Squerrs/Craig Minns,

Sorry, I meant 'Mount Olympus', not the town of Olympia.

Retchtub,

Yes, I was trying to be tactful about single mothers: that they should be provided with opportunities to get out of their difficult situations.

But if they don't actually want to, then what can be done ? Free child care after three years old, free vocational training for the mother leading to a job, perhaps with a bonus when they successfully complete their studies and are in a job - say, $ 5,000. Continued free education in every sense for their child while he or she is going through school, right through to university.

And of course, bugger-all if the mothers don't move themselves.

Surely the aim of any decent welfare system is to get all able-bodied people off it as soon as possible and into employment, perhaps through free vocational education ? What on earth is wrong with that ?

Joe

Perhaps we could give all the billions of dollars spent on unnecessary fireworks for the new year to help the disadvantages, when I see this utter waste of dollars go up in smoke I then tend to refuse any charity,including the hard done by brigade and wanting money who come knocking at my door, go ask those that organise these events for the money they waste, which includes Governments who should know better A party pooper but a sensible thinker.
Children seem to be not wanted by anyone these days, no sooner born than in day care parents not working also placing children in daycare with taxpayer handouts, grandparents having to look after them, not the parent, forget about the second Land cruiser and look after your kids, or if they are a bother refrain from having any Unmarried mothers for goodness sake get on the pill and men use condoms, but then pigs might fly. The me society and what I can get from the taxpayer.

Dear Joe,

<<Surely any moves to reduce child neglect...>>

Please go no further - I am already wary of any such moves.

Who is to decide what "neglect" is? While it could refer to what you and I may agree are some of the worst child-care practices, those who are biased, prejudiced or simply ignorant, might also refer by this term to anything outside the norm, including the best of practices.

I am happily willing to hear and evaluate suggestions for helping single mothers who agree that they are having difficulty raising their children, provided that they consent to receiving help in that area (from the body that offers it).

Without such consent, I rather have 1000 children starving due to parent-neglect than to have one baby-sage with a potential to develop into a Jesus or a Buddha, be suppressed and turned by the system into an ordinary neurotic frustrated slave of the Western shallow material fashion.

<<but once their child is in FREE child care and they care able to devote time to study.>>

And what guarantee do you have that once the generous child-care relieves them of their duties, they won't use that time to instead beget further children? Or that their friends won't follow their example and have their own babies on the assumption of free child-care? People should not be helped to forget that rearing children is a huge burden which should be avoided if they cannot afford it. This is especially true in cities: children are meant to grow up in open spaces, close to nature and close to their parents, learning from seeing how they do their work - raising children in cities and by commuting parents does not do them any favour, in fact I consider it a neglect.

(continued...)

(...continued)

<<surely the aim should be to get them out of it as soon as possible.>>

However, it is NOT possible. People get into holes in order to learn something - until they have learned their lesson, if you take them out of their hole, they would soon find another similar hole where they can complete their lesson.

<<Single mothers are probably no less intelligent than anybody else:>>

Those who swapped their brains with their genitals, now their genes are intelligent while they have become fools. Those intelligent genes would seize any opportunity to avoid hard study and work if instead they find further opportunities to multiply.

<<Surely the aim of any decent welfare system is to get people out of welfare and on their feet, as soon as possible?>>

I disagree. People would not get on their own feet until they have learned their lesson and are spiritually ready to proceed into the next phase of life.

Some of the aims of the welfare system that I identify are:
1. Provide unconditional food/shelter security, in order to reduce the general anxiety.
2. Compensate for the compulsion to live in civilisation and use money.
3. Reduce dependence on employers, especially employers who make immoral/unethical/unhealthy demands.
4. Provide public safety by preventing rampage of crimes by hungry desperate people.

rehctub,

As I've said above, I don't believe in ideal parents. I try to give my kids the benefit of my experience, but this requires real honesty and not merely the perpetuation of social norms. This might not be the best preparation for the kinds of lives they are more or less obliged to follow, but they are at least armed with multiple perspectives rather than mindless conformity.
My wife and I also have to make sacrifices and lead a modest lifestyle in order to foster the accomplishments I believe kids are best armed with. But I also urge self reliance and my three eldest all work part-time while at school and uni.
We spend thousands a year too, but if we can do it on our very slender means, so can most anyone else, especially if they give up the booze/drugs/cigarettes, tattoos and other trappings of Western 'poverty'.
This is not to defend our system, which is responsible for our pathological decadence in the first place. As I say, there are no viable alternative lifestyles available, but hopefully my kids will add theirs to other dissenting voices, and otherwise live vibrantly on the margins of our collective sleepwalk.

Joe,
perhaps in an effort at dumbing OLO down you should start punishing anyone who says anything too thoughtful?

Sorry Squeers, I won't be following your example: "you should start punishing anyone who says anything too thoughtful". Back to your Olympian cave !

Yuyutsu,

If you have to ask what 'neglect' is, then you would never know. Get out a bit, when you see it, you'll know it.

And where do you get the idea that " .... People get into holes in order to learn something" ? In respect of this particular hole, people et into one either through thoughtlessness or calculation, either way ending up as a single mother. I don't think they intend to learn anything, ever.

As for your weird list of reasons to pander to the welfare population, your list begs so many questions:

"Some of the aims of the welfare system that I identify are:

1. Provide unconditional food/shelter security, in order to reduce the general anxiety.
2. Compensate for the compulsion to live in civilisation and use money.
3. Reduce dependence on employers, especially employers who make immoral/unethical/unhealthy demands.
4. Provide public safety by preventing rampage of crimes by hungry desperate people."

If they are not simply gratuitous insults on society, a gaggle of zombie straw-men, perhaps you could substantiate some of these, before you rely on them as justification for ever-more welfare ? Are you, or have you ever been, a social worker by any chance ?

Joe