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The Forum > Article Comments > Egypt, Israel and Gaza - flashpoint for future confrontation > Comments

Egypt, Israel and Gaza - flashpoint for future confrontation : Comments

By David Singer, published 16/2/2011

There are dangers for the world if the new government in Egypt acts on nationalism and repudiates its treaties with Israel.

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I wonder how much longer Israel can depend on the uncritical support of a declining and overstretched imperial power such as the US?

There's nothing wrong in the Egyptians repudiating or re-negotiating what they consider an 'unequal treaty' that was signed by a dictatorial former regime.

I doubt if the 'people power' movement in Egypt( or elsewhere in the ME) will result in a liberal democratic government, however, it will probably reflect the majority opinion of Egyptians, which of course,is bad news for Israel.

Unfortunately, more pressure on Israel will probably result in more oppression of the Palestinians.
Posted by mac, Wednesday, 16 February 2011 9:36:17 AM
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Talking as he does, of political grandstanding,David Singer needs to be pulled up hard in his threat in the following reference of his:

"Egypt's execution of the Treaty regained every square kilometer of land lost by Egypt in the 1967 Six Day War including airfields and oil fields in the Sinai. Any breach of the Treaty would put these important strategic and economic assets at risk of being lost by Egypt forever."

Tel Aviv failed miserably...just before Mubarak was toppled...by instructing its ambassadors to influence their host nations in favour of supporting Mubarak. It was a base appeal that was rightly swept aside by the full weight of world opinion.

Times, David, are a changing.Bullies in the Middle East are no longer unassailable...whether in Cairo, Tel Aviv, or even Washington. Obviously the treaty will be revised, as it should be, regardless of any Israeli threats, which would also be rejected by Obama..
Posted by Sydney, Wednesday, 16 February 2011 11:38:28 AM
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David

You really think Egypt wiil be alone if Israel decides to try to steal Sinai?

Have you forgotten what happened in southern Lebanon when you blokes were thrashed by a bunch of militants when you tried to steal the southern half of Lebanon a couple of years ago?

You know if the general trend across the Arab world towards democracy continues it will leave you blokes in Isreal as the only dictatorship in the region.

Watch how the west will react to your aggressive military backed landstealing antics then.

Mate this article shows you are fighting yesterdays battles.

The world has moved on and the Arab world is doing the same.

Israels challenge is to do the same. It's time to dump the old propaganda regime and embrace peace and democracy.

You blokes ain't going to be able to steal the Arab lands to create Greater Israel anytime soon.

You've lost.
Posted by keith, Wednesday, 16 February 2011 4:40:36 PM
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The best thing the Egyptians can do is to rid themselves of the USA/Zionist imperialists.Then 40% of their pop would not be on $2.00 per day.

Aid should be given to Egypt via food and education.Not money to bribe a Govt/military to subjugate their own population.Israel and the USA should mind their own business.
Posted by Arjay, Wednesday, 16 February 2011 6:30:11 PM
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When Israel and America are eventually forced out of the region, there will be no flashpoint at all.

That is the solution. Get rid of the foreign invaders. They should never have been allowed to get a foothold in what is mainly a Muslim part of the world in the first place.

Put Israel in the U.S. They will all live happily ever after as long as they are kept inside their own borders!
Posted by David G, Thursday, 17 February 2011 8:52:46 AM
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"Put Israel in the U.S. They will all live happily ever after as long as they are kept inside their own borders!"

Oh, I wish it was that simple, David. Do you really believe that Muslims will be content at that? they are now in the process of conquering Europe and already laid claims to Northern Australia. Even China fears them - why possibly would they stop at Israel, or at any other place when Muhammad ordered them to conquer the world?

While it is true that Israel and the U.S. have some serious behavioural problems, you should thank them for standing at the frontier so that you, here in Australia, are not currently threatened by the prospect of living under Shariah law.

Your response show no compassion for the people who actually live in Israel and do the dirty work for you of holding Islam at bay, especially those who hold no specific ideology but are simply caught in the circumstance of having been born there, now that you suggest to uproot them from their homes and communities and chuck them somewhere far away as America, or the moon for that matter.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Thursday, 17 February 2011 12:55:44 PM
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I agree that the Israelis do the dirty work but they don't do it for me. They do it to advance the elitist, imperial Jewish cause.

And if you have a Muslim phobia, Yuwhatever, get it seen to because it is not helping your thinking processes!
Posted by David G, Thursday, 17 February 2011 2:19:46 PM
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"They do it to advance the elitist, imperial Jewish cause."

Some do, sadly, but what about the majority of Israelis who fight just in order to survive and keep their homes and families? What about the israelis who are themselves victims of the above "elitist, imperial Jewish cause"?

Whatever their cause, be it right or wrong, you are also one of their beneficiaries (that is, unless you are one of those who are happy to live under Shariah law), so better not spit into the well from which you drink.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Thursday, 17 February 2011 2:57:25 PM
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David S....you still owe me a personal apology for describing me as a "hater of all but white supremacists"..I haven't forgotten, and your case is rising steadily to the top of my 'to do' file.

On the Middle East?

Look for

a)Combined effort of Communist/socialists and Islamists working together for the overthrow of capitalism and rise of Islam.

b)Increased organization and preparation of such groups as stability occurrs, then watch how those factions react to each other.

c) Increased behind the scenes involvement of people like George Soros, Jared Cohen and others.

You heard it hear first.
Posted by ALGOREisRICH, Thursday, 17 February 2011 3:58:48 PM
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The 9 comments posted so far have little relevance to my article. I will only comment on those that do.

#mac

You state:
"There's nothing wrong in the Egyptians repudiating or re-negotiating what they consider an 'unequal treaty' that was signed by a dictatorial former regime."

My comment:

Any repudiation of the treaty by Egypt would result in America getting involved in accordance with the Carter commitment and would almost certainly trigger another war.

Not sure what renegotiation could possibly change. Egypt got back all its lost territory lock stock and oil barrels (discovered by Israel). What is there to renegotiate? How do you get back more than 100%?

# Sydney

You state:

"Talking as he does, of political grandstanding,David Singer needs to be pulled up hard in his threat in the following reference of his:

"Egypt's execution of the Treaty regained every square kilometer of land lost by Egypt in the 1967 Six Day War including airfields and oil fields in the Sinai. Any breach of the Treaty would put these important strategic and economic assets at risk of being lost by Egypt forever."

My comment:

Would you expect Israel to keep on returning lands every time Arab countries wage a war against it?

Do you think Hamas or the Palestinian Authority would return land to Israel after the conclusion of any war? Their stated aim to destroy Israel is met with a deafening silence by people like yourself.
Posted by david singer, Thursday, 17 February 2011 5:24:59 PM
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The real dangers have nothing to do with broken treaties with Israel.Attacking Iran is far more dangerous to world peace which Israel is intent on doing.

Isarel is viewing the unrest in Egypt from a very egocentric view point and cares not for the welfare of ordinary Egyptians.
Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 17 February 2011 7:55:19 PM
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"Isarel is viewing the unrest in Egypt from a very egocentric view point and cares not for the welfare of ordinary Egyptians."

Wouldn't you do the same, Arjay, if your life was at stake?
It is not that Israelis totally do not care for the welfare of ordinary Egyptians, but wouldn't you in their place give the first priority to your own survival?
Posted by Yuyutsu, Thursday, 17 February 2011 10:44:53 PM
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Israel wants Mubarak or a Mubarak-clone to return to power and brutally oppress 80 million people again so that 6 million people in Israel (who are brutally oppressing the Palestinians) can feel secure.

There is a word for that kind of selfish thinking.
Posted by David G, Friday, 18 February 2011 10:41:08 AM
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"There is a word for that kind of selfish thinking"

And how would you behave differently, Mr. G, if your own and your family's life was at stake?

6 million people in Israel are not oppressing Palestinians - only a few of them do, while the others cannot do much more about it than they can do about the weather, or about Egypt for that matter.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 18 February 2011 10:57:26 AM
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Yuyutsu,

"6 million people in Israel are not oppressing Palestinians-only a few of them do".

Sophistry, it's rather like claiming that only Mubarak's police force oppressed Egyptians. The 'settler' carpetbaggers are supported by the Israeli state which is more than enough evidence of bad faith. The average Israeli doesn't seem to be much agitated by the injustices that the Paletinians suffer at Zionist hands,otherwise the land theft would stop, wouldn't it?

David Singer,

The Egyptians are the best judges as to whether or not that treaty was in their interests.
Posted by mac, Friday, 18 February 2011 12:25:00 PM
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Dear Mac,

"The average Israeli doesn't seem to be much agitated by the injustices that the Paletinians suffer at Zionist hands,otherwise the land theft would stop, wouldn't it?"

Well, you seem agitated by it - and what difference does it make? (NIL)
If you happened to be an Israeli, how much more could you really do about it? (NIL)

As in any democracy, either Tweedledum or Tweedledee are going to be elected - does it mean that you should be held responsible for the actions of Julia & Tony?

Most Israelis consider themselves "Zionists" simply because when they first asked their kindi-teacher: "Sarah, what is a zionist?" they got the answer: "A zionist is someone who shares his toys with his friends". I am quite sure that if YOUR kindi-teacher gave you that answer you would also consider yourself a zionist.

Seriously, Israelis are just normal people who just care about paying their bills, raising their children and the like. The "territories" for most is something you see on TV, the same way as you would from Australia. There is one difference though: the constant fear of bombs and rockets, and since all zionist political-parties promise to lift the security-level and reduce those threats, people just have to vote for one of them, which then finds itself unable to form a coalition without the settlers, adding to the general feeling of hopelessness.

The formation of Israel might have been a mistake, but generations have been born there since who know no other home, yet Iran, Hezbollah, Hamas and many other Arabs and even our friend here David G., wish to kick them out of their homes as far away as possible - any wonder why under such conditions they should cling to any party offering them a bit of security?

Please consider how would you feel in the situation of being blamed for things that are beyond your control.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 18 February 2011 2:00:11 PM
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Yuyustu,

Yes, even though I don't agree with the arguments that Zionists use for the creation of Israel, it's here to stay. Of course, all settler states are the result of invasion and dispossession, what's done is done, however the process in Israel continues in the name of 'security'. Perhaps I'm rather naive in assuming that if Israel stops its expansionist policies it might in fact achieve at least part of the security its population seeks. I don't accept that the hostility to Israel by the Palestinians is the result of some existential struggle with Islam rather than resistance to the invader.
It's very hard to accept that a state with such an overwhelming advantage in military power really has practically no options, as you suggest. The recent revelations about the rejection of Palestinian overtures by Israel's political elite seems rather damning evidence to me.

As to the Iraeli public's passivity, I'd like to see polling on the average Israeli's attitude towards Palestinians, Arabs and 'settlers' before I'd accept your arguments.
Posted by mac, Friday, 18 February 2011 4:44:33 PM
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With 200 + nukes and the lunatic disposition to use them,no country threatens Israel.They even have the USA well under the thumb.Last yr 300 of 450 US congressmen signed a letter of allegiance to Israel promising not to critise them no matter what they do.

To say that Israel is threatened is a grand deception.The Zionists might feel threatened since they will lose power to more moderate influences.
Posted by Arjay, Friday, 18 February 2011 7:42:03 PM
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Arjay, your latest comment brings some sense to the disinformation being spouted by Singer and Yuyutsu.

Israel is, without doubt, the greatest threat to world peace in the world today although America is right up there too.
Posted by David G, Saturday, 19 February 2011 6:59:59 AM
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Yes David ,there are plenty of lunatics in the USA too.
Posted by Arjay, Tuesday, 22 February 2011 7:26:35 PM
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