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The Forum > Article Comments > The failings of capital punishment: Indonesia executes the traffickers > Comments

The failings of capital punishment: Indonesia executes the traffickers : Comments

By Binoy Kampmark, published 30/4/2015

Australia's politicians were adamant in mucking in the emotional stakes for Chan and Sukamaran, but indifferent to citizens caught in the so called 'war on terror'.

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Their lives became a political football. Tony Abbott did a grandstand a few months a go and said there would be serious consequences if they were killed. Well wasn't that stirring the pot? The Indonesians have had enough of the British Imperialism and are telling us they won't be pushed around.

If our Govt was intent on saving their lives, this should have been done diplomatically behind closed doors and not threatening dire consequences.

The HSBC gets busted for laundering drug money on more than one occasion.No one is charged.They just get token fines.

Afghanistan under the control of the USA now supplies 90% of the world's heroin. We see pictures on youtube of US soldiers carrying weapons in those poppy fields. They eliminated whole forests with Agent Orange in Vietnam but cannot eliminate exposed poppy fields in Afghanistan.
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 30 April 2015 6:21:35 AM
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Firstly Arjay the British did not occupy Indonesia it was the Dutch. The British gave the Indonesians a bloody nose when Indonesia attacked Malaysia in the 1960's.
We all know what the penalty is and all the bleeding heart nonsense and attacking Tony Abbott is ignored by Indonesia anyway. This only fuels the Indonesian's anger at what they see as our dissolute, corrupt society lecturing them. Today we still have idiots attacking the Federal Police for turning the druggo's in to Indonesia. What we now work with our criminals against other countries and help drug smuggling? Nice little lawyer's picnic, as if they cannot make themselves any richer or more loathsome.
Personally I would legalise all drugs but with the proviso that drugs cannot excuse any actions and rehab providers cannot be a charity.
Posted by JBowyer, Thursday, 30 April 2015 9:55:39 AM
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Their was not 'failure of capital punishment' in this case.

Two criminals will never offend again.
Posted by ttbn, Thursday, 30 April 2015 10:40:10 AM
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JBowyer it was the same European Central Banks who controlled the Dutch and English who were behind. The USA (ie the Ex British) who have intimidated the Indonesians along with Australia. Which Western Countries are in Indonesia sucking off their cheap labour?

Sure the Indonesians are corrupt ,well so are our Govts. Tony Abbott should have said nothing rather than trying to threaten them. Can you see the hypocrisy ?
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 30 April 2015 10:44:00 AM
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Alas Australia still has a white colonialist masters attitude and this helped seal the fate of the two Australians. Abbott is certainly not a diplomat and his efforts must have only inflamed the situation. Also a rabid media more concerned with stiring up trouble and making money than concern about the lives of the two men involved, created more problems for them with increased antipathy from the Indonesians. There were many reasons why the men should have been spared but in the light of the media attention and comments by Abbott to do so would make Joko seem weak. Arrogance has consequences and until Australia tries to understand Asians and learns diplomacy their supremistattitude will only encourage resentment from the region rather than effecting change.
Posted by hospas, Thursday, 30 April 2015 11:00:22 AM
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Wouldn't it be wonderful if these silly children & bleeding hearts could actually grow up a bit, put 2 & 2 together, & see where their attitudes are leading this country.

Thank god there are still countries who stand by the principal that there are those who by their actions have lost the right to precipitate in a civilised society.

At least Indonesia still cleanses their society of those not worthy to be part of any society. Long may it last.
Posted by Hasbeen, Thursday, 30 April 2015 11:12:43 AM
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These people were convicted drug traffickers, no one was questioning their guilt, and everyone knows what they penalties can be in Indonesia.

This only become an issues because the people in question found god in goal and the happy clappers got organised and started lobbing the Pollies. I wonder if they would have lobbied so hard if these guys were peado's

In the end it's easy for Australians not to be executed by Indonesia. Don't smuggle drugs into or out of Indonesia. Its that easy, but if you do then you will be subject to their law, which they have every right to determine for themselves.
Posted by Cobber the hound, Thursday, 30 April 2015 11:25:03 AM
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There is a simple message as an outcome of these executions.

"See what happens if you are stupid enough to smuggle drugs into Indonesia. If you are caught, no one can help you!"
Posted by ConservativeHippie, Thursday, 30 April 2015 12:02:34 PM
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Maybe if we were to apply the same standards and lethal consequences to people trafficking, and for the same reason; namely how many lives it costs, that we know of?

Maybe a people trafficking compliant Indonesia, would finally see just how futile prohibition really is?

Moreover, these men were killed for trafficking drugs through Indonesia to Australia!

And given we are a sovereign nation, and where the actual drugs were actually headed; shouldn't we have had a say how these men were punished.

I saw a film where the alleged crims were tied to the termination poles, then shot at; narrowly missing, rather than actually shot!

With the narrowly missed targets, dying a thousand deaths, and unable however steeled, to keep their composure, when the ricocheting rifle rounds rang out the third time!

I seriously doubt there would have been any recorded recidivism in that particular group of prisoners?

Even so, if there are consequences of a particular action in a particular location, then those taking such action, need to accept all the possible consequences!

We have be fighting a war on drugs for over 70 years! Which has cost more lives than WW11, with the only outcome, even more of it hitting the streets and worryingly, our schools!

And the production of ice only took off, when we successfully created several temporary heroin droughts!

None of that is how you measure success, neither by the massively swelled prison populations/budgets; or the exponentially increasing law enforcement budgets/death tolls; and or, clogged courts!
Rhrosty.
Posted by Rhrosty, Thursday, 30 April 2015 2:13:14 PM
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Well why not apply the same punishment to Wall St Criminals and the too big to fail bankers. They were bailed out and now continue to print our currencies into oblivion.

The real criminals get rort the system and cause enormous human misery. Read 'Confessions of an Economic' by John Perkins and learn how he was paid to corrupt the Govts of poor countries by imposing unpayable debt on them and if all else failed, Govt officials were often assassinated. The big Corps would then get their resources for a song as well as cheap labour.
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 30 April 2015 2:40:13 PM
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Severe punishments are a deterrent to criminal behaviour.

In Australia, public officials bemoan the fact that they can not prevent graffiti damaging public and private property to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars a year. Singapore does not have that problem. Graffiti artists in Singapore were flogged and the problem disappeared.

In the Gulf States, daytime temperatures are so high that people leave their cars in car parks with the engines and air conditioners running while they go into the shopping malls to shop. Car thieves do not exist because any captured car thief will have a leg and an arm chopped off from opposite sides of the body according to Sharia Law.

If the penalty for drug trafficking in Indonesia is death, then you can bet that I am not going to go to Indonesia to traffic in drugs.

The execution of Chan and Sukamaran is an object lesson in any fool thinking of emulating them.
Posted by LEGO, Friday, 1 May 2015 3:39:50 AM
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Two drug mules killed in Indonesia, oh dear oh dear, thousands killed in Iraq in Bush's war, no oh dear oh dear. We are a funny lot.
Posted by Ojnab, Friday, 1 May 2015 4:31:08 PM
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Ojnab ,over a million people were killed in the Iraq war that was based on lies. Less than 4500 US soldiers died. Where are the war crimes tribunals ?
Posted by Arjay, Saturday, 2 May 2015 1:22:16 PM
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Arjay excellent point you made, as mentionedI I do find it hard to justify the outpourings of support by our Government and media for two drug mules, I do understand waiting ten years for their execution is wrong, if for instance they had not been caught they would still be making millions of dollars out of people dependant on drugs in Australia.I do not condone the death penalty though, but that is Indonesian law, so be it.
Government and the media do not have the same reporting feelings for all those killed In Iraq by the USA, they are casualties of war games, so definately ok to be killed.
Governments kill ordinary people and think nothing of it in war, they lay wreaths, speak words of how glorious were they that died, but never ever say we caused their deaths, in a previous post I mentioned Charlie and his Anzac Day speech, how nice it would have been if he mentioned my relatives were a part cause of the problem back then, but no a sanitised report.
Some people get shot for killing others get medals for killing, it is a very strange world.
Posted by Ojnab, Saturday, 2 May 2015 5:19:53 PM
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