Dear Halduell,

<<The Zionists have NEVER shown good-will to the Palestinians.>>

That's not true, because "NEVER" means that there was not ever even a single case of good-will, and I could name a few. However, it's not what I was writing about (so please check it carefully again):

I am not writing about "Zionists", I am talking about ordinary citizens of Israel who are sometimes forced to become Zionists, or indoctrinated in school to become such, only because of the Arab/Palestinian threat. Ordinary Israelis, people who happened to be born there, or brought there as children, people who just want to have a life like me and you, are no less the victims of Zionism.

Bombs, rockets and Muslim extremists are all blind and do not distinguish between a Zionist and other human-beings.

Now for today's major intellectual challenge: Does a Lefty have the capacity to see the difference between a Zionist and an Israeli?

>>And not while the Jewish lobby has such ownership of the MSM around the world>>

LOL

Anyone else here get invited to James Murdoch's Bar Mitzvah?

It was an amazing affair. And young James' (Hebrew name Yakov) recital of his haftorah was flawless.

Man I still remember that gefilte fish. I must remember to ask Rupert where he gets it next time I see him.

:-)

Unfortunately I did not get invited to Saudi Prince Al-Waleed Bin Talal's sons' Bar Mitzvahs. I would have loved to attend a Bar Mitzvah in Saudi Arabia.

The prince is a major stockholder in Fox News so he must be Jewish.

I wonder how many more Jewish Saudi princes there are.

@Yuyutsu
I imagine one good way to spot the difference between an Israeli and a Zionist would be to ask each their views on settlements, two-state solutions, rights of return for all, separate highways, house demolitions, and the list goes on.
Having asked those questions, perhaps it would not be so hard to spot the difference. The question then becomes is it possible to spot the difference the Israelis are making on the continuing degradation of Palestine/Israel.
Knowing what we know today about tobacco, it would be impossible to get the initial approval needed for its introduction.
Knowing what we know today about Israel, it would also be impossible to get the initial approval needed for its introduction.
My view is that Palestine/Israel is one land, and until it's governed as one state with one government, it will always be a land tearing itself apart in a civil war.

Dear Halduell,

Many Israelis are driven to Zionism ONLY because of the Palestinian terror. That's a pity and so counter-productive to those who want the pain to stop.

Perhaps you are right in hindsight that Israel should not have been created to begin with, but now it is there, those who formed it are either in their graves or in nursing homes (except the age-defying, nearly 89 y.o. president, Peres) and most citizens were simply born there and know no other home. Neither Zionism nor terror is their fault.

My views specific to your criteria:

Settlements - Absolutely wrong. Ideally remove them, but Israel itself is incapable because it would bring about a civil war which it couldn't survive, so either bring an international force to take the settlers out (but expect heavy casualties); or as the second-best option, leave them there to live (or die) under Palestinian rule.

Two-state solution - Certainly, AT LEAST two, probably more states are needed to accommodate the fundamental differences within both societies.

Right of return - Let those who can prove benevolence return, but one cannot allow hostile elements to enter and destroy one's country from within. Others should be compensated financially, including Jews who were expelled from Arab countries.

Separate highways - Absolutely wrong.

House demolitions - Wrong as a means of stealing land, but it's acceptable to destroy the houses of suicide-terrorists, as it's probably their only posthumous deterrent.

One-state solution - both impossible and undesirable (except for "religious" reasons by Hamas and the settlers). The cultural differences are enormous and it would impose an unnecessary burden and frictions over everyday issues. What will be the state's language? How for example to determine which day(s) of the week are the weekend? or should women be allowed to wear bikini on the beach? Czechoslovakia was split over lesser issues.

I think advocating for the hunger strikers is the worst disservice one can do for the Palestinian people. The majority of the hunger strikers detained in Israeli detention centers are convicted criminals. Cold blooded chid killers are amongst them. Do we really want to blindly follow extremist propaganda and link truly disadvantaged but law abiding Palestinian men, women and children with such people. The strikers on administrative detention are a handful. There are usually solid security reasons for their detention. Many countries have such provisions and singling out Israel for this is disingenuous. Ghandi was a known hunger striker. He never, unlike these deteinees perpetrated or supported violence. Let us not get our symbols of peaceful resistance polluted by supporting violent killers