Where oh where is Runner?

We can expect much more of the kind of religious nonsense depicted in the article as Christian religious sects continue to lose moderates while retaining extremists. Even the Sydney Anglican diocese is only a heartbeat away from declaring its independence of Canterbury and going it alone. The result will be increasing heat and dwindling light as the various sects dwindle through the stages from political force to pressure group to a bunch of old crackpots. Anyone caught up with the Theosophists lately?

Seeing that the Right Wing Prayer Warriors helped get GW Bush in power, where were they with Obama's victory?

It is interesting that John Howard attended meetings from similar groups in Australia.

They could do with the Sermon on the Mount to follow the middle Christian Road.

So interesting that both Gandhi and Mandela followed such a path though not declared Christians.

Jon, whatever else the Theosophists may or may not have done, they were one of the early groups that introduced the multi-various Hindu and Buddhist Wisdom Teachings to then (and now) barbarian West, which was already Spiritually and culturally bankrupt, or completely devoid of a Living Spiritual Tradition.

Such an endeavor was also part of the necessary process of breaking down the archaic cultural divisions of the world.

By contrast these prayer warriors are intent on amplifying these archaic cultural divisions, and even actively working to promote the "final" apocalyptic battle for "victory".

I live near Melbourne and the TS or Theosophical Book Shop is one of Melbourne's cultural treasures--a storehouse of the worlds practical and Esoteric Wisdom.

Can HoHum give me a run down on the Indian breaking down of Archaic divisions relative to their Caste system.
Religon, not for me thanks. More problems from all of you lot and you all want to do in other religons, it's laughable!

*Benny Hinn, an American televangelist, left Australia after his last visit with nearly $1 million in his pocket*

I guess there is a serious quid to be made out of selling people
hope and fear, the Americans seem to be pretty good at sucking
in the gullible. Even Palin made a fortune from her book and
was claimed to charge 100k$ for a tea party speech.

America is by far the most religious of Western nations. I still
think there is a genetic component to it. Many religious nuts
fled Europe for America, whilst Australia got the petty crims.

How lucky we were! The godsquad are an issue in Australia, but
fortunately a very small one.

But yes, we do have our small share of the Christian Taliban.
Its clearly quite profitable.

Ho Hum

'Where oh where is Runner?'

about to eat some food.

'But yes, we do have our small share of the Christian Taliban.
Its clearly quite profitable.'

Not nearly as profitable as the high priests of the global warming religion I would suggest.

The more I read of Alan's article the more similarities I see the Atheist left use to come up with their environmental religion.

What with their High Priests, their deceit, their nature worship, their false emails, their lies, mother earth, Benny Gore, their national lights out hours. Those 'wicked' Christians are such a worry.

I have no interest in religion or the so-call religious right, but if Alan Matheson is correct about these ‘worrying’ (to him) people, could it not be that the pendulum is doing what pendulums do: swing back?

Left wing influences, mainly from the Catholic, Anglican and Uniting churches have been busily trying to influence governments for a long time.

I accept the rights of people to practise their religion; I too object to any religion meddling in politics, other peoples’ lives or any secular activity at all. Religion should be kept private or among other of like mind.

However I believe that it’s impossible for people to vote against their religious scruples, and it is very hard for politicians to act against their religious scruples. We would have had voluntary euthanasia long ago if that were not true.

However, to blame the religious Right and not the religious Left (you don’t even hear of a religious Left!) is patently one-sided

The leftist websites don't ad's and articles about killing people. the right wingers often carry on about self defence, and as any student of history knows, many armed forces are built up under this type of cover.

Some light reading on a heavy issue, viewpoints that we don't normally hear.
Before anyone blows a gasket at the words "Christian Zionism" have no fear, I'm only quoting the views of dissident Jews since they're not bound by the Religion of Political Correctness and tend to write in plain English.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/max-blumenthal/israel-the-us-and-the-chr_b_26995.html
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20060814/new_christian_zionism

http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/not-in-my-name-an-analysis-of-jewish-righteousness-by-gilad.html

Many Thanks, Jay of Melbourne for the Information, not so truly Christian, as any good Christian should inform you.

Must say as a really aging Mature Age historian, the above has been worrying me very much so in the last couple of years.

Very especially now while noting the arrogance of Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders, easily making Hillary Clinton look half lost.

I and many other academic philosophers do fear that if the above situation is not remedied within the next few years, Western historical consciousness plus democratic consciousness, could be faced with something making Nazism look like a Sunday picnic.

Though there has lately been a saying that Israel with its present aggressive attitude will most likely be the loser, one right now may well ask for further opinions?

'The leftist websites don't ad's and articles about killing people'
No they just promote the mother's right to have her unborn killed. PLease give us a break.

I don't think we just need to go to the American Christian right ideology to find worrying signs of problems caused by religions.

Mainstream church leaders such as the Pope can provide some modern day examples of how not to have lived a good 'Christian" life.

Here we have an elected religious leader of many Catholics around the world who failed to act after it was reported to him that a US Priest was accused of sexually abusing 200 deaf children in the 1970's.

This Priest committed his sins while 'absolving' the deaf children of their sins in the confessional.

The then Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger did not sack the priest, but rather moved him on to another area in the priesthood.
This paedophile then went on to a free life while his victims spent a lifetime of sorrow and mental anguish because of his actions.

The Pope should be sacked now because of his inaction after this Priest was reported to him.
The stench of child abuse pervades this religion like no other.

Even older people seem to forget how a Christian nation like Germany backed Hitler, Christian churches operating during his reign.

In fact it was the German philosopher Hegel who was Christian, and even though right wing, was Karl Marx's tutor for a time.

A good tutor and promotor, Hegel even had strong influence on American people.

Also possibly on Australian students, for many years ago in the 1930's, I read an article from an Australian girl student who fully backed the young Hitler, her article gaining top marks from her tutor.

Possibly our older universities could have some of these in stock.

It is interesting also in later years how students from the earlier US Born Again groups were said to be acting more like Nazi Stormtroopers than just normal students.

Thus it might be a good idea to teach young students how right wing publicity can turn out even more socially dangerous than left-wing.

Certainly middle of the road literature is the most safest, even though said to be the most boring.

Right Wing thinking can turn out AS disastrously as Left Wing, the Nazi atrocities were techniques that the Soviets had perfected and used for years, in fact people sometimes mistakenly use pictures from the Holodomor to illustrate articles about the Holocaust.
We're long past that stage though.
We do have vestiges of the strictly dialectical points of view at the fringes but we're living under Third Positionists at present.
That's even more worrying because they come at us from all angles, they use Maoist political correctness, mixed with religious conservatism, and elements of Marxist Socialism and Libertarian capitalism.
A fourth position exists but it's largely paralysed, trying to decide what it's against rather than what it stands for.
So a fifth position is needed, as bewildering as that sounds, one that will use any means necessary and run right up to the limits of acceptable speech and action, disregard all Taboos and safe zones in order to gain the best outcome for Western society.

The "Religious Left?"

Who would they be?
"Family Second" perhaps, and what Biblical fundamentalist views would they hold?

That - plus tying in global warming - seems like a Reich Wing distraction from the real issue.

Dear Ho Hum,
Jeasus taught us the right ideology on how to pray in the sermon on the mount found in the bible Matthew chapter 6 verse 9.
Our Father - (of the human race) in heaven - (where his home is),
Hallowed be your name - (Most important in our life)
Your kingdom come. (we have to invite God to come to rule over us)
Your will be done on earth (as opposed to our will) (willpower)
on earth as it is in heaven. (Use your God given imagination to see the difference)
Give us this day our daily bread. ( God will provide each day if we allow him to be our father, just as any father provides for a child he loves, body, soul, and spirit for our every need for today. Tomorrow is not here and when it comes it is today, so don't fret for your future).
and forgive us our debts, (our reasonable duty to our father, left undone)
as we forgive our debtors. (obligation for what we have done for others or others reasonable duty to us left undone) Always remember what you sow you reap.
And do not lead us into temptation, (wrong thinking leads to wrong doing)
But deliver us from the evil one. (Satin is the tempter who if the father of the worldly or evil system)
For Yours is the kingdom
and the power
and the glory forever.
Amen - (I Agree)

They are to be taken seriously and are frightening. Words like fascist and similar are sometimes overused, but in this case they are apt. What is even more disturbing is that these groups are much like the brain addled "spiritualists" who provided the cover for Hitler's Germany. Make no mistake about it, if there is evil in this world it is these people and their cohorts in the fundamentalist Muslim world.

Couple these views with the incipient racism and sense of entitlement of much of the Australian population and we have the recipe for a true disaster. Perhaps the promise that the "Promise Keepers" wants to keep is the promise to instate an authoritarian state in Australia?

Most of the time White people are criticised for their lack of unity and extreme individualism when so called "good" deeds are demanded of them.
Nobody ever says anything about the fact that when they do unite into a mass movement it's always behind a truly bad idea.
If White people are rallying to a certain position then it can't be seen as good for them or anyone else.
It's easy to trick us White people into cults of personality and stupid ideas like Judeao Christianity,Socialism or Nationalism.
The fact is that one of our racial weaknesses is a tendency to question our own existence, even our RIGHT to exist. You don't come across that very often in other races, it's our Achilles heel.
That's why Apocalyptic thinking is so attractive to us and why every mass movement from Christianity, to Marxism to Climatism has used the same techniques.
Ever heard of a Buddhist suicide cult?

Dear Yabby,
Benny Hinn, an American televangelist, left Australia after his last visit with nearly $1 million in his pocket.
Have you audited his books and are privy to the facts, or are you just giving your opinion. I am interested to know for without the facts we never know the truth and we are only repeating gossip.

Every day I say a little one sentence prayer:

Thank you God for making me an atheist.

My gratitude is redoubled when I read pieces like this one by Alan Matheson. I don't have to waste mental energy figuring out what's what. Left wing church, right wing church, whatever, it's all taurine fertiliser.

I used to be fairly tolerant of religion. The older I get the more I realise religion is a truly malign and evil force in the world. Not the only malign force; but probably the one that's doing the most damage in 2010.


ALAN MATHESON,

you sound like a decent bloke. Ditch the fairy stories, take a deep breath, smell the roses and join the us atheists. Life is both more pleasant and more moral when you free your brain of the virus of religion.

Jay of Melbourne, whether it be christian folklore or hellenistic folklore< the simplicity of the sermon on the mount can teach us plenty

so much the middle of the road and so much found in sound philosophical reasoning

as thomas aquinas discovered when he hoped for wisdom and understanding

also as nelson mandela felt after years and years in a south african gaol

Richie, the two little *, one at each end of the sentence, meant
I was quoting and it came straight from the article itself.

The amount certainly did not surprise me, for we know that tele
evangalism is a huge business. Enough has been written about
money pouring into the so called US bible belt and tv is how they
make the majority of it.

But look, send in your money if its buying you hope. Some people
spend it on a shrink, some give it to the religious cults. Both
are seeking peace of mind, which they seemingly can't deal with
on their own.

Dear Yabba,
It is the amount that surprises me for our currency laws are enforced at our exit points and if B.H. was taking out nearly 1 million he would be breaking our currency law and it destroys his witness.
Jesus said if we could not believe his words then believe the miracles for they are impossible for man. Though *every* man be a liar God is still true and I find it very hard to believe that the devil wouldn't challenge authority of the word. I have walked with Jesus too long to take your word over his.

Richie, I'd be surprised if the author has had the opportunity to audit the books, from what I've been able to find on it Hinn is anything but transparent about finances. Some of his strongest critics on this appear to be other christain's concerned not just about Hinn's "witness" but the harm done to the whole church but those who operate the way he (and others do).

What level of accountability do you think someone in his position should have if they care about their witness?

- Do you think much of the bad reputation televangelists could be reduced if their financial dealings were out in the open?
- Do you think it honors christ while televangelists continue to be the subject of financial rumor and continue to be very secretive about their finances?

I don't agree with the idea that if you have nothing to hide the idea of privacy does not matter but in this case I get the impression that much of the money is being taken under false pretexts, that many of those giving believe that they are in some way giving to god rather than to support the trimmings of personal wealth for the preacher.

By the way there are plenty of legal ways of taking money out of the country, other visiting entertainers presumably make profit's from their tours but at least those who pay them don't think that the money is for something else.

R0bert

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/pastor-leaves-800k-richer/story-e6freoof-1111115627614

Richie, according to this Courier Mail story, Hinn certainly did
clean up in Brisbane!

Still, if you don't see a problem with a preacher who flies around
in his own 36 million$ Gulfstream jet and asks for individual
donations of up to 10'000$, that is your choice.

There is clearly huge money to be made out of religion, which was
my point.

Yabby wrote:

"There is clearly huge money to be made out of religion,..."

You're right. Sometimes I say to myself there are all these gullible Christians out there waiting to be fleeced, begging to be relieved of their money. And I ask myself:

How can I get a piece of the action?

Why should Benny Hinn and Pat Robertson get all the money?

Why I can't I get my share?

If anyone here has any ideas on how to fleece Christians, or adherents of any other religion, of a few dollars let me know. All ideas welcome. If your idea works I'll give you 10% of the profits.

So posters, release your inner con artist. Religion offers a way of conning people legally. And if you arrange matters carefully you don't even have to pay taxes on your ill-gotten gains.

Don't think of Christians with contempt.

Think of them as cash cows.

'Still, if you don't see a problem with a preacher who flies around
in his own 36 million$ Gulfstream jet and asks for individual
donations of up to 10'000$, that is your choice.'

Is Yabby speaking about Al Gore by any chance?

Steven the thing is, you will never have to actually deliver or
prove anything, just push those primitive hope and fear buttons
hard enough, in a way that sounds credible.

The everlasting fires of judgement day seem to scare them, the
claim that they won't really die at all, gives them hope. So
the idea is to sell them a ticket to heaven, if they pay
enough.

If you take a look at our OLO examples of runner and richie,
they seem pretty well brainwashed, unable to cope with life
without seeing it only through their tiny perspective.

So I am sure that their cheque books open up, when somebody
tells them what they want to hear. It might even buy them
a ticket to live forever!

Benny Hinn is pretty good at it, or the true believers would not be donating
100 million a year to him.

Good acting helps too, in case the preacher is caught fooling around.
Remember the Bakers? "I have sinned" with big tears rolling down
his eyes, when he was caught out fooling around on Tammy. But the
millions still rolled in.

So its all about emotional buttons and pushing the right ones, until
the Christian cash cow bell rings loudly. Hinn has clearly shown
how loudly it can ring, if you do it well!

Dear Yabby,
The reason why we give is you Yabba,for God is Love and he loves you even you. For once we were lost and the good shepherd loved this lost sheep, me, enough to leave his home and come down and give his life for me and all the lost sheep, so money is not the treasure in our life any more, as it once was and we sow into the kingdom to finance the harvest of lost sheep. Harvesting is one of the most expensive parts of bringing in the crop and Love is our motivation. Foolishness to a lost world. When Jesus comes into your life and saves your mind, will, and emotions (soul, Foxy) only then will you understand. He is a gentleman and never comes in uninvited. ( Lo! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him and he with me). Faith is the substance of things hoped for and without faith we will never call on the saviour.{Only the drowning recognise their need for the lifesaver}. Jesus came for the sick and lost sinner, the hungry and the hurting for the healthy see no need for a Doctor so they are not hungry for a healing.

Alan thanks for your research into the alarming activities and beliefs of the Chritian right idealogy in the US and their recruitment in Australia. In my view, we have an emerging terrorist threat when anyone sees themselves on a mission to herald in God's Kingdom on Earth by means of military training in readiness for an Armageddon.

Murdock's Fox media has been a willing conduit for right wing religious rantings. Sarah Palin's recent political advertisements showing Democrat states in the sniper's cross-hairs typifies the extemist message aimed to appeal and unite God fearing gun lovers.

The metaphorical endorsement of the use weapons to achieve their political and religious crusade is not without serious risks. Some of the more unbalanced members of extremist Republicanism may take the message of vehement opposition to liberals, moderates and secularists literally. Recent arrests of Christian militants training and equipped for domestic terrorist activities should be a wake up call to those who thought that Chistians could never engage in such extreme violent measures.

The fact that Australian taxpayers fund 95% of teachers in religious schools is of great concern. Why is a secular state using public money to indoctrinate children in delusional teaching such as creationism, intelligent design and currupting minds with religious indoctrination and in some cases like exclusive Bretheren and Scientology, a life of cult servitude? Both Labor and the Coalition should phase out all subsidies from all reglious schools, using the additional funds to bolster secular government education to the high standards that Australians deserve.

Alan Matheson,

Thank you for your article. I quietly call myself a Christian, while taking exception to some of the beliefs, words and deeds of some people who profess the same orientation. But I had no idea of the size or strength in Australia of the dangerous groups you mention.

You've called the alert and I'm now truly alarmed. Yes Alan, we must worry -- and do something about it. Thanks again.

What do mainstream Christians have to say about the increase in numbers and profligacy of Christian Terrorist groups?

According to the Christian Science Monitor:

>> The Hutaree is one of 127 armed militias in the US, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), a nonprofit organization in Montgomery, Ala., that tracks hate groups nationwide. That number has increased 200 percent since 2008, when there were 42, SPLC says.

There is “no question” the catalyst was President Obama’s election, says Heidi Beirich, the center’s director of research. A similar upswing took place after President Clinton’s election in 1993. Militias and the antigovernment groups that spawn them often become more active when the federal government turns more liberal.

“A major shift to the left certainly helped” in both cases, Ms. Beirich says.

The economic meltdown and the growth of minorities such as Latinos are also a factor, she adds.
Who are the Hutaree?

Federal authorities say the Hutaree started to conduct military-style training in Michigan’s Lenawee County in August 2008.

After debating different scenarios, the group decided upon killing a local law enforcement official and attacking the subsequent funeral procession, the indictment says. The indictment says the Hutaree planned to use “improvised explosive devices” and “explosively formed projectiles” that, authorities say, qualify as weapons of mass destruction.

The group accelerated training in February and March with plans to carry out the attack in April, the indictment states.

The Hutaree is unique because it interacted with militia groups outside Michigan, notes Beirich. Many groups the size of the Hutaree tend to be insular and segregated from larger groups. The Hutaree, however, had 350 MySpace members despite its apparently small membership.
Christian connection

On its website, the Hutaree uses Christian terminology and Bible quotes that position it as a military organization prepared to confront an Antichrist. “Jesus wanted us to be ready to defend ourselves using the sword and stay alive using equipment.… We, the Hutaree, are prepared to defend all those who belong to Christ and save those who aren’t,” a passage reads. <<

Full article at:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2010/0329/Hutaree-militia-arrests-point-to-tripling-of-militias-since-2008

Catholics, muslims, jews, inquisition, priests, witnesses.
By their deeds you will know them.