When I found out that "Gloria Jeans" contributes a percentage of their profits to the Hillsong "church", they lost my patronage.

Kipp,

What's your position on Weetbix?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanitarium_Health_and_Wellbeing_Company

That must have been be quite a shock for you, Kipp.

>>When I found out that "Gloria Jeans" contributes a percentage of their profits to the Hillsong "church", they lost my patronage.<<

But at least you are now able to go out and find somewhere that serves a decent cup of coffee.

The Lord must have heard our hearts' yearning prayer… Awesome!

The Lord Melvyn Bragg of Wigton that is, because today's topic on Radio 4's 'In Our Time' is the Ontological Argument on the proof of God.

Let's see what John Haldane Professor of Philosophy at the University of St Andrews, Peter Millican Professor of Philosophy at the University of Oxford and Clare Carlisle Lecturer in Philosophy of Religion at King's College London conclude, if anything:

(The program notes don't indicate whether God was invited)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01mwx64/In_Our_Time_The_Ontological_Argument/

Banjo,
I can relate a bit to what you're saying. I remember going through a challenge or a realisation that my thoughts or perceptions of God were centred around experiences of relating to my father. When someone first suggested that to me I was skeptical, thinking that sounded like some kind of cheap Freudian psychology. But then I wondered if there might be something to it.

I was challenged to reassess my ideas about who is the real God based on the Bible (like, for example, the verses in the middle of Psalm 103) rather than relating to memories of my father's actions. Although my experience is not as stark as yours, since my father has always been around, so I can always go and chat to him if need be.

.

Dear Dan,

.

Each generation is brought into the fold of religion as quickly as possible after birth and immediately receives the benefit of its protection.

Life is a hazardous journey, full of imponderables and pitfalls. Family ties are fragile. The young are vulnerable. Religion is a protective umbrella and a safety net. It's available to everyone and its free. Parents just have to ask for it. Many do, because they genuinely believe in god, or just in case ..., because it is the right thing to do, because others do it, or, perhaps, simply through superstition.

It plays an important paternalistic role in the lives of all those huddled under its protective wing. It is the father of the fatherless. The solid rock they build their lives on. The beacon that guides them. The eternal presence of the lost and lonely. The everlasting love of the betrayed and abandoned. The strength of the weak. The cure of the ill. The victory of the vanquished. The joy of the sad. The wealth of the poor. The hope of the hopeless. The life of the dead.

My religion and yours, Dan, helped us to deal with the failure of our genitor to assume his paternity, obliging me to find a substitute and you to fill in the gaps.

When I was a boy I took comfort in the thought that perhaps god was my father. But I felt I lacked the experience, the knowledge and the intellectual capacity to decide if it was true. I left the question in abeyance until later in life when I would be better equipped.

I waited until my life of toil and labour was done. By then, the internet had produced its effect. Communications had been revolutionised. Information and ideas circulated freely from a myriad of sources around the world. I no longer lived in Australia. The world had changed. I no longer needed a father. I was now the father. I was now even a grandfather many times over.

I finally settled the question I had left in abeyance as a boy.

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