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The Forum > Article Comments > Diversity the destination for journey into Islam > Comments

Diversity the destination for journey into Islam : Comments

By Irfan Yusuf, published 1/2/2008

The things that divide us within communities are, in truth, the things that truly unite us as human beings.

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History emphatically has shown, that religious bigots and fanatics are MONOLITHIC. And contemporary Islam as we witness it, is replete with these two elemental curses that inexorably guide the actions of its true believers who live and die by the SUICIDAL VISION of the thirty-two virgins. To assert therefore as Irfan does, 'that we don't have to be enemies after all' because our enemies are not 'MONOLITHIC', indicates clearly that the writer of this piece has misread history and hence takes a "terminal" flight from present reality.

http://kotzabasis1australiaagainst.blogspot.com
Posted by Themistocles, Friday, 1 February 2008 5:41:18 PM
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Dear Themistocles,

I think you've missed the point the author was trying to make.
'History may emphatically have shown, that religious bigots and fanatics are monolithic'... (although it often depends on whose version of history you're reading). The point the author was making however was you shouldn't generalise about an entire group of people.
Because within that group there are so many differences. You shouldn't tar everyone with the same brush.

Just as not all Jews are alike, nor all Catholics, nor any one else of
any other religion. Be it Judaism, Catholicism, Protestanism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism and so on. There are sects within the religions,
and different versions are followed.

To get to know people on an individual basis - we may indeed find that we have more in common as human beings than we first realized.
Stereotyping people is not highly recommended especially if we want cohesion in our society, justice, and a 'Fair go' for all.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 1 February 2008 6:43:28 PM
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I think Irfan and Jason both misjudge the US invasion of Iraq, and of Afghanistan for that matter. Many also fail to understand the impact on moderate Muslims of the economic, political and military support the US gives to Israel and the consequent impoverishment and statelessness this creates for the Palestinians.

I think the basic premise - that the US is driven by good intentions - is completely wrong. The US is a declining economic power. It uses military force as a warning to China, Euorpe and uppity States like Iran that it will use that military force to try to bolster or at least maintain its economic dominance.

I know George W is sincere when he calls for democracy in the Middle East. You only have to look at his friends to realise that.

To name a few, there’s the dictatorship that runs Saudi Arabia. There’s the dictatorship that runs Jordan. There’s the dictatorship that runs Egypt. There’s the dictatorship that runs Kuwait. All are US allies.

And then there are the actions of the US in supporting democracy in the Middle East.

In 1953 the CIA overthrew the democratically elected Mossadeq Government in Iran. Its crime had been to nationalise the oil industry for the benefit of the Iranian people. The coup re-instated the Shah and opened up Iranian oil fields to US companies.

In 1992 the Islamic Salvation Front was going to sweep into power in the second round of elections in Algeria. The Army annulled the elections and has ruled with US and European support ever since. 30,000 have died in the civil war that resulted from this denial of democracy.

Then in 2006 Hamas won an overwhelming majority in the Palestinian elections. The West cut off aid. It has supported the minority Fatah Government and isolated the Gaza strip where Hamas is still in control. Israel has imposed collective punishment on the people in Gaza with US support.

The lesson is clear. When it comes to a clash between US interests and democracy, democracy takes a back seat.
Posted by Passy, Friday, 1 February 2008 6:52:47 PM
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My dear Foxy,

It's prudent before you criticize someone not to misread him. I did not say nor even implied that all Muslims are monolithic. I specifically referred to the bigots and fanatics, i.e., the monolithic, who are our enemies. Are you denying, whatever version of history you have read, that history clearly shows that GENERALLY bigots and fanatics are monolithic?

http://kotzabasis1australiaagainst.blogspot.com
Posted by Themistocles, Friday, 1 February 2008 10:00:34 PM
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Dear foxy,
You are a very mature and responsible person, may be you are working for Human Rights Commission. You have right, I traveled in many countries, more than fifty, I visited many Muslim countries, I have Muslim friends. Most of them are very good persons, honest and very generous. Few months before I was in Sydney and I asked a young person for the train station to go to airport. He answered me that he will pass from the station and asked me to enter in his car. He was Muslim and instead to take me to train station he took me direct for the airport. Most Muslim political leaders are brutal and they stand on American guns and support, Muslim people have right to be disappointed with westerners , they are the victims. Muslim religious leaders are conservative, they use the Sharia law and jihaad. I disagree with both of them which creates huge problems on Muslims. mainly on Muslim women. The truth is that Muslim people have problems not only in their countries from their leaders but overseas from Europeans, Americans or Australians. Not long time ego I had to threaten workers in my workplace that I will phone to Human Rights Commission to remove from a board a photo with Muslim girls and bad comments.
Our behavior to Muslim people in Australia is bad and we push them to the corner.
We must separate the Muslim people from Muslim leaders and of cause from the Muslim extremists, a very small minority.
Muslims in Australia need our support and understanding.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide
Posted by ASymeonakis, Saturday, 2 February 2008 7:34:37 AM
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Dear Themistocles,

Read my earlier post again. It's not a personal criticism of you. It's simply pointing out that you missed the point the author was trying to make. If you re-read the author's original piece on this forum I'm sure you'll see the point I'm making and that it's quite valid.

Dear Antonios,

Thank you for your kind words. It's always interesting to hear what you have to say - because you speak with logic and fairness. Something we can all use.
Posted by Foxy, Saturday, 2 February 2008 9:28:40 AM
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