True independent studies reveal AGW and Kyoto and IPCC science have not measured and assessed photosynthesis-linked warmth in ocean algae plant matter proliferated by unprecedented sewage and land use nutrient overload pollution, therefore the dumping of fossil fuel investment is not based on complete science.

With the Greens there will be no more smelting of metal and, as well, we'll use up every tree on the planet just to keep warm.

While I agree with Kurti's opposition to the actions of the Anglican synod in regards to investment in fossil fuels I am appalled at his using Evan Pederick's past in his article. This is nothing but the kind of slur that cheap newspapers are familiar with. It is also way off the point to accuse the synod of trying to shmooze young people with its actions in order to reverse its falling membership. As a researcher and priest Kurti should know better.

I'm not sure whether this article's deliberately deceptive or just plain stupid! Fossil fuel's not a particularly good investment anyway, and its cost advantages over renewables not only depend on externalities being ignored, but also on a lack of cheap finance for renewables (as excluding capital cost, renewables already beat fossil fuels).

While it is rather optimistic to claim that "any effective divestment strategy would not simply threaten the existence of the industry" (as it wouldn't have much effect on existing mines), it's renewables, not fossil fuels, that are putting downward pressure on electricity prices. And the main thing that's making electricity so expensive isn't the generation anyway, it's the poles and wires – with a charging regime that penalises efficiency and charges again for infrastructure that's already been paid for.

And why should the church care how many coal mining jobs are available? Surely what counts is total job availability, not just job availability in one part of the mining industry?
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JF Aus, Even if the science is incomplete, the evidence is so strong that it would be unreasonable not to reach the conclusion that something must be done.

I'm a bit puzzled by your reference to sewage, though – I thought underwater volcanoes were the main source of nutrients in the ocean?
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d'Helm, try basing your comments on facts rather than stereotypes!

' But as church attendance drops, so too does the size of the Sunday collection put in the plate each week. The church is desperate to connect with a younger generation of people and to stem the drift away from church life. '

Interesting enough even if you reach the young warmist believers they are highly unlikely to be the sacrificial type to give. They along with thier High Priests, Gore etc are takers. Warmist as a whole expect the tax payer to fund their propaganda and pay for the fossil fuels they burn up while living in luxury and flying the globe. The 'progressive'church has by and large rejected biblical morality so need to replace it with self righteous indignation of the false Green religion.

There are better more profitable energy investments!
Rhrosty.

Sections 4.9 & 4.10 of the bullet point summaries of the human created world situation via this remarkable book
http://www.dabase.org/not2p1.htm state:

"Altogether, there are two now-global forms of dependency which must be gone beyond: dependency on fossil fuels and dependency on animal protein as food.

Both of these dependencies have broad political, social, and economic implications, and both are associated with conglomerates of corporate power which wield a great deal of influence."

So perhaps the actions of both the Anglican church and the ANU are a step in the right direction.

Meanwhile the CIS is of course a propaganda machine/outlet for the conglomerates of corporate power that now wield a great deal of power - the situation is thus briefly described in paragraph 1.46:

"The power of industry and money has actually become senior to the power of governments, and is now controlling the entire world"

As a matter of interest the author points in the last chapter of this book that wide-spread global poverty will always be a feature of the human world, and that the continued prosperity of the relative few comes at the expense of others, and in fact depends on the suffering and exploitation of others.

It is interesting to note that Peter Kurti has an essay in the new November issue of Quadrant Magazine lamenting the pernicious influence of the advocates of "aggressive" secularism.

For better or worse the now world-dominant secular/materialist world view has effectively destroyed most/all of up until now existing forms of religion and especially whatever sacred culture that existed as an extension of that religion.

From another perspective the philosophy and culture promoted by now-time secular/materialists is primarily an adolescent phenomenon. Whereas old time father-knows-best patriarchal religion is essentially a childish, even infantile phenomenon.

The adolescents have of course inevitably defeated the children and infants.

Sacred Culture only comes into being, and is thus sustained by a Living Spiritual Tradition. Such a Living Spiritual Tradition does not exist in the Western world, and has not done so for a very long time now.
There are of course various rear-guard gestures at trying to restore a Sacred Culture in the West. Such was and is the efforts of right-wing conservative "catholics" beginning with the recent popes: JPII, Benedict and now Francis.
Needless to say their patriarchal father-knows-best ultra-reactionary deeply misogynist world-view, manifest in the form of opus dei and similar back-to-the-past "traditionalist" outfits is THE essential problem - such outfits being forms of collective psychosis as demonstrated by the graphic images to be found here:
http://spiritlessons.com/passionofchristpictures.htm

Matthew Fox described the situation in his book The Pope's War Against the Church - it was once favorably reviewed on this forum.

Of course the tragic irony is that it is the capitalist world-machine and its now world-wide "culture" of death that IS the leading edge form of the secular culture that Peter Kurti decries. It is also the leading edge vector which has, by its very nature inevitably destroyed all forms of traditional Sacred Culture.

It must be hard for members of a dying organisation to be struggling to find some relevancy in the modern world.

It is typical that they would reach out & grab the coat tails of another dying group, the global warming fraud perpetuators. Desperation gathers strange bedfellows.

I guess this will help to finally kill off the Anglican church, just a little more quickly.

The Anglicans and Uniting Church are Christians in name only, many of the congregations are simply made up of leftists and "progressives" who don't even believe in god, to them Jesus is more a secular idealogue than a spiritual being.
What they really resemble are Pagans, they profess Christian beliefs yet still hold onto secular, materialist traditions such as "social justice".
Justice Versus Social Justice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOp1GOL3skU&list=UU6TJdRrZR_WacbxJWiRZ5_g

So the Revolt Against Reason hasn't prevailed against the Enlightenment in the civilised world. Isn't making much headway in the Islamic world either.

Sells
My first reaction to the mention of Pederick’s past was the same as yours – it’s a vicious and gratuitous ad hominem. On reflection, I’m not so sure, though. Pederick’s participation in the bombing was linked to his association with the religious cult Ánanda Márga, which had rather idiosyncratic views on ecology. It is not therefore unrelated to the question of his advocacy of environmentalism through the pulpit – which he does often, according to his website.

I agree, though, that Peter Kurti’s attack on motives is wide of the mark. I have no doubt the eco-theology activists are sincere and well meaning, not cynically trying to attract a younger congregation. I just think they’re wrong.

Jay -
Why do you link to the silly rants of someone who doesn't even know what social justice is?
Social justice is giving everyone a fair go. That's something that all Christians should support.

, Social justice is giving everyone a fair go ' very sweeping statement Aidan. One could only assume you include the unborn babies in this statement and the right for the Jews to live in their homeland in peace.

Aidan,
In the first minute of the video Aurini said you'd say that ;)
Social Justice in theory is very different to Social Justice in practice, people lie, steal and break the law all the time in the name of Social Justice, just ask Frances Abbott.
Social Justice Warriors are fanatics unrestrained by laws, social norms or any sense of subordination to an authentic concept of a greater good, the "Left" in Australia in 2014 is comprised of the Anglican and Methodist churches and so called "moderate" Muslims.
Two examples of negative christian activism.
The Christians in question would throw open the borders to every guttersnipe from the third world who could shoehorn himself onto a rubber raft and make it into Australia's search and rescue zone and damn the consequences.
The spread of Islam and the proliferation of Mosques in our cities and towns is being facilitated and defended by the Anglican and Uniting churches through land sales to Islamic organisations and aggressive campaigning and lobbying of councils.

Speaking of the road to hell, but in this case deliberate and deeply unambiguously bad intentions a certain lying rodent told the people of Australia some very obvious lies which lead to the situation described in the book Erasing Iraq The Human Cost of Carnage http://erasingiraq.com

For his services to the coalition of the KILLING and its very deliberate killing of the people of Iraq (dismissed as "collateral damage'), and the systematic and destruction of its infrastructure he was awarded the "freedom" medal by the village idiot from Texas.
As far as I know this lying rodent has not offered one iota of a trace of public remorse for what he helped to set in train. He is also regarded as an "elder statesman" by certain sections of the Australian populace. Apparently he cant even begin to understand why some people he meets out in the public (quite rightly) call him a war criminal.

And of course the shock-and-awe invasion of Iraq triggered off most/all of the chaos and terror in the Middle East and Afghanistan and the now everywhere threat of global terrorism, with its Orwellian double-speak never-ending "war on terror" - war is of course organized and even systematic terror.

And of course part of the lying rodents toxic legacy which will most probably last forever is that caused by the use of depleted uranium. Why not google the topic, and view some of the horrific images too.

Jay –
"In the first minute of the video Aurini said you'd say that ;)"
No he didn't.
"Social Justice in theory is very different to Social Justice in practice, people lie, steal and break the law all the time in the name of Social Justice, just ask Frances Abbott."
What makes you say that was in the name of Social Justice? I thought it was done in the name of The Public Interest. And I'm pretty sure it is in the public interest to expose the fact that she was given a sixty thousand dollar scholarship because she was the daughter of the leader of the Liberal Party.
"Social Justice Warriors are fanatics unrestrained by laws, social norms or any sense of subordination to an authentic concept of a greater good, the 'Left' in Australia in 2014 is comprised of the Anglican and Methodist churches and so called 'moderate' Muslims."
Considering the Methodist church in Australia hasn't been around for decades (having merged with the Congregationalists and some of the Presbyterians to form the Uniting Church of Australia) your claim is very dubious. And who are these "social justice warriors"?

"The Christians in question would throw open the borders to every guttersnipe from the third world who could shoehorn himself onto a rubber raft and make it into Australia's search and rescue zone and damn the consequences."
A much better response than locking them up in concentration camps. And I'm pretty sure there's a strong biblical basis for showing kindness to foreigners, though I can't find a reference at the moment.

"The spread of Islam and the proliferation of Mosques in our cities and towns is being facilitated and defended by the Anglican and Uniting churches through land sales to Islamic organisations and aggressive campaigning and lobbying of councils."
Do you think the 2% of our population who are Muslim should be denied a fair go?

You have got to hand it to the Anglican Church. What they need is a new generation of moralising social puritans who ignore scientific method to push religious dogma. The Green demographic suits that purpose rather admirably. All the Anglicans have to do to turn these pagans away from worshiping Gaia, is to worship Gaia themselves and claim that worshiping Gaia is "Christianity."

The whole question of man made influence in global temperatures is coming apart at the seams. What we have on one side of the scientific debate are climate scientists who claim from computer modelling that global warming is essentially man made, and the geologists with hard, physical evidence that global temperatures are independent of carbon dioxide levels. The weight of evidence seems to be on the side of the geologists since Global temperatures have not risen for 17 years.

The scientific debate is not over, so claiming that "science" supports the religious conviction that man is killing Gaia by burning fossil fuels is drawing a long bow.

What are you invested in Rhosty? I've been interested to know since reading your comments on energy etc. If you don't mind me asking.

@ Aiden on page 1.
“JF Aus, Even if the science is incomplete, the evidence is so strong that it would be unreasonable not to reach the conclusion that something must be done.”

“I'm a bit puzzled by your reference to sewage, though – I thought underwater volcanoes were the main source of nutrients in the ocean?”

Evidence is strong indicating that human influence is changing climate somewhere sometimes but not globally at the same time.
Evidence is not strong about emissions and CO2 being the cause, or that emission reduction is a solution.

Yes, something must be done but the correct solution must be applied.

Nobody should be puzzled by sewage waste from 7 billion humans dumped daily into the water ecosystem of this planet.
Sewage is loaded with nutrients bonded to fresh water that tends toward the surface on entering ocean salt water.
Prevailing winds drive surface water long distances.
Onshore winds press the surface nutrient loading against coastlines where tides draw nutrients into estuaries, where seagrass nurseries are supposed to produce small fish that form the fundamental supply of food for big fish and animals in the ocean.
Nutrient over-loading is proliferating algae-epiphyte growth on seagrass leaf that is shutting down photosynthesis, killing most seagrass worldwide.

Volcanoes and other sources of nutrients add to the nutrient loading.

Some species of macro and micro algae are now so prolific and dense that change to water colour can be seen.
Look for the more dense green colour more often in coastal waters, including the green more often in ocean waves in surfing videos.

Microscopic algae is now so dense it can even be seen from satellites, pinpoints of cloud and weather forming above and even parallel to algae is also apparent.
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/NaturalHazards/view.php?id=40716

It’s time all governments and corporations and faith’s looked into solutions to impact of food and arable land shortage.
Whole world ocean seafood supply is no longer sustainable, yet affordable food and living is vital.

There is need for unity and teamwork to discuss and implement real solutions instead of engaging in fake CO2 trading and war.

runner –
"Social justice is giving everyone a fair go ' very sweeping statement Aidan."
Of course it is! A very sweeping concept demands a very sweeping explanation!

"One could only assume you include the unborn babies in this statement and the right for the Jews to live in their homeland in peace."
Your assumption would be correct, though I may disagree with you on how to achieve this.
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JF Aus –
Most of the sewage waste from humans is not dumped into the water ecosystem of the planet. And while I concur that that which is is a serious problem for seagrass, have you any evidence for the claim that it's "killing most seagrass worldwide"?

I notice the photo you linked to had a lighter colour where the algae were. Doesn't this suggest it has a cooling effect, contradicting your original point?

Aidan,
Methodism and "moderate" Islam are the only two real ideological movements in Australian society at present, the Salvation Army and Uniting Church are both Methodist and they're the main players on the Christian side.
Muslims who are friends with Jews and Judaised Christians aren't really Muslims, so no they don't deserve a fair go because they're impostors. The real Muslims are the fundamentalists who segregate themselves from society and I don't have a problem with them because they think and act the way normal people do, ie they keep to themselves.
The spread of Islam in Australia owes much of it's success to co-operation with Anglicans an Methodists and to a lesser extent the Catholic church, the churches are selling them land and buildings for their Mosques and schools.

Aidan,
Most humans on this planet live within a water ecosystem that has a water supply and a water table. Water used by humans does not just vanish. Even long-drop toilets have some water flow through during rain. The nutrient loading can accumulate but eventually rain and runoff and the water table flow takes long drop nutrients away to sea level at least.

There is very considerable and various irrefutable evidence sewage nutrient overload has already killed most seagrass worldwide. Killed, not killing.
For example here in space and time available, consider that sewage is dumped daily.
Impact of over fertilizing plants is known, unmanaged daily fertilization is preposterous. Hydroponics use strictly regulated amounts.

Damage to seagrass and areal loss can be seen immediately downstream from city sewage outfalls.
Older people know what was there before and can see the loss.
Fresher water current flow can be seen moving away from outfall areas. Photographs show a virtual slick formed by fresher water on the ocean surface.

As for the amount of seagrass lost already I suggest note the section on seagrass in the initial State of the Marine Environment Report (1996) (Leon Zann). However government dumped sewage was not and is still not being seen as the fundamental excess nutrient loading source .

The lighter colour in that mid water Bering Sea algae is because the species is coccolithaphore that has a silica shell instead of being totally chlorophyll green plant matter. The latter can be seen flowing north against the coast of Alaska, in Bering Sea and Arctic waters where sea ice is reported melting more than usual. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/16/Bering_Strait.jpeg

Based on evidence of substance I think cooling occurs when sunlight is lost during night or due to cloud shading sunlight, and I think this could be reason for the anomaly in AGW ocean temperature measurements.

Dumping fossil fuel investment is a waste of time and a distraction to real solutions now so urgently required.

This is of course the same Diocese which has decided to hold its Synod in Mindarie for the next three years. Never mind the cost in fossil fuels to get everyone up there as there is effectively no public transport on the week end! I suspect all the clergy and lay members from the southern regions will be missing next year for most of the time.

Besides, the diocesan trustees are not required to abide by Synod resolutions, they are independent and will make their decisions on solid financial grounds. In short, another piece of grandstanding by people who only like to see their name in the papers.

"Ageing church members are dying off, leaving empty pews that are not being filled by new parishioners".

So who is replacing them in the management of the business?