And the price of all this plastic will go up and up as the price of oil goes up. It is clearly unsustainable and someone, somewhere, has to decree soon that meals-on-wheels go back to using reusable plates, and the cleaners to using reseable gloves and aprons.

I think the solution lies in moving to a steady state economy with stable population. It would at least, put a cap on house prices so only one income would be needed to pay it off. There might be then a few more people around who have time to come in and help the elderly with cleaning, cooking and washing up, and in the process provide a bit of companionship.

popnperish......said,

"I think the solution lies in moving to a steady state economy with stable population." I've been pushing that one for years:)

"It would at least, put a cap on house prices so only one income would be needed to pay it off" See, the sorry thing is, the upper levels will never see this and change their ways. Human-nature is a very ugly thing indeed, and the elderly are in-fact easy pickings for circling vultures.

But you ever know, humanity just might see its humanity:)

LEA

Good on you Valerie,

I wouldn't be so harsh on your self and please delete the instrumentalism. That's what the anti-pops use to measure a humans worth - how much they eat.

You are worth your weight in gold because for 60 or so years you have paid taxes, bought up a family and helped to make this nation great.

I would recommend that you tell your grandsons and grand daughters to start producing kids like mad because the greedy babyboomers (who have not saved for retirement) will certainly be an impost on the health budget.

Personally I'd like to tax the Boomers out of existence except they'd kidnap me and tell me how great the 60s were and play Creedence Clearwater Revival music at me until I cracked.

Good point about plastic and Meals on Wheels (a fantastic organisation). See if you can't start a recycling movement. You sound like a go getter. My hat is off to you.

Valerie, I fully support you in principle, but I just wonder whether the use of china or hard plastic plates instead of use-once-throw-away flimsy plastic plates, and all of that sort of reusable versus one-use stuff is really significant?

I wonder if, when everything is factored in, the costs to the consumer, society and environment would be significantly less, or any less, if Meals-on-Wheels moved right away from disposable stuff, as far as is possible?

The really big factor here is not this sort of thing, nor the increasing number of the elderly, nor the increasing proportion of the population requiring these sorts of services, it is our hopelessly ANTISUSTAINABLE continuous expansionist mindset.

This is what is causing us to spend ever-more money on the negative symptoms of too much growth and exerting pressure for ever less money in real terms to be spent on education, health, the elderly, etc.

Then there is the fact that most money spent on these sectors is just building more of the same for ever-more people without actually improving their quality for the existing population. In fact, most of this expenditure is desperately trying to stave off the negative factors constantly exerted by rapid population growth!

The argument that we need rapid growth to be able to pay the ever-rising costs of the elderly has just got knobs all over it. Yes, population growth would put more tax-payers in the workforce and hence provide more money for pensions and other services for the elderly. But this same population growth creates a demand for ever more services and infrastructure and hence for public expenditure.

We’d be much better off in terms of our overall quality of life, very much including that of the elderly, if we rapidly reduced immigration and geared our society towards a stable population and a lower-growth total economy, but higher-growth per-capita economy, forthwith.

Ludwig.....At the expense of human development, Iam afraid the very thing we need to survive on ( Air, trees, oceans, fresh water, animals wild or domestic, our fisheries, jobs for future people, you know them things) is just getting in the way, and of course most see it as, environmentally expendable......ALL OF IT. However, I too tip my hat to all those that have the fortitude and insights to improve what ever that your eyes may see as failing with not enough attentiveness that some fail to see, its good... really...its the best we can wish for.

Good on you and your formidableness to fix a problem.

If only there were more like you.

And as for the anti pop as some put it......if recycling
technical experts dont get it into full swing, well wont 10 billion people sound like fun:)

Sometimes the most simplest ideas work out to be the best. ,
Mass Production and the Creative Instinct.mmmmmmmmmmm

Cheryl, said....

"I would recommend that you tell your grandsons and grand daughters to start producing kids like mad"

WOW How can I think like you:)

LEAP

Cheryl
As a baby boomer I don't want my kids producing kids like mad - other than one or two each. In 20 years when I'm in my mid-80s my kids will have adult children who can come and visit Grandma and do the washing up or a bit of gardening while their parents continue in the workforce (rather than looking after ever more children), paying taxes, so that, when I'm in my 90s, their taxes will keep me in a nice nursing home thank you very much.

I reckon we agree Popnperish but I reckon by then the Sustainable Population Lobby will have put Sandra Kanck tablets in the water so that when you feel the urge to have sex, you'll simply ejaculate meaningless policy statements.

Great article - and a pertinent example of the throw-away mentality pervading all corners of our society.

What's wrong with Creedence Clearwater Revival?

Valerie;

...You failed to mention the biggest waste of all in your article, housing. According to the ABS, 36% of the Australian housing stock is a one person household: That in a period when over 100 thousand people in Australia are homeless. The Bolshevists dealt with similar waste effectively in 1917 Russian revolution by appropriation. It was unpopular of course, but gave all a home in which to live!

...Not of course suggesting all single households should be appropriated, but wouldn’t it be sensible if Governments could deal with the dispossessed prior to society falling into riot mode

Yes, what with peak oil & everything, I think we should go for sustainability. I really do, but only after I'm too old to play with my old cars. It should start then.

Valerie, the same peak oil will take care of your plastic bowls, & plastic food, too. Meals on wheels will have to be a bit more local, with no petrol, Oh & will need a change of name. How about meals on hooves.

You'll probably be lucky to get a sandwich, nothing frozen, with wind power only running for a couple of hours a day, freezers will be out.

Your sanger will be wrapped in last weeks newspaper, just like our fish & chips were, when we were all a bit tougher, [& happier].

Hopefully the horse won't smell all those sandwiches through the chaff bag they are being carried in, or they may go missing.

Glad you are getting some help. My mum had showering help, although I provided the meals. I never could come to grips with showering my mum, even when she was in her 90s. That was her fault of course, she's the one who brought me up to be a bit of a prude.

Hasbeen....What ever floats your mate! The same mirror will be waiting for you as well:) and somewhere there's a fair go for all Australians.......I wonder what primitivism of gov said that?

I guess not all the fish you scale, can be something you can eat:")

LEAP:)

<< I think we should go for sustainability. I really do, but only after I'm too old to play with my old cars. >>

Aaaah haaa hahahahaaaa. You crack me up Hazza!

.

Thanks for the support Quantumleap.

The costs of caring for the elderly are going up, but not because of the reasons you state, Valerie - or at least they are very minor reasons.

1)We are all living longer due to better health care and dietary intake.
2)we have a greater percentage of elderly because the birth rate has fallen.
3)expectations of care have increased - the minimum standards allowed have risen.

4)in the past it was expected that there would be family input and government input as a last resort - nowadays, even anyone can renege on the care of their family member and leave it to the government if they so wish AND they very often (mostly) do.

In times gone by the extended family was more prevalent than it is today. The elderly would stay with different members of their family or would be visited regularly as support.

This doesn't happen much in this day and age.
Our families grow up and may move far away from home.
Some of us grow up from the cradle believing that we are entitled to it all and that we have no responsibility to look after our elderly and or, in fact, other people in need of care.

That's just the way it is. If anyone is to blame it's the continuing erosion of our responsibility by the governments that are to blame.
... But whatever the reason - what a terrible thing it is that our anti-consumerism and anti-population idealogues have contributed to Valerie's guilt at being alive and using resources at this stage of her life. At 82yrs you should be able to feel peace. You've no doubt worked all your life and contributed in many ways to your community and society in general.

Enjoy, I say and forget the guilt.