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The Forum > Article Comments > Climate change model environmental damage claims are just smoke > Comments

Climate change model environmental damage claims are just smoke : Comments

By Mark S. Lawson, published 9/7/2015

One problem that has dogged the debate on carbon emissions from the beginning has been trying to construct a cost-benefit result that justifies the trouble of major cuts to emissions.

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We've had the forteen hottest years on record and the sun has been in a waning phase since the mid seventies!(NASA)

If that is not manmade climate change what else could be causing it?

And given we have choices that like cheaper than coal thorium or indeed even cheaper biogas, both of which will result in accelerated economic growth? What the hell is the problem? Coal shares?

Explain that to the Grandkids if you can!
Rhrosty
Posted by Rhrosty, Thursday, 9 July 2015 5:15:44 PM
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You are not taking into account the amount of ice melt happening in greenland arctic region. The more ice melt the more C02. Ice melt is increasing and with arctic temps showing 5*c increase, melt is gaining momentum by the day. Some ice mountains 3 km thick.
That goes to show 400 PPm Co2 is already too much.
Glacial flows have increased considerably in the recent past, that says ice under the glacier is softening.
There has been a gigantic lake detected under the Greenland ice by Nasa 3D imaging.
Greenland ice melt on its own can effect sea levels considerably.
Posted by doog, Thursday, 9 July 2015 5:26:40 PM
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Mark Lawson here

Doog - as was pointed out, you're taking all this stuff from activist sites or outliers.. the 5 degree increase bit is highly suspect.. and there is no acceleration in water levels either.. there is some increase but its been steady at non-threatening levels for decades. see the Colorado Uni site http://sealevel.colorado.edu/content/2014rel5-global-mean-sea-level-time-series-seasonal-signals-removed
and no 3.2 mm a year works out to a third of a meter over a century. No hint of this extra melting you talk of.

Rhosty - we're in a warm period, bumping along a plateau so of course there are warm periods. The sun has gone serious quiet in teh past few yeas - not since the 1970s - and in any case, although its known there is a link the details of it are unknown. We're about to find out a great deal more.
Posted by Curmudgeon, Thursday, 9 July 2015 5:52:50 PM
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Mark Steyn on climate change

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEBeF_Rz1MU

Youtube.

Mark Steyn Keynote Speech: Mann for breakfast 10th ICCC


The best thing about climate change, is that it is only a matter of time before a multitude of young and idealistic world savers are going to find out that they were being lied to by the very people they thought were the keepers of the gate of all that was good and holy.
Posted by LEGO, Thursday, 9 July 2015 6:48:19 PM
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Doog since 1985 Antarctic sea ice has increased by 1.8 million square kilometres, more than a little, even you must admit. 1.6 million of that has been in just the last 12 years. Even you must have some difficulty finding a warming signal in that.

Perhaps you have forgotten the very expensive rescue of the ship of fools, caught in the ice they told us didn't exist? I guess some people will believe anything.

At the same time the water temperature, constant for 30 years from 1975 to 2005, has dropped over a quarter of a degree in the last 10 years. It is now 2 degrees below zero, hence the increase in sea ice.

Over land air temperature there has dropped even more than the ocean water temperature, all pretty hard to ignore, unless you play the three monkeys game, & cover your eyes & ears, to avoid data you don't like.
Posted by Hasbeen, Thursday, 9 July 2015 9:02:12 PM
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Arctic sea ice has increased year by year, which is sending up wild and ragged storms from the Antarctic. The sea ice is caused from melting glacial ice, feeding fresh water into the ocean which freezes more readily than salt water.
As soon as the seasons change that sea ice melts and glacial ice melt again commences.
That ship of fools was caught in sea ice ,liquid one day frozen the next. That tells you there was a greater mix of fresh water than salt water.
If the antarctic water temp was 2*C below freezing, the only water that could freeze is fresh water.
If the land air temp over Antarctic was greater than what is required to melt or soften glacial ice, there would not be increasing sea ice, or glacial ice melt.
So it has nothing to do with blinkers or cartoons, just realism.

The ice melt in the Arctic is at a faster rate than in Antarctica, to the extent of changing atmospheric jet streams. Arctic temps have shifted by 5*C
Greenland is melting at a rate never before seen and increasing with every year.
My feeling is that the balance of nature has compromised by 400 PPm Co2 and has now set off a chain reaction that will be impossible to stop.
With industry slowing, and perma frost melting and releasing Co2, What mankind does to limit Co2 will be replaced by Co2 locked up in ice melt
Posted by doog, Friday, 10 July 2015 10:33:45 AM
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