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The Forum > Article Comments > Divergence grows between China and the West - part I > Comments

Divergence grows between China and the West - part I : Comments

By Xu Sitao, published 31/12/2008

The rest of the world fails to appreciate Chinaís concerns over its own domestic challenges.

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If we know our Holy Bibles, Chinas final move is the outward march across asia, the Euphrates River, and on towards Israel and "a place called Armageddon".

If we click on The Kings Of The East we can bring a vision up a 200 million man army, killing a third of mankind (Kings Of The East also found in Revelation 9:16 and 16:12).

That 200 million is the same number of soldiers Mao said he could put into the field way back in the early 60's.

Turn around now and look back down the timeline from the appearance of that huge asian confederacy army... to today...and we can clearly see the root of its rise.

Out of the present economic crisis...China is going to war.
And there is no USA to stop her. Nothing stops her march.

A number of visions and prophecies to the christians of Australia suggests she is coming here too.
I wonder if Defence will be ready?
Posted by Gibo, Wednesday, 31 December 2008 7:22:16 PM
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Xu, that was a very good article.

The last thing China needs to do is to take economic advice from the United States.

China already knows what the United States has forgotten: centralised planning of the economy does not work. It leads to economic disorder - resources being used to satisfy the less urgent wants of the consumers instead of the more urgent wants. It also leads to the immorality of government forcibly taking from A and giving to B.

Government policies of easy money cause inflation and malinvestment on a vast scale. Capital flows into investments that would not otherwise qualify on the basis of profit and loss. Such investments only appear to be profitable because of the general expectation of rising prices, which is caused by government policy.

The problem can only end in one of two ways. Either the government stops inflating the money supply, in which case it becomes apparent that the investments are not profitable. A recession results as the market washes out the malinvestments and reallocates capital and labour to productive purposes. Or government continues to inflate, causing hyper-inflation and the eventual breakdown of the monetary unit as the medium of exchange.

It is not China's job to clean up the mess caused by the US government. Government injecting funds merely takes money from productive people and pays it to failed businesses. Why should the people be forced to pay for failed businesses? They should be left to fail. Propping them up only delays and increases the problem. Why should the people not be free to buy cars, or whatever, at lower prices from competing businesses who are better able to serve the consumers wants?

The unemployment that follows if government stops propping up failed businesses is caused because employment was misdirected by government monetary policy of lowering interest rates below the market rate.

Economic policy should follow the maxim of the ancient Taoists: "masterful inactivity", and teach the people that government interventions can only make the problem worse, not better.

mises.org
Posted by Diocletian, Thursday, 1 January 2009 10:56:56 AM
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Diocletian

A most interesting shift has occurred here since the financial debacle.

Chinese hosts on chat, panel and discussion shows on the one and only English channel, previously deferred to American guests and remained fairly objective in the reception of their views.

When the collapse first occurred we had quite a number of American "experts" appearing whose agenda can best be described as brown nosing. But when it became clear that China was not going to respond in the way they wished some became overtly didactic.

One, in full flood, was lecturing Beijing (Americans never refer to China or The Government or Politicians: one wonders if there is a Secret Seven-type acronym behind their directing of every remark to a city rather than a political or governing body: Bloody Enigmatic Inscrutible Jap-cloned & Irritating Nasty Gooks, perhaps?)on its responsibilities.

These were, at base, to hand over their Reserves so that America could save the world. China's shirking of this duty would, apparently, position her as the author of world chaos.

The female interviewer leaned forward and actually interrupted him by cooing sweetly: "Our responsibility? Wasn't Wall Street where the whole crisis originated?"

In view of Western journalistic tactics this might be seen as pretty mild - but in a Chinese context this was Huge!

It also stopped the "expert" dead in his tracks.
Posted by Romany, Thursday, 1 January 2009 1:25:01 PM
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I appreciate the Chinese dilemma. I teach in a Chinese

tertiary institution, and stepping outside the college gates

daily, thank my lucky stars that I don't face the desperate

future of the ragged people I see all around me.

Having said that, the Chinese polity has not always been

wise. No doubt China does need to turn from export driven

growth to domestic consumption. However, Chinese rich or

poor are hesitant to spend, and the key to encouraging

spending is social security : health services and income

and aged support (not more police!). China has historically

underspent on social security, and often foolishly deploys

what it has. For example, by an OECD statistic (2004)

there are 600 road deaths daily and 42,000 injuries DAILY.

That is an enormous and unnecessary drain on scarce

medical resources.

No country can depend, even medium term, on generating

8% annual compound growth just to provide enough jobs to

stave off political disintegration. There is no obvious quick

fix for China here, but key factors are education and

population size. For example the surest way to lower birth

rates is to educate women for skills and hence

independence. The surest way to help landless peasants is

also to give them real skills. Historically China has had one

of the lowest per capita investments in education of any

country, and again poorly deploys what it does spend. Note

that, typically, the latest 4 trillion yuan stimulus package is

overwhelmingly directed to building roads, railways and

buildings, with little for education and social services. That

is, it's band-aid stuff.
Posted by Wry, Friday, 2 January 2009 10:38:20 PM
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Reduced to its simplest terms, here is the Chinese "business model."

Me: I want to buy a toaster but I donít have the money.

Businessman: Here's a low interest loan. Go buy a toaster.

One year later:

Me: I cannot repay the toaster loan.

Businessman: Don't worry. I'll roll over the toaster loan. And here's another low interest loan so you can buy a plasma TV.

Another year later:

Me: I can't repay the toaster or TV loans.

Businessman: I'll roll over the toaster and TV loans. And here's another low interest loan so you can buy a new telephone.

The following year:

Me: I cannot repay the toaster, TV and telephone loans.

Businessman: I'll roll over the ....

And so on ad infinitum.

Except that it cannot go on ad infinitum. At some point this process collapses.

I am surprised it has lasted this long.

The fact that Wall Street and the Bush administration messed up does not mean that the Chinese Government got it right. There is plenty of blame to go around for the current economic crisis. The Chinese leadership needs to recognise that their lunatic economic model contributed to the problem.
Posted by stevenlmeyer, Sunday, 4 January 2009 8:12:57 AM
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I want to respect China but cant because of the way it treats its own people regarding Human Rights before we even consider Tibet.

With Australia I am disgusted. First we pretend we are unaware of the inequalities in Western Australiai's ie: during the so called "BOOM" and as the crunch arrives we pretend [regardless of true warnings] that we didnt see it coming. Hence the distortions from Business, Ministers in ACT. And now it is the Joker as we ride on the back of China.... with little concern of their people, their social issues, that are serious.

While I support fair trade and exchange I have no regard for the terms where civic issues are oppressed because of economic interests.

I ask for transparencey from China and Australia and am grateful of any trade that is productive provided it is founded on honest relations.

Over inflated prices everywhere have created ugly the light we worked hard to create. We argue irrational concepts that impact and do little to see through our own fear, on this day, during this year.

As Australians ought to get real with ourselves, come clean and work from now on for real solid ground.

To the government I am critical of "my country" speechs where households already in debt are given false-conflicting-versions-of-pretense. I see the motive as ugly - weak and manipulating.

I wish strength as a Nation. To have courage to face what we know is occuring with dignity rather than more spin and lies. I support anyone with spine. I will be outspoken of hopefulness that is used as a card for improvements and smear the coat of those who are cheap and self-serving.

The ball is in our hands not China's less you forget. A plant cant grow without proper root less you strip, stretch and leach the soil of nourishment.

The real cost or price is based on what you think something is worth. I say work for what you need and dream for what you want and help make the difference.

http://www.miacat.com
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Posted by miacat, Monday, 5 January 2009 3:40:34 AM
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