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The Forum > Article Comments > Evolutionary science isn't a closed book > Comments

Evolutionary science isn't a closed book : Comments

By Hiram Caton, published 2/9/2005

Hiram Caton argues as part of the debate on natural selection, maybe introduce intelligent design at tertiary level.

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A copy-cat of powerful BIG allies is a very IT of a local political life.

That is why publication in Sunday Herald Sun was of no surprise:

<"Science is still hazy about the origins of the universe"
BRYAN PATTERSON FINDS MUCH TO SUPPORT A CONTROVERSIAL THEORY
Sunday Herald Sun, 04-09-2005, Ed: 1 - FIRST, Pg: 037, 736 words , OPED2

HONESTLY, you would have to be awestruck to believe the universe came about by cosmic accident. You would have to marvel at the complexity and beauty of a natural order made by blind fate. But marvelling is not thinking. An alternative theory – that the organization of our world is evidence for God’s existence-seems more compelling. ...>

A question remains, which GOD should be used as reference if children from different backgrounds attend government schools in a secular state having proclaimed segregation between political and religious powers.
Posted by MichaelK., Monday, 5 September 2005 1:46:09 PM
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Talking to a fellow mum on the train to work today, she said; "If (insert name of religious private school here) starts teaching ID in science, I'm marching my kids right out of there. If its taught in religion, no problem." I agreed, but am less concerned that my kids secular public school would teach ID as science. I think you will find most parents feel the same way unless they have chosen a fundamentalist Christian school. So the argument is probably irrelevant, parents won't let it happen.
I am no scientist but the theory of evolution makes intuitive sense to me, that doesn't make it fact, just believable until we find out more. I have no idea about a 'creator", maybe there is one, maybe there isn't, but doubt we'll ever be able to prove it, the way we keep finding concrete fossil evidence for evolution. Scientists debate stuff all the time, like global warming/global dimming etc, but they do it based on knowledge and evidence rather than a faith they were taught from birth. Lets leave science as science and religion as religion.
Posted by enaj, Monday, 5 September 2005 4:56:46 PM
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I share an above response but < ”…If its taught in religion, no problem.” I agreed, but am less concerned that my kids secular public school would teach ID as science. I think you will find most parents feel the same way unless they have chosen a fundamentalist Christian school. So the argument is probably irrelevant, parents won't let it happen > sounds a bit different to me in a general context.

A main reason for any schooling is establishing the basis for further manipulating of the predominant majority of “free participants in democratic processes”. In environment where a half of the Australians already have reading problems (see a related article in the same volume of The Sunday Herald Sun mentioned) it cannot be underestimated.

If the sacred was a basic stone of the science upon the history, the Earth still rests on the elephants as King Saud's decree had proclaimed not so far ago,circa 1997.

Moreover, a relevance of a core concern my last message had expressed upon, that is a de-facto intentionally divisive process, which is placing the elementary education on particular religion's ideas while educating children of different faiths, does not look irrelevant during this discussion at all
Posted by MichaelK., Monday, 5 September 2005 6:08:32 PM
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Has anyone observed anything evolving in his or her children lately? Believe me, Ive noticed a batman syndrome developing in my grandson.

In 400 - 600 years we will run out of avgas so we will not have the fuel to transport numbers of people by flight. We'll be ground bound. The new development is to grow giant batlike wings. The gene hasbeen in past creatures and retained in some existing species. The fact is we must expect and involve ourselves in the activity that will develop appropriate gene.

Diet should consist of Albatross wings, bird bones ground fine so we absorb genetic fibres of their frame. So we do not grow feathers we must consume large amounts of fruit bats, mice, webs of ducks feet. Women - be warned their child could appear with wings, squawk like a bird be born in firm calcified shell the husband will take time incubated.

Exercise programme should be jumping of heights until enough muscle strength is evolved and body weight reduced. Base jumping is banned but those performing such feats are on the move, let us join them before we become the next zoo display.

I happened to be talking to my daughter about dreams only to find she dreams of flying. I'd said it was ego, but have changed my mind she inherited this flight gene. Exciting stuff this evolving. A friend when I offered to help her move said, "You are an angel" so I'm now beginning to believe I am evolving.

As a child I could jump off the roof of the house or sheds after retrieving balls. Seven years ago I fell 3.5 meters of a building and spent seven months off work with a fixator on my severed arm. Small damage, because the gene is developing. This is how evolution works it is important that we persevere for about 1,000,000 years and one human will ultimately leave this earth on wings. My prediction is firmly based in evolutionary science. This is not a religious belief.

So go jump!
Posted by Philo, Monday, 5 September 2005 9:13:04 PM
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A simple introduction to Intelligent Design Theory for the uninitiated:

Q. If an archeologist comes across a piece of rock that may be an ancient tool, how does he tell if the instrument is in fact a tool?
A. He looks for evidence of design.

Likewise, a detective investigating an apparent acidental death will look for any evidence that perhaps the death was not accidental (maybe it was murder or suicide). He looks for evidence of planning and intelligent action.

In a similar way, astronomers searching for life in outer space focus their search on signs of intelligence such as the transmission of a non-random code.

You could do a similar thing right now. Ask yourself, does the computer you are using show evidence of intelligent design? How could you recognize if something were designed if nobody had been there to see its beginning? Notice also, that if you conclude that the computer you are using is designed you don't suddenly become "unscientific" about how a computer works. Knowledge of the origin of something and knowledge about its operating mechanisms are two different things.

None of these activities I have just described can be said to be looking for an easy way out or for a mystical explanation for "gaps" in our human knowledge. They are sincere and practical attempts to discern if intelligence is at work. Very simply, this is all that Intelligent Design Theory attempts to do when considering the origin of life and the universe. It simply asks the question, "Is what we see in the galaxies and in our genes likely to have been designed?" By asking such a question, I don't suddenly become unscientific in my understanding of how things work, but I do open mywelf up to the possibility that there may have been an originating intelligence in the universe. Because this possibility has huge philosophical ramifications, many people are stridently opposing the theory of Intelligent Design.
Posted by mykah, Tuesday, 6 September 2005 1:01:20 AM
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I guess it doesn't come more simple than that, mykah.

In fact, this has been the cry for so many years, ever since the caveman came out of his cave, looked up to the sky and said “Ugh”.

Which, translated, meant “dammit, it's raining again, can't go kill animals for food. I bet there's a god of rain up there who decides to mess up my hunting unless I worship him.”

Over the years, more enquiring minds than our caveman set themselves to work, and found that there were what they called “natural phenomena” at work – you know, condensation, clouds, air pressure, temperature bands, that sort of stuff. These people got together and called these phenomena “the weather”. All sorts of other people jumped on the bandwagon, including governments (who put together a thing called the me-te-o-ro-log-i-cal office – I know it's a big word, but I'm sure you'll get the hang of it) and TV stations.

There are still people out there who believe that there is in fact a rain-god who can, when asked nicely, cause the rain to fall, but they are mostly English cricketers these days.
Posted by Pericles, Tuesday, 6 September 2005 9:03:43 AM
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