Thing is, polls only allow you to count the bodies afterwards, they give no information on how the wounds were inflicted.

While it may well be true that opinion started running against Rudd before the spill, the fact remains that there was a considerable amount of backstabbing under way before the dip. Multiple stories hit the press as to Mr Rudd's management style, driven by a bunch of people whose feelings had clearly been hurt by it.

Cause and effect quickly became intertwined and indistinguishable, leading to the inevitable steps-of-the-forum moment.

It was then that it became clear to the public that the Labor Party had reached a point where it consisted of absolutely nothing but power-blocs and influence-peddlers. Ms Gillard proceeded to ram that point home at every opportunity, by making decisions in a values-free zone, with no reference to Labor's traditional tenets or ethos.

For a while, I convinced myself that having to work with a coalition of rag-tag also-rans was a major factor in her inability to arrive at a single policy that was free from artifice and compromise. Sadly, recent weeks have demonstrated that the teeth-grinding clumsiness evident in her every move is in fact her very own.

My view is that blame cannot be ascribed to one more than the other. One way or another, Ms Gillard is a product of current Labor thinking, and therefore their responsibility. But her contribution to the problems that now face the Party is also substantial.

Mr Rudd is irrelevant in the current picture. He might well turn out to be Labor's very own twice-rising soufflé, but not for a good few years yet. Unless he is tripped up by his own ambition - which is of course always a contender - he will do well to sit on the sidelines and allow the well-poisoned chalice to be sipped by a few others, before attempting resurrection.

Prompete

'Can't wait to see the next effort.'

Tonight Carr, after he had appointed Obeid to his NSW cabinet, blaming Morris Iemma for promoting Obeid to a 'position of influence'. Apparently Morris is the cause of the strife in the NSW labor party, according to Carr. Nothing to do with him.

I find it odd that many Liberal supporters don't like Abbott yet will still vote for his Party but the media insist that many Labor supporters will only vote for their Party if Rudd is made the leader.

It makes no sense and is simply the result of highly partisan media self-interest and their constant obsession with polls.

Rudd was dumped mainly due to a deliberate media campaign of destabilisation that made his position untenable and now they are trying to resurrect him.

Obeid, Thompson, Slipper, naive in 30's, AWU, pink bats, gw scam, so compassionate that idiotic changes to border control leads to a thousand plus deaths, failed mining tax, slimy deals with Greens and independants, trying to shut down free speach and all this is just over 5 years. Why is Labour toxic? It does not take much thought.

As a long term coalition voter it's worth remembering that there have been times when the coalition has been on the nose and the swings have been against the coalition. Right now it looks like Labor is on the way out but that could change in a term or too. There is not a lot of sign that the coalition/LNP governments which are replacing Labor are determined to do things all that differently.

My guess is the place where they will do differently is that they will come in with smaller deficits (or bring in surpluses) but at a massive cost to many in the community (hitting middle income earners as Labor do). As with Labor mates, family members and party faithful will be rewarded at the publics expense.

As with Labor ideology will drive some decisions more than reality (who really believes that outsourcing government work or selling assets results in better outcomes for the public).

The opportunity is there for the coalition/LNP to set a new standard of honesty and accountability but so far it appears that opportunity is being dismissed in the rush to get to the spoils of government.

I'll be glad to see Labor gone but wish I could look forward to that meaning government which served the community rather than just a more competent mob of self servers being in power.

R0bert

RObert where have you been hiding mate? The unions, particularly the public service ones hate Newman with a passion, so he must be doing something right.

I reckon Abbott will be similar. My main worry with him is that he may be too kind too those who need a thorough kicking.

Wobbles you don't have to like someone to respect them, & believe they will do a good job. I did not like Keating, & I don't think he liked us, but he did try to improve our economy, which would be good for us. In this he was not a real lefty.

It is becoming more obvious all the time that the real lefty, academia, & lefty elites really dislike us commoners. They obviously think we have got it too good, & have become a bit uppity. Professors can not stand the thought that a mere tradesman might earn more than they do.

It is the effect of this part of the Labor party which is most dangerous to the Oz people, & It's Gillard's promoting of their global warming scam, & the carbon tax that got her where she is today. She deserves everything she is getting. Compared to her, Abbott is a saint.