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Stiglitz broadens the horizon : Comments
By Allison Orr, published 8/7/2014Instead, Stiglitz argues that we need new, better, more sophisticated metrics to measure our economies, metrics that consider the real cost and value of things.
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Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 9 July 2014 7:26:53 PM
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Well Allison has certainly got the economic illiterates onside.
"Measure the real value of things." What is that supposed to mean? Of course the translation of this leftist-speak is "force my values onto everyone who doesn't agree with me." Interestingly enough Allison doesn't even propose any alternative set of values.The only thing she contends for is that values should not be based on agreement (markets) and should be based on unprovoked aggression (policy); without any reason given for thinking this would be ethically or pragmatically better. Allison, value always means (one or more persons) preferring one thing more than another. High value means very much preferred. Low value means not much or not preferred. Value is subjective and for this reason, it can't be measured. In terms of numbers, value is always ordinal (1st, 2nd, 3rd), not cardinal (1, 2, 3). You can't get a kilogram of happiness, and you can't measure human satisfaction in any cardinal units. Allison and Stiglitz, having confirmed and declared that the use of measurements to represent true human welfare or wellbeing is hopelessly inadequate, then say we need new and better "metrics". But what is a metric but another word for measurement? They have not begun to come to terms with the problem they have identified, and are only chasing their own tail. And then because they are so dumb they can't understand what they are talking about, they just assume everyone else can't either! Allison's is a plea for intellectual and v Posted by Jardine K. Jardine, Wednesday, 9 July 2014 8:01:07 PM
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Good post Incomiucardo.
<< Governments such as ours keep spruiking GDP >> Yes, and in order to keep GDP growing, we keep the population growing, at a quite massive rate…. which of course is just completely self-defeating, as it is also growing the rate of demand for all resources, services and infrastructure, and reducing our ability to develop a sustainable society. The worship of GDP and continuous growth is extremely bad news for our future. Posted by Ludwig, Wednesday, 9 July 2014 8:18:49 PM
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jadine/quote..<<..Allison,..value always means/>>
VALUES AS PERCEIVED/BY THE EYE-OF/THE BEHOLDER [IE/ITS/EMOTIONAL/PERSONAL/generalizations ensure general values but specific's evolve specific values/LIKE A CALCULATOR/might bbe worth 50 bucks/but if it came with proof stiggie used it/it might be worth 55 bucks[to some]..or 200 to other/but the proving of the value/then finding te one/appreciating/its worth. like the worth of jardines info <<..preferring one thing/more than another....>> for a reason/both for and against[like currently with rolf/harras/his art now is halved/but in time may rise/for the most unexpected reasoning <<>>High value means very much preferred.>> usually desired by many/but affordable to few exclusivity/like the last bottle or grange/hermitpee <<>.Low value means not much or not preferred.>> I/LIVE-OUT/OF\RUBBISH-BINS I PICKED UP 300 DOLLARS OF MEAT TONIGHT yet it was out\of date/not off/yet it was thrown out for me thats real value/but for you thats replulsive <<>>Value is subjective..and for this reason,..it can't be measured...In terms of numbers,..value is always ordinal>> ordered/by degrees of preferences/meNtaly rating <<>>(1st,2nd,3rd),>> to there/i felt.i-was following.but <<>.not cardinal(1,2,3).>> that flummoxed-me.[i didnt/see its/value] <<..You can't get/a kilogram\of happiness,>> but/you get it\by the second/moment/minute/day or/by incident/accident/or coincident..ie-[<<.by its relitive/measure] <<..and you can't/measure human satisfaction..in any cardinal units.>> PLEASE/CLARIFY>? <<.Allison and Stiglitz,\having confirmed/and declared..that the use of measurements../.to represent true human welfare..\..or wellbeing is hopelessly inadequate,..then[THEY]..say we need new..and better "metrics".>> ME-TRICKS? meta-indicies? metronomic falicies? <<.But what is a metric>> good question metric-,<<..but another word\for measurement?...> <\They have not begun to come to terms with the problem they have identified,\and are only\chasing\their own tail.>> And then because they are so dumb\they can't understand what they are talking about,\they just assume everyone else.\can't either!>> EVERYTHING/HAS/BECOME..so..personalized whats/the Stiglitz-theoRY\on\eco-theory <<>>Allison's is a plea..for intellectual..>> its all theory/they amit/to making it up the fed reserve/has had 20 policies in 14 months <<and v> indicates/to ME/MUCH-MORE/TO\BE-SAID. Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 9 July 2014 9:08:30 PM
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joe/my metrics study
A Metric can be considered as:[1] * additive - the total cost of a path is the sum* of the costs of individual links along the path, * concave - the total cost of a path is the minimum* of the costs of individual links along the path, * multiplicative - the total cost of a path is the product* of the costs of individual links along the path. the metriC/NET-WORK http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrics_(networking) http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/metric Definition of METRIC 1 plural : a part of prosody that deals with metrical structure 2 : a standard of measurement <no metric exists that can be applied directly to happiness — Scientific Monthly> 3 : a mathematical function that associates a real nonnegative number analogous to distance with each pair of elements in a set such that the number is zero only if the two elements are identical, the number is the same regardless of the order in which the two elements are taken, and the number associated with one pair of elements plus that associated with one member of the pair and a third element is equal to or greater than the number associated with the other member of the pair and the third element Examples of METRIC 1. <according to the usual metrics by which we judge fiction, this novel is an utter failure> Origin of METRIC Greek metrikē, from feminine of metrikos in meter, by measure, from metron measure — more at measure First Known Use: 1760 Related to METRIC Synonyms bar, barometer, benchmark, criterion, gold standard, grade, mark, measure, standard, par, touchstone, yardstick Related Words case, example, instance; average, norm, rule; acme, apex, meridian, peak, pinnacle, summit, zenith Near Antonyms aberration, abnormality, deviation more Other Mathematics and Statistics Terms abscissa, denominator, divisor, equilateral, exponent, hypotenuse, logarithm, oblique, radii, rhomb Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 9 July 2014 11:13:11 PM
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Hello Ludwig
There can be “intensive” and “extensive” economic growth, where intensive growth mainly occurs due to increasing GDP per capita, and extensive growth mainly occurs due to population increase. There is a serious difference between the two for our medium to long term future. If any economist mentions economic growth, they should be stating whether they mean intensive or extensive growth. Australia has achieved very little intensive growth, and GDP per capita has not risen substantially over the years, and in some quarters it actually decreases. Most of Australia’s economic growth is due to extensive growth only, and as this article mentions, during 3.5 years Australia only achieved 0.53% increase in GDP per capita, which is almost negligable. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-14/bourke-mirage-economics/3889118 So most of our so-called growth is "extensive" growth only, while extensive growth is non-sustainable, as resources will inevitably run out. And Australia is losing biocapacity at the rate of about 1% per year, and likely to hit “overshoot” between 2020 to 2030. At that point Australia is living on borrowed time, and increasingly, as we will have to live on the resources of other countries. My philosophy whenever my local MP mentions “growth”, I to write to them and ask them whether they mean “intensive” or “extensive” growth. As yet, not one MP has ever had any idea of what I am talking about, which doesn’t bode well for Australia’s future. Posted by Incomuicardo, Thursday, 10 July 2014 11:40:05 AM
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it seems warren mundine has invented the mundane index
ie hes going to present his thought bubble/at g20\to some sectarie
as i understand it[he said at some israel/aussie thing today
THE PLAN iS TO RATE [PEOPLE/OR THINGS?]/FROM TRIPLE A/TO TRIPPLE Z
I REALLY Am WORRIED/SO MUCH BETTER STUFF MUaNDANE COULD SPEAK OF
aND\HES GOING TO RATE BLAckfellas 86 different ways
[[excluding the abo/and the dvo]
talk about discrimination
anyhow all the best to te tripple ass
from a tripe u..working on beciming an imf
or a bmw..or an rsvp/pss..
this g 20
do i THE BSA/..need do a chogm/yet again
to try to cause the spovereign people to introduce the forein exchang
[eie the wikiseed/wikigeld/the first peoples money*[based on the promise to pay of seed [living seed]\seed from the tree of life/our own money sytm/we dont ned whitefella way/we do it abo way
[abo=alpha/beta-origonal[way\]
from the ground up/not top down/you bank a dollar and get credIT FOR TWO
BANK TEN BILLION GET CREDIT FOR 20 BILLION
we have half upfront/you have twice the spend
and its intrest free/put in more get double back[the johan*nine~trible index]
we will restore all that destroyed by war/globally finance our own rebuilding[we are all decendant from our ancestors[we are al abo/abo=the mean.warren*
the mindane mean
avo/and below/we are watching you/for posable threat
who knows
what else we got
the happyness index[you should hear te happy ghould ripping souls to sheds
yes happy ness/but also/safety/but not to the point of sic