[Deleted for personally attacking the author]

Boxgum as I have said before I think in this forum maybe not this article was written by a atheist who is non religious. They exist I know I am one thing is I do feel there was some not needed attacks. It was the authors personal account. I take it you are a Christian? if so then maybe you could write an article and share your reason for the season. Everyone has diverse opinions atheists, Christians, pagans you name it. This author is entitled to her opinion, I may disagree with elements of what she has written and I did ask for explanation for some more understanding on the topic.

Instead I was sad that the author chose to ignore some of the lively debate and take it to heart. As I stated it is a public forum and people are not kind all the time. It is a huge thing to put a article like this out there. Maybe this would have been best shared with her close friends and family.

I am not sure if any of you have heard of Neil Gaiman but here is a article he has written recently regarding his take on Christmas. Some may find it interesting as he is a Jew I think he is anyway.

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/features/neil-gaiman-hanukkah-with-bells-on-1203307.html

It's interesting but not surprising that the
"it's time to take Christmas back from the Christians" crowd
seems to comprise the same membership as the
"it's time to take marriage back from the heterosexuals" crowd.
Moral, legal and cultural relativists all.

@AJPhilps, you wrote regarding the question of who would seriously question that Jesus existed in history:

"Anyone with a sound knowledge of history not distorted by an irrational belief."

Unfortunately, the evidence says otherwise. One can pretty much count on one hand the number of professional historians who rejects the historical existence of Jesus - Chrys named almost all of them: Price & Dougherty being the most well-known (what is well-known and popular on sceptical blogs is not necessarily a reflection of the mainstream), and her reference to Dawkins' claim that a serious case can be made - unfortunately he relies on a Professor of German who is even more on the fringes of scholarship than those two. Basically, the Jesus-Myth theory is held in the same kind of regard by the historical mainstream that YEC is held in by the scientific mainstream. And the theory that Christianity copies earlier pagan 'resurrection' myths is virtually non-existence anymore, as it was shown that it was largely a case of 'paralellamania'. I could also list names, eminent scholars like Edwin Judge (though you may think that this distinguished classicist has had his thinking 'distorted' by an 'irrational belief' - no true scotsman anyone?) and Martin Hengel.. Indeed, N.T. Wright, a foremost scholar on C1st Greek and Jewish history and culture, in his 700 (many say 'magesterial')tome on the resurrection declares that current scholarship is such that he feels no need to spend any time defending the very historicity of Jesus, writing:
"It would be easier, frankly, to believe that Tiberius Caesar, Jesus’ contemporary, was a figment of the imagination than to believe that there never was such a person as Jesus."

But if it's to be more than an appeal to authority, actually arguments that show why the scholarly consensus is in question would need to be made (and clearly, that is not Chrys' point here).

Most historians recognise that there is too much historical impact to otherwise explain satisfactorily, and simply too much textual attestation to otherwise discard - indeed, so much so that the attempts betray a certain agenda.

Thank Chrys, I did enjoy this post.

You're right that many, if not most, Australians don't give a thought to Jesus at Christmas - however that doesn't mean Christians don't have the freedom to attempt to prompt that thought.
Now, I'm certainly not suggesting that only Christians should celebrate Christmas - not at all! As I once put it: we Christians nicked the holiday from the pagans, so if a secular society wants to nick it for Jolly old St Nick, I’m not sure we’ve got any high ground to stand on. (Yes, I know, St Nicholas was a real guy too - if you see a picture of Santa in a bishops garb, that's him!). How someone else chooses to celebrate something somethat that I think has significant religious significance really doesn't make much difference to me. I can share what I think this significance is, but I can't force anyone else to accept that. The 'war on Christmas' is stupid. Rather than criticise others for their way of celebrating, let's just celebrate ours - and if it's good, won't it be attractive to others?
Yes, Christmas is, in Australia, historically a Christian festival with lots of other add-ons, and if some people just want the add-ons and not the traditional core.. good for them. But at the same time, it would be wrong to ignore and marginalise the historical 'reason' than many still celebrate, even if somewhat tokenistically by some, when it comes to community events. If I ever get asked to sing in one of the big televised carol events, you can bet your bottom teeth that I'm going to sing a song about Jesus and how he came to bring peace and restoration - because that's what Christmas is about to me, and I'd hope that even if you don't agree, that you'd enjoy it anyway, as I do when people sing about six-white boomers.
I dare you, Chrys, to argue that I could ruin carols night by singing O Holy Night ;)

boxgum, Saturday, 18 December 2010 9:28:24 PM

Those stories are likely to be as true as Harry Potter, Narnia, or Star Wars.