The Forum > General Discussion > China! China! China! China!....
China! China! China! China!....
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Posted by stevenlmeyer, Thursday, 26 April 2012 8:50:33 PM
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I'll believe it when I see it.$15 trillion debt for the Govt and how many $ trillions more for private individuals?
The Central Banksters Steven, have us all by the balls.They own Greece and Italy.Do you think they will give up now? Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 26 April 2012 10:51:35 PM
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An interesting observation stevenlmeyer. But is it particularly surprising? I would have thought that it is simply the economies of manufacturing following an entirely predictable and natural progression.
The major factor in the early equation for manufacturing overseas and importing the resulting product was labour costs. When the manufacturing country was able to improve its own economy through a boost in labour participation rates, it did so largely through paying substantially less to its workforce. The workers themselves benefited from employment they would otherwise not have, and the employing business reaped the benefit of low-cost production. However, this will always, inevitably, change. Expectations created by a new population of (relatively) well-off workers will create an internal demand for better conditions and... more money. Over time, this will bring the labour cost factor into competition with the inconvenience of distance, the difficulty of remote management, the challenges of maintaining quality and so on. This has nothing to do with China - it is a cycle that has already taken place in many other Asian countries. But - and there always is a but - the US that these manufacturers will "return" to, is itself a different place. The economic hold that business now has over its native workforce is far higher than it was when the jobs were exported. Unions are, quite naturally, less eager to fight for their workers' pay and conditions, as their members nowadays, quite realistically, want jobs more badly than they feel the need for featherbedding. And the advances in automation that have occurred in the meantime will also contribute to the productivity that is essential to making the “Made in the U.S.A.—Again.” decision. >>What about Australia? Will we be left behind?<< That depends. What, in your opinion, are the manufacturing industries that we should bring back onshore, and reap the same economic benefit that the US can see? In fact, can you think of any at all? Posted by Pericles, Friday, 27 April 2012 9:15:32 AM
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Pericles
You're quite right. As manufacturing productivity continues to grow exponentially labour costs become an ever smaller percentage of the total. That makes other costs such as transport and the costs of being far from your factory and of your factory being far from your markets assume ever greater importance. Even the "inconvenience cost" starts becoming important. Have you seen this clip? How to build a Volkswagen? (See: http://www.youtube.com/embed/nd5WGLWNllA?rel=0) I think we're only at the beginning of the automation revolution. You ask: >>What, in your opinion, are the manufacturing industries that we should bring back onshore, and reap the same economic benefit that the US can see? In fact, can you think of any at all?>> No I can't. AND THAT'S THE PROBLEM! Moreover I think China's growth will start slowing and that has profound implications for Australia. I have no doubt that China will emerge as a great power. I don't think they're going to implode. But at the same time I don't think they're going to supplant the USA as the number one great power just yet and, given their rapidly aging population, maybe never. Posted by stevenlmeyer, Friday, 27 April 2012 9:49:49 AM
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Last weeks Economist special report on manufacturing and how it is
changing, made for interesting reading. According to their chart, the US still manfuctures as much stuff as China, so its a myth that US manufacturing died. Its just highly automated these days, requiring far less workers. It also makes high value items, as compared to cheap consumer products as China does. The other interesting analysis was the value of an Apple Ipad and where the money goes. Parts are made all around the world, from Europe, the US, Korea, Japan. Assembly is in China, but that is a fraction of the value. Most profits go for IP to Apple. But now of course, Apple's new star market for selling Iphones and Ipads is you guessed it, China! A few limited companies in Australia will compete Steven, but I'd say that in general, Australia provides such cushy welfare, that many opt not to work. We'll just remain a mine and a farm. We can't even train enough doctors to fill the country's needs. Australians have simply had it too good for too long Posted by Yabby, Friday, 27 April 2012 10:01:05 AM
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my site...had something.. re the 60 billion gm bailout
going to china..to buld industry i tried to find it its must be in here..somwhere its going global the first of many http://www.fcpablog.com/blog/2012/4/3/the-corporate-investigations-list-march-2012.html dirt..[i got dirt] these guys are busy too 1st amendment[ammended] http://revolutionarypolitics.tv/video/viewVideo.php?video_id=18636 CISPA Bill To Remove Your 4th Amendment http://revolutionarypolitics.tv/video/viewVideo.php?video_id=18635 the world is rotten 10 corperations running a scam http://www.businessinsider.com/these-10-corporations-control-almost-everything-you-buy-2012-4 the party system corrupt http://www.businessinsider.com/the-presidents-new-rules-for-killing-people-with-drones-over-yemen-is-unbelievable-2012-4 i recall much more at my news paper http://whatreallyhappened.com/ but noted this http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/private-prison-corporations-are-slave.html wunder how the states..will go here [who' egsempted from that list] how many states..allready got privatised prison aggrements? are they egsempt? whats with the 90 occupancy..for 20 years..[guarentee] blackwater at it again? http://blog.alexanderhiggins.com/2012/04/26/war-table-backed-mercenaries-training-syria-terrorists-126981/ CIA KILLS US TROOPS http://aangirfan.blogspot.com/2012/04/cia-kills-us-troops.html Why would the CIA want to kill American soldiers and blame the killings on Moslems?http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=30545 "To enrage American troops.. http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/04/25/israel-military-chief-iran-not-pursuing-nuclear-weapon/ so that the slaughter continues". http://jewishvoiceforpeace.org/blog/60-minutes BUT HOW..get rid of cash ecomony or shut down anyone http://foodfreedomgroup.com/2012/04/23/obama-seizes-farmers-money/ http://www.blacklistednews.com/Russia_And_Mexico_Both_Buy_Nearly_%241_Billion_Worth_Of_Gold_In_March/19157/0/38/38/Y/M.html little wonder http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57420551-93/who-owns-your-files-on-google-drive/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/internet/9225370/Acta-treaty-unacceptable-says-European-Data-Protection-Service.html http://www.activistpost.com/2012/04/10-facts-about-americas-energy.html yes we going to need HONEST JUDGES* who can we trust? i dont trust neither*..party..nor country but im fine with china..get over it.. our grandchildren will be part chinese...its abouit the people..not the corperations[see who controls what]..link the world is rotten 10 corperations running a scam http://www.businessinsider.com/these-10-corporations-control-almost-everything-you-buy-2012-4 which are chinese? Posted by one under god, Friday, 27 April 2012 10:35:55 AM
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REPATRIATING JOBS: U.S. MANUFACTURING GAINS MOMENTUM
http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-04-20/repatriating-jobs-u-dot-s-dot-manufacturing-gains-momentum
>>Maybe the once-ubiquitous label, “Made in the U.S.A.” should be updated to: “Made in the U.S.A.—Again.”
According to a survey by my firm, Boston Consulting Group, 37 percent of U.S.-based manufacturing executives at companies with sales greater than $1 billion are planning to bring back production to the U.S., or are “actively considering” doing so. The rate was even higher, 48 percent, among executives at companies with $10 billion or more in revenues. This is the first time we’ve surveyed executives on this topic, but five years ago almost no one talked about reshoring. It was all about outsourcing.>>
ARE THE U.S. AND CHINA TRADING PLACES?
http://articles.marketwatch.com/2012-04-17/economy/31354552_1_michael-pettis-china-export-growth
>>In the United States, meanwhile, there has been a string of four positive monthly employment reports. … Manufacturing production, in particular, has grown impressively, underscoring recent optimism about the “re-onshoring” of previously offshored manufacturing jobs.
American manufacturing, in other words, is back. U.S. companies have taken the Great Recession as an opportunity to streamline their operations and boost productivity….>>
But maybe not UK
OFFSHORING AND ONSHORING: IT'S ALL A BIT MORE COMPLEX THAN YOU THINK
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/03/21/ofshoring-and-onshoring-its-all-a-bit-more-complex-than-you-think/
>>This is an interesting little tale of a small British company trying to reshore, … There are most certainly benefits of doing so:
[…]
A few months on, and Tainton cuts a frustrated figure: his experience of trying to manage a UK manufacturing base has been characterised by inefficiency, high levels of absenteeism and a skills shortage.
“Most young people in Brighton have degrees, but they often lack the life skills even to get to work on time.”
He’s been most shocked, however, by departing staff who have told him they regard unemployment as a lifestyle choice. “We’ve had lots who have just quit because they said they prefer to be on the dole and housing benefit,” he says. “I hate the waste. I felt sick with stress the whole time I was on the dole. I’ve found not everyone shares that view.”>>
What about Australia?
Will we be left behind?