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The Forum > Article Comments > Grumble from the jungle: naming not shaming multiculturalism > Comments

Grumble from the jungle: naming not shaming multiculturalism : Comments

By Andrew Jakubowicz, published 1/10/2010

'Sydney disease': the abandonment of multiculturalism while becoming cynical advocates of a racist politics of prejudice.

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The term Multiculturalism would seem to imply "Race relations",some sort of federation of ethnic communities or even civic nationalism.
Trouble is the term has been simultaneously hijacked and politicised by so called "Anti Racists" on the Left and Pro assimilation right wingers.
The charter of Rights and Responsibilities we have in Victoria provides the only administrative apparatus we need for "multiculturalism", beyond that the practicalities will always be decided by the community.
It doesn't matter what the government says or does, people will associate with those whom they feel most comfortable.
Most of the "trouble"is inspired by events and ideologies from abroad anyway, whether it's Jewish "trash" culture from Hollywood,Fascism and it's twin Antifascism from mainland Europe, Islamic Religious doctrine from Jeddah or secular "social engineering" from Tavistock in the UK.
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Tuesday, 5 October 2010 5:22:05 PM
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Reading these posts I'd say that most of you are living in Australia, very complacent with it - and so you should be. It's a wonderful place.

I'm an atheist, I don't believe I am a racist, I love diverse cultures, I have friends who come from all walks of life, creeds and belief systems. I am Australian through and through although my mother was Italian and father English, was born and spent my formative years in South Africa - emigrated to Australia 25 years ago and am currently living in an ex communist country, I work in the UK when I have to - but I'm Australian. I found my cultural identity when we moved to Australia. I was never South African, European - I did not have a country that I wanted to live and die for if necessary until I found Australia. There is NO WAY that I will give that up.

I don't believe there should be legalised multi-culturalism. It's an abomination - NOT multi-culturalism BUT the legislation of multi-culturalism.

Understanding of others way of life, their religions, their belief systems and social mores are one thing, but to adopt them legally or accept them just because it is the politically correct thing to do is wrong and morally lackadaisical. (eg. Sharia law, the disgusting practices of both FGM and MGM (mail genital mutilation), the barbaric practices of kosher or halal slaughtering).
People who immigrate to Australia or any other country SHOULD integrate and become the best Australians (or ??) they can. By giving into multi-culturalism we are saying that theirs is better than ours - we are putting our social norms and mores and belief systems into a big melting pot and losing our identity.
Posted by fiandra, Tuesday, 5 October 2010 5:36:47 PM
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That isn't to say that they give up their identity. It isn't to say that they can't or shouldn't have some (most of their) concessions and tolerance, No doubt we would adopt some anyway by evolution - BUT WE need concessions too - and the most important of those concessions is that they integrate and give up the barbaric and antiquated practices that have absolutely NO place in our modern era, the other concession is that they act like they believe that their adopted country is the best in the world, otherwise they should go back whence they came.

I am living in an Eastern European country, I cook their foods, I talk their language I live like they do, I fit into their culture as much as I can, but I'm NOT Eastern European and never will be, I'm Australian - but I'm in THEIR country and don't expect them to change for me.

Interesting enough while we are making all the concessions to 'multi-culturalism', many of those 'multi-culturalists' haven't made any and it's labeled racist/xenophobic by the politically correct if we ask for or expect concessions from them. Divide and conquer - that what multi-culturalism does. BTW I'm not targeting 1 ethnic group or religion.

I have seen what 'multi-culturalism' has done to the England - it's not the England of 30 yrs ago - she no longer has an identity, she's weak - she's there for the taking and it is happening, slowly but inexorably it is being taken over changing and not for the better.

We still have our national pride - for goodness sake, don't lose that.
Posted by fiandra, Tuesday, 5 October 2010 5:37:50 PM
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Fiandra.
That's all well and good if everyone is looking for "solutions", which boils down to a search for "Truth".
White people are obsessed with objective truth, it's a cult of "objectivism" which tolerates "Political correctness", toxic to the mind though it is.
I don't know if you've noticed but other races don't look for objective truth in every single scenario with which they are confronted.
The Aboriginals aren't interested in the truth behind the "Mungo Man" or the Bradshaw paintings.
Muslims aren't interested in proving or disproving anything in their world, they aren't even interested in the connections between their history and those of other groups,as witnessed in the destruction and looting of antiquities in the Middle East.
No one in the Islamic world is questioning the legitimacy of the Cloak of Mohammed, when Mullah Omar donned it and appeared before the Taliban the crowd pronounced him commander of the faithful.
Contrast that with the treatment of the Shroud of Turin.
If White people had shown no interest in the Mayan or Khmer or Inca history they would have been forgotten, the Guatemalans,Cambodians and Peruvians don't give a damn about their past, even the Chinese aren't really that bothered by all the archaeology under their feet.

We Whites question everything, we take our holiest relics and most sacred sites and we pore over them and subject them to continuous scrutiny.
So it is with our societies, if someone says "race is a social construct" we'll run with that and try to create a set of objective, demonstrable standards to fit the theory, we'll scrutinise it and consider our relationship to the theory, running in ever tighter circles.
We can create standards for ourselves in relation to other races based upon the "truths" we discover but if other races are not receptive to those ideas simply because nothing in their world needs to be demonstrated we're up a certain creek without a certain instrument.
We seem to be getting furrowed brows and the response "Yeah...So What?" from the other races to a lot of the "Multicultural Agenda".
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Wednesday, 6 October 2010 4:21:52 PM
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LOL Jay of Melbourne

I agree that Muslims deny any fact that contradicts their religion. But Muslims are NOT a race.

Let me emphasise that. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A RACE OF MUSLIMS.

Note that White Christian fundamentalists seem to have as much difficulty dealing with evolution as any Muslims.

So much for Whites being especially objective in their outlook.

Jay I dislike the word “race”. It is too imprecise. For example we now know that people hailing from East Africa are genetically quite distinct from people who trace their origins to West Africa. Yet both are regarded as belonging to the same “race”.

I prefer the word “deme”. I cannot improve on the Wikipedia definition:

>>In biology, a deme is a term for a local population of organisms of one species that actively interbreed with one another and share a distinct gene pool. When demes are isolated for a very long time they can become distinct subspecies or species.>>

East and West Africans belong to different demes.

Now there may or may not be significant genetic differences between demes. And that may or may not affect their outlooks on life and their capabilities. For example I find it intriguing that in the last seven Olympics all 56 finalists in the 100 metres dash traced their origins to West Africa. It wasn’t just the winners who were of West African origin. It was all those who made it to the finals. The odds against that occurring by chance are simply astronomical.

But, on the whole, right now, in 2010, we just don’t know if there are genetic differences between demes that affect outlook and capability. BOTH sides of the debate are simply spewing hot air.

The average genetic differences between demes may be tiny but they could still have a significant affect. On the other hand, and this is equally likely, they may have no significant affect at all.

We simply don’t know.

So why don't you stop spewing junk science?
Posted by stevenlmeyer, Wednesday, 6 October 2010 4:55:32 PM
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Banjo I agree with a lot of what you say but:
"If we desire a cohesive community, we need to be selective as to whom we invite into our country, on a cultural basis"
and...
"We should recognise that some have alien cultural practices they are not willing to forgo and we should not continue to allow them to enter the country."

The problem with this approach is that:
1) you can't know before the individual has been accepted that he/she isn't willing to forgo these practices (even if they swear on the bible/koran/torah)
2) some alien cultural practices are enriching and excluding all of a cultural group on the basis that theirs is a culture that is different to ours would be wrong, not to mention stultifying.
Cultures are man made, they evolve (usually). We take the good from one and adopt it. The problems arise when we see the bad in one and allow it to continue because it is steeped in Religious Dogma and archaic rhetoric and it's 'too sensitive' an issue to bring up, we'll hurt their feelings, it's a restriction on their freedom' (until it becomes accepted as a norm).

If something is wrong/evil - no matter how you wrap it up or whatever you wrap it up with - cultures or religions, it's still evil. FGM, MGM, forced marriages, halal/kosher slaughtering, honour killings (murders),to name but a few. Even if some of their practices don't have a long term detrimental effect (to an individual) eg.MGM - many men don't mind that their bodies may have been violated in the name of culture/religion, some couples forced into marriage turn out to be happy - they are still evil - they have violated the individuals right and should be outlawed.

Australia and Australians should have the 'bxxxs' to criminalise certain barbaric practices and ignore the others regardless of its origins. In an ideal world we would welcome diverse cultures into our society, but there would be a caveat - that their citizenship could be revoked should they practice those heinous acts of violence upon another.
Posted by fiandra, Wednesday, 6 October 2010 7:28:56 PM
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