In all this mealy-mouthed discussion about getting rid of the unfit, is it possible to clarify something:

a) Suicide, an act of desperation but one of personal autonomy, should be legalised: people should be able to end their days - their only days - if they wish;

b) Murder, the act of killing somebody else or allowing them to die when it is possible to save them, is and should be illegal.

As a Marxist and an atheist, I am puzzled why anybody who claims to be left-wing in any way should condone the killing of other people, no matter what sort of garbage reason they can come up with. We each have one life, that's all, no after-life, one brief flash of light in between eternities. We don't go to heaven afterwards, we don't get a second go at it. One life, that's it.

Personal wills and voluntary euthanasia - if they can be managed, that's fine. But so often, the discussion degenerates into the killing of people who are too insensate to kill themselves, or who haven't clearly expressed such a desire - implicitly (and sometimes, from the above, not so implicitly) this is passed off as 'for the good of society' in some way.

Get something straight - it's not your call. It's up to the individual, and her/his autonomy, his/her right alone to make that decision. After all, it will be the last one they ever make and then - nothing. Forever.

And BTW, if someone does feel depressed enough to want to top themselves, surely there should be counsellors available to talk them through it all.

Death is not the answer: choose life - I've always thought, in my naive way, that that was the left-wing position. As a Marxist, I believe that's all there is, a short life, hopefully one which has made a contribution to our fellow humans, but then it's over. Don't rush us all off to Soylent Green just yet.

Dear Atman

"death camps for the elderly" is just the 'hard' statement of "Rationing healthcare" which is the soft version.

Does it really matter if you are in a death camp where a doctor says "work" or.."Selected" (with the ominous implications of the latter?)
OR
if you are in a hospital and a doctor mutters under his breath "Hmm.. better let this one go..too old"?

Two “standouts” on this thread I would like to endorse.

Loudmouth, well said, “You obscene b@stards.”

Proxy, I agree, Brian Holden should lead by example.

Many ex gov. ministers & bureaucrats definitely manage to prolong their fleecing the public purse purely through not having to half-wreck their bodies over 40 years..

Thanks divine_msn. I have been reading the posts waiting for one from somone who had a clear head.

The Department of Community Services is so underfunded that all evidence of child abuse can no longer be followed up. The abused child then has 70 years of psychological problems ahead of him.

If we had the money to spare for the intensive care of the over 80s, then that is OK. But we don't.

At 79 I have long supported voluntary euthanasia. It is, I believe , my right to determine what I wish to do with my life and/or death. I have been responsible for making decisions throughout my adult life, as is expected of all citizens. Allow me to continue to do so, legally.