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The Forum > Article Comments > Cyberbullying, that schoolyard body slam, and footballers behaving badly > Comments

Cyberbullying, that schoolyard body slam, and footballers behaving badly : Comments

By Peter West, published 18/3/2011

School fights, once confined to the school yard can have an audience of millions, with severe ramifications for those involved.

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Otokonoko,
I would think what your school is doing is ultimately harmful.

If a student is made to sit outside of an office for a week, that can be very embarrassing to the student, and that student may kick back at authority and at society at sometime in the future.

Because the student is being taken out of class, they are also not learning much.

Best to actually talk to the student instead, and that advice is from many years supervision of mostly men doing shift work under very trying conditions (eg 40 oC heat and 90 dB noise levels)

Keep asking the student questions untill they can't answer something.

If a student is picking on Tommy, keep asking them questions until they can’t answer anything any more.

“Is there anything about Tommy you like? He got 70% in his maths exam, and that was good, so do you like that?”

“Do you think Tommy could help you in your maths homework.”

“Do you think Tommy would be better at football if you didn’t pick on him.”

“Do you think Tommy would be better at football if you showed him what to do.”

“Do you think Tommy is a good swimmer. He was able to swim a whole lap last swimming lesson”

Etc, etc, etc

Eventually the bully won’t be able to answer a question, and then they are sent away to think about their answer to that question, and then they have to come back and give their answer to the teacher.

Simple, very effective and no detention or lost time from class.

Guaranteed to work, and a win-win situation all round.
Posted by vanna, Friday, 18 March 2011 7:13:37 PM
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vanna, I really doubt that would work. To be honest, I think the child being questioned would give whatever answers the parental figure would want to hear, then seek out 'Tommy' and make his life hell.

As 'repercussions' go, being asked a few questions doesn't really cut the mustard I'm afraid.

To a large extent I agree with Houellebecq. I think that the social skills children learn in school through dealing with their classmates are far more important that what is actually taught in the classes. Dealing with bullies is a big part of that. The kid who never learns to deal with bullies will one day become the adult who lacks confidence.
Some might say that the child lacks confidence because they were bullied, but where does this innate 'confidence' come from, if not from developing their social skills with their peers?

That being said, of course we don't make it the rules of the jungle. Discipline is necessary sometimes, and I'd rather it be swift and effective rather than limp-wristed when it comes to dealing with violence.

Suggestions such as vanna's might work for very young children, or when the matter hasn't escalated as far as violence, but once things have gotten that ugly, more drastic measures need to be taken.
Posted by TurnRightThenLeft, Friday, 18 March 2011 8:12:51 PM
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vanna,

Harmful it may be, but it works. For quite some time, my school has had one of the most harmonious, tolerant and accepting student bodies around. Do you really think that a punch should be addressed solely with questions? Will that condition students to expect similar consequences in the outside world? And if the questions are asked without loss of class time or time spent in detention, when are they asked?

Obviously, other actions are dealt with less severely - but there is absolutely no tolerance for violence. As a result, acts of violence almost never take place.

My point is that bullying is a pattern of behaviour. It can only become a pattern if it goes unchecked. If individual incidents are addressed, bullying almost never happens.
Posted by Otokonoko, Friday, 18 March 2011 8:39:52 PM
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Oh Auther! Time to get over it already.

'Firstly I did nothing to attract the attention of the bullies'
Yes you did. You allowed them to treat you in a certain way. (Houllebecq)

...must have a little difficulty thinking with the social other side of his/her brain, yet fascinating that he/she can on occasions be highly intelligent regarding economical or non-social issues.

Sadly, Houllebecq it appears you have not yet 'learned' from people who have been victims at one stage or another during their lives, still holding the same old tunnelled vision view that a victim is inviting or tolerating bullying, and that therefore it is the victims fault. How old are you Houllebecq if you do not mind me asking?

Generally speaking Houllebecq, it is usually a well known bully as a child or adult, who holds this generalised opinion, a person who was once bullied themselves during childhood or as an adult. Learned environmental behaviour by a bully, their excuse, for their dreadful verbal and physical assaults on children and people, is to blame their victims or victims in general.

I would say to you Houllebecq, with respect, it is best that you address the bullying that was inflicted upon you at some stage in your life, instead of attacking a person (Arthur)who was an innocent victim as a child, and chose beautifully to break the cycle and not take the road some other victims have taken as adults later, by "bullying" other adults.
Posted by weareunique, Friday, 18 March 2011 9:13:20 PM
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Take away or distract a bully's audience [usually the bully's mates] using humour without degrading, and one will discover that child and occasionally adult victims, are half way there with a bully. The lack of attention shifting from a bully back to the victim, with others present, decreases the confidence in a bully.

Another strategy useful for children suffering from schoolyard bullying, is to enrol these kids into drama and martial arts for extra confidence, in addition to inviting a friend or two home for a sleepover or activities regularly during school terms when the bullying occurs.

I recall my daughter being stabbed in the eye with an object by a Year 5 girl once. The girl was insecure about my athletic daughter's ability to win races during school events. The following week I took the day off work to attend the schools trials and watch my daughter compete against her bully [previous incidents that year]. The girl's parents stood by the racing line, "C'mon Trish, C'mon Trish you can beat them all". I laughed at their non-stop banter. My daughter beat them all with a stitch, not a word said by myself. I was just glad she had participated for her health and a community event.

All four girls were selected to compete interstate in a relay team, making me laugh more. I informed her mother and father, that if their daughter ever assaulted my child again, I would lay charges and sue for the injuries. Both walked off scolding their daughter for not 'coming first' in the race.

All schools should be ensuring there is a continued 'Buddy' or "Pal" system for each year throughout primary and high school. Tutor or school 'Home' groups should be conducted once or twice per week to specifically discuss bullying issues without a victim's bully being present in those school time 'home' groups.

For children, making eye contact with a bully, standing firm, and knowing, that at the end of the day, the bully will either not attend a school reunion years later, or be shunned by his/her old school 'mates'
Posted by weareunique, Friday, 18 March 2011 9:45:33 PM
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Sorry vanna, I clicked 'post' before I was finished. I meant to say that there is certainly merit to your suggestion. I agree with, and regularly employ, a method similar to your line of questioning. 'I don't know' is not an acceptable answer, either. Students are expected to answer questions and answer them in full.

There is a line to tread between restorative and retributive justice in schools. The reality is that we are preparing kids for a society in which retribution is the most common method of dealing with misbehaviour, even when we pretend that our criminal justice system is about reforming people. I'm a firm believer that, while we in schools must do what we can to help students make better decisions for themselves, we should not neglect the punishment when a kid appears to be penitent. With the systems we have in place, students tend to accept the consequences of their actions and rarely offend again.

I've seen less successful procedures in other schools: you can pick the schools with ineffective systems by the number of repeat offenders they have, and the number of times those students repeat their actions. I once taught a boy who had four twenty-day suspensions in one year. Obviously the consequence wasn't working, but the school kept on going down that same old track. Perhaps some attempt at restorative justice, including your questioning method, would have been a good idea.
Posted by Otokonoko, Friday, 18 March 2011 10:01:33 PM
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