mac,

It wasn't that the locals were lazy, they left the area because of the terrain. It required Israeli know-how to get any return from the soil. Do refer to those documents I provided.
If you do not wish to source any British documents, there are many many others available, such as correspondence by contemporary Arabs ... if you are indeed interested. However, I suspect you like to follow the easy line ... just listen to the loudest propoganda.

I am indeed very pleased that you raised the issue of the settlements. You and your bretheren should take up the matter with the Palestinians themselves. As ever usual, the Palestinians on the ground are not heard by you and yours. Just the raucous political propoganda.

Tens of thousands of Palestinians work in Israeli settlements on the West Bank. An important part of the Palestinian economy.

Currently, over 22,000 Palestinians are employed by settlements in construction, agriculture and service industries. (Manufacturers Association of Israel)

The PA estimate over 12,000 Palestinian workers have been employed from the beginning,
Their reports indicate that supporters of Hamas and Islamic Jihad are also involved in such business.

Israeli contractors pay Arab workers some 3 times more than Palestinian contractors. Pay from Israeli contractors average NIS 400 ($US100) per day, Palestinian NIS 100 to NIS 150 per day.

The 2008 annual report by Kav La Oved found that many Palestinians working on Israeli settlements were employed under Jordanian labour law - no minimum wage, no payment for overtime, no work safety, and no social rights/benefits. The Supreme Court of Israel then ruled that Israeli labor law applied to Palestinians working on the West Bank. They now receive the same protections as Israeli workers in Israel - minimum wages, payment for overtime, work safety as social benefits.

cont ...

The Supreme Court of Israel ruled that applying different rules on the same work, based on differring nationalities, constituted discrimination.

This enabled Palestinian workers to file lawsuits in Israeli courts. In 2008, the average sum claimed stood at 100,000 shekel ("Palestinian workers in Israeli West Bank settlements - 2008". Kav LaOved)

In 2010, Palestinian leaders banned Palestinian workers from working on these settlements.

The result was whole scale revolt by Palestinian workers, with Labour leaders threatening the PA if they took legal steps against these workers. (Luis Ramirez, Voice of America, 13 May 2010).

The Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research report that 63% of Palestinians opposed PA plans to prosecute Palestinians who work in the settlements.

mac,

You might ask yourself, exactly how these settlements get built ... unless by Palestinian workers. Instead of propaganda, Palestinians on the ground should be heard.

Indeed, why haven't we heard of an effective ban on Palestinians working on these settlements. Surely, that would have been the first sign of dissatisfaction and protest ...

My sincere apologies to David Singer for so many of the pathetic rants I’ve read on this topic. OLO usually attracts a far, far higher standard of debate. I suppose a moderator could censor a few of the nastier, more blatantly anti-Semitic passages, but it’s generally better to let the fringies speak their piece. At least then we know who they are -- by screen name only, of course, but they’re usually easy enough to recognise by certain recurrent idiosyncrasies in grammar, spelling, and historical interpretation.

Herewith, six points for those who’d GENUINELY like to support the legitimate aspirations of the long-suffering Palistinian people:

1) By all means, empathise with their tragic predicament. Empathy, however, is NOT demonstrated by parroting the rhetoric of violent extremists calling for extermination of ‘The Zionist Entity’.

2) Avoid hyperbole. Describing Jews as ‘happily murdering Arabs’ isn’t convincing; neither is reference to ‘settlers, armed and paid and totally free (even trained) to murder at will’.

3) Ad hominem arguments never help. Dismissive asides like ‘When David Singer emerges periodically to act on instructions from his homeland...’ and ‘Murdoch’s Likudist extremism’ are an infallible sign of weakness in the writer’s position.

4) Conspiracy theories about Jews secretly running the world can only appeal to the ignorant. If you really believe that Gillard ‘owes her position to the Jews of Melbourne,’ keep silent and save yourself embarrassment.

5) Holocaust denial, e.g. ‘the myths of anti-semitism and the Holocaust campaigns' appeals only to extreme-right fanatics. Do you really want the John Birch Society on side?

6) Associating Jews with Nazi atrocities is simply offensive. Accusing Israel of ‘exceeding even the Third Reich in both deeds and sustained hatred and murder’ achieves ... what? Asserting that ‘Lebensraum is our motif and it’s still a work in progress’ achieves ... what?

Peace between Palestine and Israel isn’t impossible; it’s ALMOST been achieved three times in the last 30-odd years. On all three occasions, extremists trumped moderates, and the process failed. It’s sad, and unsettling, to see OLO populated by so many who’ve given up on the prospect.

Danielle,

I'll accept the data you present, of course many Palestinians benefit from the Israeli economy, however it's not their economy. You and other pro-Israel commentators attempt to use the 'trickle-down- effect' argument while ignoring the ethical aspects of the Zionist invasion and occupation. As an analogy-I'm sure some Indigenous communities do rather well from mining royalties, however that doesn't alter history post 1788.

My objection is to those specious, racist, arguments presented in support of the creation of Israel, few people today would use their equivalents as a justification for the occupation of Australia by the British.

I'd certainly like to hear from the Palestinians, particularly on the subject of a Palestinian state.

"You and your bretheren"- be careful about making ad hominem implications, you will have noticed that I don't make offensive personal remarks

I had the chance to listen to the UN speeches and thought Abbas carried the day convincingly. This isn't complicated. Most countries in the UN want a Palestinian state and Obama promised to support one, just not yet it seems.

I found Cenk from the Young Turks gives a pretty straightforward summation;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHK6A7b_52E&feature=youtube_gdata_player

All the rest right now is noise.

However I do have some slight sympathy for Obama's position since, unlike donkeygod, I recognize the power of lobbying groups, most evidently within American politics where voting blocks and money talks. However I feel any Jewish lobbying for Israel is supported or even overtaken by that of the Christian fundamentalists reach.

Where I agree with him is those influences are probably overstated in Australian politics which makes our position on the Palestinian request for statehood so perplexing.

The right path of supporting that request is so self evident that only those with a deep self interest would oppose it, yet Australia just might, at least that seems to be Gillard's preference while Rudd would prefer an abstention.

How has Australia ended up here? The voting pattern of Australia had been consistent in voting for the annual UN resolution vote calling for an end to Israeli settlements in the West Bank and the call for the Geneva Convention to apply in the Palestinian territories.

I sort of get why Howard, after the visceral personal experience of 9/11 chose to either abstain or vote against these resolutions. 

It was a move that aligned Australia with only the US, Israel, the US Marshall Islands, Nauru, Palau and Micronesia.

Rudd however had us back on track until now. 

To me Gillard's stance is a sign of her government's moral bankruptcy evident in other areas such as her pursuit of the Malaysian Solution.

There was a time when Australia's support for the underdog was a given, when we knew right from wrong and could hold our heads up high. I want to be a proud Australian again. Come back please Mr Rudd.

mac,

"My objection is to those specious, racist, arguments presented in support of the creation of Israel" ... Really!

It all comes down to the Palestinians recognising the right of Israel to exist, and holding out a genuine hand of peace.

No more occupation ...

So simple the solution.

Since the 1970's many peoples have employed archaeologists to establish their ties to a region, which have had political/social resonance.

Archaeology, paleaography and the fact that Jews have always had a considerable continual presence in the area confirm their right to this homeland. Using our indigenous example ... they predate the presence of Arabs.

I suggest you do some homework if you wish to travel this route. This is not difficult given the wealth of archaeological and paleaographical research/evidence both online and in texts ... for those are genuinely are interested of course.

Again, I recommend that the Palestinians on the ground be heard, not just their political masters. Dr Abbas' doctorate topic was Holocaust denial. This provides insight into from where be comes. Or do you deny the Holocaust also?

What is it that makes people like you want to believe the worst propoganda about Israel, when evidence to the contrary is available.

If Israel is so oppressive and belligerent to the Palestinians - as you want to believe it to be - then these Palestinians are effectively collaborators. Their future in a Palestinian state bodes ill.

Like many, I believe in a two state solution, with peace and goodwill between Israelis and Palestinians. The issue is, do you?