly not saying that people are lazy, just that many people may honestly, sincerely, believe they shouldn't have to work, it's their country after all, and whites should work for THEM (I've heard this said).

In other words, a sort of caste system, with 'traditionally-oriented' people, or at least the elders, considered as a sort of Brahmin caste, with whites more like the Untouchables, doing all the work, that's their proper role.

I've probably said it before, but in hunter-gatherer economies, people don't PERCEIVE that they are putting effort into anything, but that the magic, the secrets, of the old men is what delivers food into their hands. OF COURSE, they used to put effort in, but didn't perceive it as such.

Then along comes the Mission system, rations - in fact, rations especially for the people who would have been ignored and expended in hard times in pre-European days, the old women, the very young children - shelter, tea, sugar, tobacco, somebody actually feeding and clothing their kids - sweet !

And then, in the sixties, along comes the welfare system - which, of course, the magic of the old men has brought about (clever men, those old fellas) - and not only you don't have to ever hunt again, unless you have access to a 4WD and rifles and are a bit bored, but they give you money, housing, look after your kids - sweet !

Fifty years of the welfare system has reinforced the notion that, because of the superior knowledge of the old men, they are actually in a privileged position, and that, sooner or later, whites will recognise them as being a superior race, i.e. a separate race, a different species, (yes, I've heard that too), which is immeasurably superior.

Before you jump in, I'm not saying people shouldn't be entitled to the benefits of a welfare system, but that they may interpret that bounty in a different way from what you may expect: that it's actually recognition of their superiority, and that it will last forever.

Joe