"an ideology that will destroy the Australian economy built by the Coalition."
Well done Coalition....must be hard building an economy that has ridden on the back on one of the biggest resource booms in history.

"Labor is eager to shelve industrial relations reforms implemented by the Howard Government. It will remove WorkChoices or radically scale back the reforms the legislation introduced."
This is where John Howard has lost it, the most heinous piece of policy ever drafted. This has cost him the election and rightly so....

I don't have nearly such a clear sense of what the ALP would destroy as our learned contributors do. With any luck, and if this Government finally receives the defeat it deserves (after so many attempts to lose), something or other may get broken. Destroying AWAs would be nice. So would a bit of cut and run on military adventurism.

Anyway, Mr Deane and Ms McMahon may be relieved to receive assurances that the ALP is not the "unrepentantly socialist Party" they fear. Labor is not really unrepentant about anything. On the one hand, that might be why its MPs and state governments were so willing to rally in support of a national apology to the stolen generations. On the other hand, it makes them very reluctant to stand for much at all.

The optimists among us hope that Rudd is minimising his commitments, picking his battles selectively, reasoning that electoral victory will free him up to do whatever it is he really stands for. After all, that worked for Howard in 1996. Sadly, I think Howard had a clearer idea of what he stood for -- unrepentantly so.

By the way, I keep asking, but nobody has offered me a satisfactory answer yet: WHAT IS A WORKING FAMILY? (One sentence will do fine, as long as it is a nice clear one.)

I believe a working family is one where people in the family work.

So Tom due to labor being unrepentant this must be why this is going on and why the labor party does not want the full picture out there or even tell the truth.

One would also have to question the ethics of the labor party due to the number of people going to court as pedophiles.

Thats right a labor party president who had resigned.

But this has to question the relationship between labor and the church. This makes one wonder how rife this problem is within the labor party as they like keeping their little secrets.

If the papers and parties want to keep this hidden, i am quite happy to bring it out as I have a special needs daughter and do not need this from a party who says they are there to represent the people.

Keep your children safe.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent Candidate for Charlton
swulrich@bigpond.net.au

A “socialist” Labor Party “dominated by a fear of progress”? I can’t see that, even with an electron microscope. I guess that is why the people of Australia have elected Labor to govern their states and territories in 21 consecutive elections. They look at the real achievements of Labor Governments, and they just want more.

If we choose Kevin Rudd, we will have fast broadband, improvements to education, improvements to our working lives via the end of WorknotcalledChoicesanymore, one of the worst pieces of legislation to be inflicted on the Australian people, a denial of the essence of Australian life built up over a century ago.

“Kevin Rudd is no John Howard.” That’s why he will win.

Thank you for responding, James. Should that mean Rudd is ignoring those families where nobody has a job? Or those selfish workers who lack families to go home to? Or would it mean children and the elderly need to pull their weight?

I know am a pedant -- unrepentantly so, Alexander and Felicity! -- but this term is a rhetorical centrepiece. If Labor wins, it looks set to become the litmus test of every policy and funding scheme imaginable. A bit like Steve Fielding reborn as a union organiser. (That might make him a Catholic, but bear with me.)

Anyway, that is why I want to know what it means actually, specifically, and concretely.

The latest Crosby/Textor polling must have come in- the Coalition has given up on the filthy character attacks on Rudd's dead father and attacking his wife.

Now the best this tired side of politics has got is attacking Mr Rudd for not falling into Howard's blatant political wedges and a cold war era attack on the labor party as apart of the socialist conspiracy.

The last socialist government floated the dollar, privatised the commonwealth bank & QANTAS, deregulated the financial markets, cut tariffs and moved from a centralised wage fixing to EBAs.

Many of these reforms were what John Howard as treasurer was too gutless to touch.

This opinion piece is another example of the political desperation in the Liberal Party that is so structurally and intellectually weakened that it will descend into unelectable anarchy when it loses the federal election.

It may appear to the authors that Kevin Rudd is 'Mini-Me John Howard'. Upset that Rudd's not falling for Howard's wedges, Rudd gets sledged as an echo. It's desperate slurs from the losing side of politics.

Despite the slurs, Rudd looks like becoming our next PM because many Australians want major reform in the way that government business is conducted in Australia.

Above all we need a government with integrity and transparency instead of the sleaze and corruption that has been the hallmark of Howard's regime.

Rudd is set to deliver a government that is prepared to tackle structural reform, with the huge efficiencies achievable through systematically stream-lining government decision-making and ending the Federal-State blame game.

Removing states from service delivery, strengthening and enlarging local government roles and addressing constitutional review including a bill of rights would be a good start for a Rudd government. Rudd is keeping his policy amunition under embargo for his election manifesto.

I look forward to fresh thinking in 2008 that will allow Australians to stand proud in the world community, dedicated to implementing the UN's Millenium Development Goals aimed at eradicating world poverty and in foreign policy, distancing ourselves from the lame duck 'Mini-me George W' and his disasterous crucade alliance of the gullible that has made OZ an enemy to the millions of ordinary citizens opposed to military adventurism in their homelands.

We should solidly support international treaties and not weaken the nuclear non-proliferation treaty with the typical back-door deals as occurred with the wheat deals with Saddam in the oil for food scandal.

mr clark, a working family is one where dad is not beating mum, or drinking up his wages, where mum is not poisoning dad or visibly having it off with the neighbors, and the kids attend school regularly, don't do a sideline in drugs or prostitution, and the dog doesn't attack postie. your ignorance is understandable, very few left of this standard.

non-working families get all the media attention, as do politicians, for much the same reasons: violence, corruption, greed.

I don't think public space should be given to party hacks to propagandize on their political opponents. I haven't and won't bother to read their stuff which should come with a warning..and OLO should demand ad costs. I am not a member of the ALP and would feel similar if these two hacks banged on from that side of the tracks.

Very confusing item. Uses the same data to argue two separate cases.

First you acclaim Howard's policies as being the best ever, so to speak. Next you attack Rudd for copying those policies you think are so brilliant.

Please explain as our favourite daughter would say. How is it wonderful for Howard to have such policies and not for Rudd? And don't tell us that Howard's policies are unique to him. You know fully well that prqactically everything he has done is s direct copy of either Bush but more frequently that Labor PM, Blair. If you don't agree then name some policies Howard HAS NOT copied.

If those policies are great then isn't it appropriate that Rudd uses them? Or did you want him to create ridiculous policies so we can reject them.

What you Coalition barrackers don't get is that :

. There is no left or right,
. Socialists disappeared some decades ago and the comrade stuff is limited to behind closed doors and usually Greens rather than Labor,
. Rudd does not have the baggage that Howard does. Howard has a record which isn't possible to record here. We all know what he has done. Some good, some bad and some purely aimed at destroying our way of life.

I'm surprised you didn't just write an item with one line, being :

"Lefties are bad people". Despite "lefties" disappearing some decades ago.

That covers your vision and views as I read it.

If you are going to claim an item as being some sort of analysis it is sometimes a good look to be unbiased. Disappointingly such items are rare here.

Well said Jup. Party Hacks and that's no surprise given Graham Young's previous career as a Coalition MP.

By the way Labor is just as bad and I will attack them when they get in. As I do at the State level so don't accuse me of being a biased Party hack.

It's the usual story though isn't it? The Coalition makes the unpopular changes because people are tired of the "Spend, spend, spend" attitude of the ALP. Then people get tired of the unpopular changes and think that the promises of the ALP equate with some sort of Nirvana.
Rudd can afford to offer people the moon and more at the present time. He is well aware that ALL that matters is getting into government. After that he will, like a good little Vegemite, do just as the unions and factions tell him to do...unfortunately the rest of us are unlikely to be saved by Vegemite sandwiches.
I am actually frightened by the prospect of the ALP coming to power. They are inexperienced, inept, union driven, arrogant and tneir smiles do not reach their eyes.

58.5-41.5 Morgan Poll today. :)

Nuff said.

I have good reason to be terrified Ruawake

Rudd will never be like John Howard, I'm not saying Howard is perfect, but the only reason Rudd is leading the ALP is he is the best pick of a poor bunch, just think how much further Australia would be if we had a strong opposition to our government, someone to push them to be better, bring new ideas and policies.
Instead we have the ALP who’s best policy idea is, its time for a change, 12years of sitting on the side line and that’s all they really have, that and waiting to see which public opinion poll they should follow next.
Australia needs more doers in Government, less lawyers and people whose first interest is to cover there arse, instead of getting the job done.
I would like to see someone like Dick Smith in politics, someone with ethics, character and a true love for our country not his own ego and status.
If Rudd was more interested in Australia and Australians, than himself then he would go a little further.

Afzo. The coalition did not create the boom; they facilitated and prepared for it. When the Govt inherited the hopelessly inefficient waterfront, the Federal Debt and outdated taxation system, they set about getting Australia ready for when a "boom" should appear. Thus the pitched waterfront battles to triple productivity and to break Union Power. Then elimination of the debt, along with the $9 Billion per year needed to service it. Then reductions in company/individual taxation rates, as well as raising of threshholds for individuals (paid for out of the saved $9 Billion?). Added to that all types of investment incentives (out of the $9 Billion?) Then, strong encouragement to get people off the dole/off welfare and ready for working in many very well-paid jobs. All these measures, needless to say, were opposed vigorously by Labor.

Had labor been in Power as the embryonic "boom" began, it would've stalled immediately; the ports hopelessly unprepared. Of course, in the event of a downturn, the coalition has clearly positioned Australia brilliantly to counter it. Flush with cash, the option to pump-prime is now available. The GST, so vehemently opposed by Labor (ho hum; more economic ignorance) now takes pressure off the Commonwealth to give states grants, thereby maintaining funds for harder times.

Here are two questions to ask Mr Rudd. A) How will he know what policy to follow when he hasn't got Howard to SHOW him what to do? and B) What would he have done about the warld's least efficient waterfront if he'd been PM throughout the 90's? I'm not sure about the answer to A but to B it is "Whatever the unions wanted". Or? Cheers.

Pegasus. The left has not disappeared? Do you mean they've all died, or what? Haven't you noticed where they are? Try having a look, for instance at the Australia/Venezuala Solidarity Site which supports a declared socialist (Mr Chavez) and has a list of prominent Australians who want him to come to Australia to "educate" us. 70% of the signatories are Union Officials! All of them are ALP members! Now you know where they are.

What did those damn socialists do ? Well they deregulated banking...and reduced tariffs..oh, and they floated the dollar..and they flogged off which bank ?..and introduced national competition policy ..

Somehow I struggle to picture Kevin 07 locked arms with with Hugo and Fidel singing the .

Young Liberals are funny , they're like old time Marxists without the berets and facial hair.

Hey Punter. Good Aussie name. Like it mate.

As to my socialist comments. I thought we were talking about Australia not Venezuala. Are there any people in Australia who believe in socialist ideals and ideas? Of course but there's no political party other than the Greens who have anything like socialist policies. There's also people who believe in white supremacy but they don't have a Party either do they? Unless you count the Libs who they support under the table.

Unless you were too young or asleep the left moved to the right when Hawke stole the Libs ground in the 80's. As such there is right, (Rudd and Labor, look at how State govts operate, similar to Howard) far right (Howard), middle right (Attilla the Hun) and the "left", Greens. As in "what's left?", not lefties.

Those who hang on to the leftie and socialist rubbish are talking about the past, not today. If you want to discuss the world's political views then write an item instead of introducing irrelevant comments here.

If you question that please tell me what Labor policies Rudd has that are socialist. Do take note though that Howard uses one of the most socialist policies of all. Medicare. Is he a socialist?

Communicat obviously hasn';t heard Costelloe's comments from "that book" where he is "worried" by Howard's over spending pre elections. But you don't agree with Costello do you? The wonder Treasurer. Is he right about Howard or not? An answer would be good.

As RU wrote. 58.5 / 41.5.

Felicity. Enjoy your stay in Berne, and the ABC will still be here when you return.

Deane ( with an E). David Cameron really needs you now, as "Brownie" is on the up and up.

Jup, well said. I am amazed that such blatant spin be offered in this forum - except as an Aunt Sally to provoke furious response.

I hope all the political minders and gurus of both parties take a peek now and again at this forum.

I am a genuinely swinging voter, determined to try to figure out who will be the best government for Australia. Obviously it is going to be either Libs or Labor however my preferences filter down.

I am absolutely revolted by Mr Howard's attempt to buy the electorate where the Mersey hospital is situated. Politics 10, rationality and good government 0. Quest for power 10, longevity of some Tasmanians 0. On the other hand, Mr Rudd's deft refusals to be wedged fills me with admiration. But Labor's refusal to accept the facts of life vis-a-vis IR fills me with dread too. Instead of distorted polemic I would prefer, on this forum, to be treated to more rational discussion of issues.

I don't know what the authors are so worried about. The trick is to recognise when a ship is sinking and scramble onto the new one. (this is called adjusting to workplace reform).

Think Opportunity! There are plenty of examples of people remaking themselves - e.g. that great Leftist thinker Christopher Hitchens became a neoconservative hack! (although I think he might have deserted that now for the Chavismo 'socialist' fad). Anyway, think laterally - perhaps you can become writers for a 'leftist' thinktank, or pursue careers as Labor bureaucrat/politicians.

The key-word is 'flexibility'! Just get used to the idea and enjoy!

Felicity and Dean have those faces that ordinary people would just like to kick. These two smug fashion labeled mouths full of silver spoons and plumbs dribble theory from postmodern idiots. How on earth would they know about ordinary people?

They are not economic experts, Deanie boy studied internal policy under Mr Cameron in the UK. mmmhmm Oh Good boy! What a jolly good debate dear boy! More presents for the Young Liberals.

Felicity, possibly another spoof from Billy Mc Mahan, is some uppity lawyer who has that smart-arse tone about her. She would be the president of a tiny students union now. Who cares?

The point is they only speak the rhetoric that their party wants them to speak. A lawyer and a debater. That is what they do.

Neither is qualified to talk about economies.

Deanie boy should know that under new Labour in the UK, it was not bad for their economy at all. It boomed under PM Blair, just as it was bleak under Thatcher.

You see, for an economy to turn there has to be money.

You can't have a Treasurer like Costello flushing our tax payers money in higher eduction down the toilet bowel because he lost it all in "The Futures Fund". Yeah, smart idea that was. Gone. Would have been just as good to squander it all at Star City Casino. There goes our Education Budget, just as the Futures Stock market crashes. STUPID PEOPLE!

Then go off and sell our national telecommunications including confidential Government data, to a foreign company: Singtel. Good one mate! Tax payers money goes to Singapore!

The economic mistakes are an outrage, so take you snotty little faces out and disappear.

Is this the best they can do? it heartens me that the conservatives think miss information and fear is the best they have.
Truth is Rudd is closer to New Labor than any comrade type Labor.
And truth is John Howard is as far away from his battlers as he has ever been ,and increasing the gap hourly.
As the government pears into the depths of a huge hole it has dug for its grave thoughts of policy's and building a better country are far down the list after lies and fear tactics,,, this time John it works against you not for you.
Oh Tapp last or second last in your electorate, is still three to one on ,less than one thousand votes is five to one on.

Is a working family a family with an five bedroom home in Sydney with a $Zero mortgage battling on earnings of $250,000 so they can qualify for Labor's renovation subsidies?

Or is it a family on $80,000 with a $250,000 mortgage who can't afford to apply for Labor's renovation subsidies?

Or is it a renting family on casual work with one income earning $30,000 who can't access the savings in Power resulting from Labor's renovation subsidies.

The world of politic's in Australia surly has become 'ruddied' recently.

But the real battlers will be missing out under Rudd's labor. For surely Rudd's socialists and their policies will ensure real won't increase annually.

The real break with the past came under Hawke and Keating. It was they who started Australia down the path of economic liberalization. Howard and Costello continued down that path and I am sure that after a brief hiatus so would Rudd and Swan.

I shall not be voting ALP but I view a possible Rudd administration with equanimity. The real differences between the two parties are not material.

For those who want a punt the Betfair online betting exchange offers the following odds available as of now:

Labor: $1.60

Coalition: $2.54

See:

http://www.betfair.com/

("Politics" is, rightly, classified under "sports" on betfair though opera might be an even better categorisation)

On the whole I find betting markets offer a more reliable indicator of election results than opinion polls.

WARNING: More reliable but definitely NOT infallible.

Belly,

Rudd is a self-described fiscal "conservative." In fact he may turn out to be one of Australia's more conservative PMs to the extent that term has any meaning.

But, IR aside, what major changes do you seriously expect under a Rudd Administration?

Open wide ,come inside,its play school.Labor will be your best friend and promise you lots of goodies.Bananas in Republics are coming down the stairs ,Bananas in Republics are coming down in pairs.

Kevin is going to wind back all the Hawke/Keating reforms and let the Unions off their leash.Just watch them blow the future fund on their hair brain pet social engineering schemes,increase taxes,bureaucracy,red tape inflation and thus interest rates.

They also have alluded to using superannuation funds as cheap sources of finance for housing.Now that will mean far less returns on your super fund.

As I said before Garrett and Gillard will bring us the Trojan Horse of panic environmentalism and socialism that will destroy our economy.Do you really believe that Kevin can control so many ex unionists?

Arjay,

What exactly is wrong with allowing people to dip into their super funds to buy a house? I'm not saying use super to cover the whole cost, but instead to provide that initial deposit.

Think of it as shifting the funds from a managed system to capital. The money is still there, just locked up in the land.

maybe its about time that mr rudd and mr howard adnitt to to rapes and abuse that occurred at daruk boys home when iwas their in 1977/1978,, both the goverment of australia the labour party, the liberal party and all the other parties are covering up the real truth as to what happend to us victims when we were children we are called the forgotton australians ,,we were the children that were raped and abused by goverment staff employers , not only in boys homes ,this was also occurring at girls homes ,remand centres orphanages , and in and out of institutional care ,these were places that were run by the goverment of australia and the state of new south wales , so bring attenion to us victims that are still surving today and give justice to us victims ,stop the sydney supreme court from dissmissing our cases take brown v state of new south wales for instints, on the 20th september 2007 assocciate justice macready state the complaint is plainly real and a tragic part of our history but dissmissed the case so now the case is being appealed by the plaintiff ,because the goverment and the state of new south wales and the ministers for department of youth and community are and were responable for the fidisurie care and duty of care , if mr howard has any heart he will step in and resovle justice for us victims and if mr rudd is any decent man he would give justce to us victims ,, i look at it this way the goverment whether its either side they will still lie about what we went through in these state run institutions ,, its about time the cover up stopped as to how when we were children in this home daruk boys home were made to be slaves for the goverments illeagale tyre dumping ground making prohits from the slavery of us victims their was an attempt to have me murdered in 2004,

Belly

It seems you are too ashamed to answer regarding what has been posted about the labor party.

Well you do have to do as you are told so must wholly support these type off people that attack children.

How many more are their Belly. I know you can not say.

How safe are our children from the labor party secrets that are hidden.

Do Not Open Your Doors To The Labor Party Members.

If the labor party want me they know where to find me.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent Candidate for Charlton
swulrich@bigpond.net.au

Pegasus. Those many people signing the invitation for Mr Chavez to come give us the good oil on Socialism were Australian Union Officials, members of the ALP. Senator Nettle of the Greens and Senator Stott-Despoja were co-signatories. This certainly indicates that the appeal and influence of Socialism is not dead in Australia, despite there being no significact "Socialist Party" as such.

James Purser. The aim of super is to provide a stream of income in retirement. This can be from Dividends/Interest etc and/or through a gradual selldown of liquid asset held in super. Withdrawing cash early on, to finance a house purchase (or even just the deposit) turns the money into an illiquid asset which cannot be sold "gradually", not to mention the depletion of the "nest egg" which is supposed to be compoundind over 25-45 years. The real complication comes if the people withdrawing the money, later "lose" the house/ or want to move etc. who will ensure that the house profits/capital gain (if any) will go back into super? To keep this all under control would require a lot of supervision and bureaucracy, and attendant management costs. If there were a deposit-only loss from super this may impact severely on the future amount to fund their retirement. If more than deposit-only; total wipe-out. Bearing in mind that many average wage earner/worker types have only the employer guarantee super, and that THEY are the most likely to withdraw it for a house the potential disaster for them is huge; immediately and in their future.

Anyway. I'm still dripfeeding money onto the coalition as part of MY super strategy!. Cheers.

Apart from memories of the last Labor Federal government, the main thing that puts me off voting for them again,is the state ALP government in my state. A more dysfunctional undemocratic muddling lot of bunglers it would be hard to find.
Unless it was the lot who sit on the Opposition benches in Canberra.
Thanks but no thanks.
Kevin Rudd is no Labor believer, he is far too dainty to be a 'working man'and his mob...TV stars,Pop singers and unionists. Not a working man among them. What a strange party.

James Purser.If kevin is going to let individuals access their own super to buy a house then that is OK.However to use superfunds in general as a means of financing cheap housing will mean socialised poverty for all.There is almost no profit in housing developments in NSW at the moment,so how are super fund owners going to get a return if they are socialised by a Rudd Labor Govt?The share market on average exceedingly out performs property and building;especially in domestic housing.

The best way to reduce the cost of housing is to stop the States from profiteering by restricting supply.Reduce stamp duty,and no infrastructure taxes that get passed onto first home buyers.Just eliminate the States Govts and we will have plenty of money for infrastructure and housing.We do not need 3 levels of Govt.

Mickijo. Couldn't agree more. What surprises me is how many bloggers here reckon the ALP is "for the workers" the underdog etc while everything they ARE says thay are for themselves.

With the coalition the general "mantra" is; work hard, use your talents and become the best you can; at making money in business or by spending/investing your money wisely as workers; in the sciences or arts, or sports or wherever. Enjoy family life if you want. You may not become the boss of BHP, but you can rise above where you are now. If you aren't happy as a blue-collar worker, have you thought of maybe starting a business? etc etc

The ALP permanently sends out the negative message; you are on the bottom and are doomed to stay there. Blue collar workers are the salt of the earth and should be in a Union so they can stay blue collar workers forever. The bosses are keeping you there. You are not responsible for being a dolt, so don't try to get out of the hole you are in. Any problem you have is yours to "enjoy"
; we'll help you in your victimhood.

Meanwhile the leadership of the ALP and the Unions are Filthy Rich!! Their best mates are Filthy Rich (John Singleton anybody?). Their wives are Filthy Rich. That Building Union thug in WA; isn't his wife a multi-millionaire developer, as well as other better-known cases? You see THEY can all make it but not their voter-base.

Funny old world, eh?

Yeah mister mini me is no john howard, hides behind everyone, including his wife, its not my fault its hers.
Her fault for underpaid workers
Her fault for having to sack 350 to 400 people.
Her fault that the labor heavies that are within workdirections are incompetent
Her fault labor has no policies.

So really what does the krudd take responsibility for.

Maybe the sexual abusers and pedophiles.

OK a little quiz.

Which Labor shadow minister worked as a builders labourer from 1984-86 after leaving home against the parental wishes in year 11?

tapp.

The men in white coats are approaching, look out. :)

Golly gee, a piece co-written by "silver spoons in their mouths" young liberals (with bad haircuts) Whats next!

Tapp, you write with the bitchy voice of a Qantas flight attendant. Now calm down, let the speed out of your system, we are not talking about the bogey man, pedophiles, child molesters, the Lock Ness Monster, Vampires or even shape shifters.

Admittedly, my posting was colourful too but I'm sure even the writers got a laugh at that. When I see fake dribble from those not as qualified as they claim to be, my Doc Martens come out.

The States have been starved for 13 years of bad luck from cutbacks in Federal distribution of funding from the Howard Government. As the distribution gets chipped down more and more, of course it is difficult for the States to function.

You would think that the highest taxing Government in Australian History, the Howard Government, with the wide variety of levies, GST, fuel taxes, departure taxes, arrival taxes, student fees, so many lines of revenue, that they would distribute more to the States.

Do they? No.

They spend it on the "war against terror" in Iraq. The war we had to have.

They spend it on business subsidies.

They spend money on religious organizations, and this is not even constitutional.

The States get bugger all. That is a problem. A deliberate problem. A political strategy of nasty sabotage.

So will the States run better under Rudd? Politically, he has to look after the States. They are in the same party. Our economy may even boom like New Labour in the UK.

OK Tapp again your rambling gos far too far, having seen a post that highlights one persons pain about dreadful child rape you pounce on it.
Like the poster who has suffered so very much you place the blame on Labor, in the posters case both sides.
Is it not clear many layers of government exist between this dreadful crime and any federal government?
Tapp you know zero about politics, your pain and maybe related symptoms sees you lurch into politics for self interest, not better government.
You bleat like a child wanting a lolly In a toy shop, all this I can take.
But your personal insults are out there.
Tapp one of us knows nothing of the subject I challenge you to match my on the record forecast of your results in the election in the seat you are going to fail so very badly to make an impact in.
The fact Rudd is not Howard is the reason he will win.
Saintfletcher it truth, do not just think of your personal wants, could other than a conservative ALP leader bring enough votes to the party to avoid another landslide victory to the conservatives?

We now have in Canberra a child centre at Parliament House for parliamentarians. I reckon some would have preferred a Strip Club.:-)

Mind you the reason given for turning the Non-members Bar into a child care did raise my eyebrows and not a little chuckle.

Apparently it is designed to encourage younger women to join the ranks of Parliamentarians.

Given the voyeristic inclination of one of our older male members ... well ... you know

Ah! Keith; I do know. Would that the male members older or otherwise remained voyeuristic.

We might not need the child care centre.

As for the: "you know" (nudge,nudge,wink,wink). THE HORROR OF IT ALL!!
I collapsed under the strain of such appalling news.

If the economy was so strong then why is something as external as the U.S mortage market creating such destruction of the Australian economy. Surely if Howard and Costello were competant economic managers then American woes would have no impact on Australians at all.

It seems the coalitions entire economic credibility has thrown overboard by American mortage brokers.

Ginx ... so sorry to see you have no sense of the ridiculous.

I mean here we have another 'great' labor leader but this one, who espouses family and christian values, allows himself to get pissed, fall into bad company and become involved in an activity that condones and encourages the acceptance of the degradation and mistreatment of young women...

And that's not even mentioning the host of other sexist insults, to all women, such behaviour suggests.

The bloke is a fake and his behaviour shows it.

West

When the recession that is building in the US eventually reaches us, it hasn't yet, we are as well placed to ride it out as we possibly could be. Our economy will suffer a drop in exports but the imports will also fall, employment will fall, interest rates will fall as will housing prices but house affordability will improve and people in too much debt will be the only ones to really suffer.

Now we know what Howard and Costello will do but what will Rudd and his fellow socialists do?

Kevin Rudd is a blonde!

The People will be told about the type off people that the Labor Party and their supporters wholeheartedly support.

We can start with the ex labor member for Swansea with quite a lot of charges regarding sexual assaults on children.

How about the Newcastle member who knew but did nothing.

This was posted in The Daily Telegraph on page 18 of Thursday 16 of August 2007.
How about the Lake Macquarie branch president and charges relating to sexual assault on children. This person was also described as a former senior Australian Labor Party official.
Therefore, when it comes down to it, there is the Labor Party Truth and the Truth. Now it seems that keep on saying you do not know anything will not say anything, so the secrets of the labor party will just stay that and people like me will fight to have people like these vial, disgusting predators jailed for life.

On another note like had informed the papers and even said here that the NSW government was going to privatize services, but everyone laughed at me. To that end, we will see jobs going as private companies are interested in profits and not jobs, sounds like the labor party, as long as they look after themselves.

Oh and Belly you did not believe me then but hey the truth is what the labor party tells you.

For that question that was asked of me, I am not discriminating against sexes.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent Candidate for Charlto

The fact that Rudd is no "John Howard" is correct, and just as well! The author of this article, like so many seemingly intelligent people, stupidly consider this fact a criticism of Rudd. Nothing could be further from the truth! Rudd has very wisely set the ALP apart from the government on key issues such as Industrial Relations, Climate Change and War in Iraq. All winners for the ALP. Since then he has astutely avoided any negative public sentiment that might arise by opposing less clearcut government policies. A masterstroke! All Rudd needs to do now is sit back and allow Howard and his three stooges, Costello, Downer & Abbott to continue the Government implosion over their final three months. Who needs an opposition when you have these clowns running the government!

mytym, exactly.

While I loathe to even contemplate Rudd as PM waffling on how we should all learn to speak Mandarin (its his standard line on everything he finds complex) his minders are doing a wonderful job guiding him through the mine field of adversarial politics – a politic Howard is so adept at winning.

That he is not John Howard is just a no brainer. That he is clearly the Labor party leader is another matter altogether and these two young libs are obviously finding it rather difficult to strike a blow on someone who is shadowing them as well as their beloved Howard.

This little poem sez it all (apologies to Mearn Hughes)

Yesterday upon a stair,
I met Kevin Rudd who wasn't there.
Kev wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish Kev would go away

Also see Nicolson’s latest animated toon for another (similar) explanation here: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/opinion/animations/

Yes indeed people.. I'm glad no one has been able to report John Howard in a drunken orgy of groping strippers at a sleezy strip club.

But to be honest, while it was a silly and unbecoming thing to do, I'm more joyful that this has come out to PUT EGG on the faces of those mindless morons of journalists who in their unbelievably self righteous arrogance which led them to think they can actually get away with throwing all ethics down the toilet and exposing PRIVATE ..OFF the record conversations with Costellow...withOUT somebody doing the same on Rudd...

But then... that is the level of arrogance of the left.. "We are squeky clean.. and its our RIGHT to dishonestly do rotten things for the sake of our mob gaining power"

HAH ! well.. you realllly stepped in the doggy poo now didn't you.. and where will all this end ?...... aaaah.. time to put the thinking caps on children.

I'm still at a loss to know what are the material differences between the ALP and the coalition.

As for Rudd's visit to a "gentleman's club," in the US it would end his quest for power. I hope in Australia it will have no effect on the election.

So what?

One point. If Rudd really was so motherless that he cannot remember what happened then he cannot hold his drink. Maybe that should disqualify him from being PM of Oz!

LOL

How please tell me , can anyone who reads my posts say I am a slave of the ALP?
Go back to my early posts here and read them, watch my contempt for Mark Latham and that small wasted person Simon Crean and repeat your charges.
Tapp you do not understand politics.
And yes I share your views on people subject to court appearances, Sir however are you aware of contempt of court issues?
And Tapp can you look me in the eye and say that news paper is always right?
Always
' I find in comic book like and trust nothing it publishers.
Now BD hold your contempt must we yet again swim in a self righteous bog?
Here now I could list from both sides of the house former leaders even who went far more than Rudd has.
Even dieing in bed with a lady of the night.
Truth is Christians are a minority, yes those who truly practice the faith are as few as say union members one in five.
So while you may disapprove such places will forever make money.
Now while conservatives look for this to save them I rather think it is much more simple than a boys night out.
The similarity to my beloved ALP in past elections is huge, a government that has lost the peoples support, a leader that has too, not putting better policy's in place just mud throwing.
Left? not me not Labor, but read posts from left of center here, understand some would Rather John Howard than a Labor they can not control.
Tapp you lay charges and run away ,fail to give answers but highlight others doing it.
How many votes will you win? what is your projected finish place in your electorate?
On what evedence do you claim the ALP suports sex crimes against children?

Reforming Infrastructure. Australia's servicing administration is over-regulated and smoking with neglect.

We have an economy that (we do know) will slow... and become more strained as the "baby boomers" enter the elder age bracket.

Many families now caught in debt will grow in numbers and there will be less social access to supports as these people fall or scrap (near) bottom. Household Stress is a real concern.

We have the knowledge now to help counter-act this. We need to put back some balance into our civic infrastructures.

Rudd does not want to FIGHT dirty, to make our "everyday life" politics a human conflict.

Clean-Up Australia.

Rudd wants ALL Aussies to work together (more productively) on issues of civic wellbeing.

This is a FIRM call. It requires our civic understanding and ownership.

Rudds policy agreements are different to the Liberal because he offers a dynamic human approach. His power is not based on school yard antics, name calling, alinating the public through the nasty politics of a few.

A Rudd government will re-direct focus back to servicing infrastructure issues and it will take responsiblity for the diversity of basic human needs at ground levels...

http://www.miacat.com/
.

Miacat, a Rudd government will look after their union mates...and to hell with the rest of us. Infrastructure? They will look after that as long as gives employment to the union mob and the roads go where they want the roads to go...and that won't necessarily be where the roads need to go. There will be a super highway to Asia and an unmaintained dirt track to the rest of the world if Rudd gets his way. The super highway will allow Asian juggernauts to over run the traffic flow in the other direction.

Miacat wrote:

"His [Rudd's] power is not based on school yard antics, name calling, alinating the public through the nasty politics of a few."

LOL Miacat, almost half the ALP campaign seems to be ad hominem attacks on Howard. But that's the nature of politics when substantive policy differences are few.

I think we're going to have an infrastructure build no matter who takes office. The politicians can't put off the tough decisions anymore.

Not sure how Rudd will help with "household stress." What he has revealed so far is, frankly, economic baloney but no more so than anything Howard has said.

I also do not see how any PM can get "ALL Aussies to work together (more productively) on issues of civic wellbeing." When the need arises most Aussies already work well together.

I suggest miacat you happen to like Rudd and dislike Howard. That's fine. But I still doubt there will be any substantive POLICY change if Rudd succeeds Howard.

In fact, miacat, your comments mirror those of most Rudd supporters. You hope for a change of "atmospherics" than material differences in core policies

Belly see no evil Labor do no evil.
How about privatisation of the public transport system, thats right you had no idea.
If you do report those who are involved with child sexual assaults and you know then what does that make you.

I give myself a 40% chance.

The People will be told about the type off people that the Labor Party and their supporters wholeheartedly support.

We can start with the ex labor member for Swansea with quite a lot of charges regarding sexual assaults on children.

How about the Newcastle member who knew but did nothing.

This was posted in The Daily Telegraph on page 18 of Thursday 16 of August 2007.
How about the Lake Macquarie branch president and charges relating to sexual assault on children. This person was also described as a former senior Australian Labor Party official.
Therefore, when it comes down to it, there is the Labor Party Truth and the Truth. Now it seems that keep on saying you do not know anything will not say anything, so the secrets of the labor party will just stay that and people like me will fight to have people like these vial, disgusting predators jailed for life.

On another note like had informed the papers and even said here that the NSW government was going to privatize services, but everyone laughed at me. To that end, we will see jobs going as private companies are interested in profits and not jobs, sounds like the labor party, as long as they look after themselves.

Oh and Belly you did not believe me then but hey the truth is what the labor party tells you.

For that question that was asked of me, I am not discriminating against sexes.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent Candidate for Charlto
Posted by tapp, Sunday, 19 August 2007 4:05:25 PM

I understand why we ALL feel so sceptical. Politics in Australia has lost so much meaning and we insist on being culturally ocka about giving any credit for hopefulness.

I back a horse that has a smid of evidence. I appreciate that policies on Climate Change, Housing, and Health "affordablity" are critical issues, followed by transport and dramatic efforts to re-build our nations infrastructure. (Basic Needs which must provide employment at community levels - where inclusiveness counts!).

I also believe the Iraq situation is out of hand and that the Pacific Small Island nations also need to be brought into the development of economic markets, as does Africa.

I don't think Rudd can be the end of our demise but I believe his call for a "fresh approach" is more inclusive then Howards when it comes to facing changes now rather that after it is too late.

We have all possibly respected Howard at one time but his present performance is highly concerning. I feel his government lacks any "human face" and understands little about residents in local civic affairs.

We do need more of a balance.

" Ginx ... so sorry to see you have no sense of the ridiculous." (Quote:Keith)

..............hello?..er, I think you got that the wrong way around?
That's exactly what I DO have; I'm responding to YOU aren't I?

Costello did that; Rudd did this; come on! You know and I know, that every little dirty piece of political history is going to be flying around until the 'lechun.

We'll just have to see what trumps what. I have to admit; if Howard has ever worn Janette's pink panties/or got involved in a threesome/or......,

Well darn it! He'd win with a landslide;..Even I would vote for him!

Garn' John; fess up?

Tapp are you well? 40%chance? so 40% of the vote? better than the greens in state seat of Newcastle? really?
4% at best, no way you can achieve it but the best.
I think less than 1% was that post the best you could do? a repeated rant?
I am on record saying Rudd will still ride high in the polls 12 months after he wins office.
The thought that unions will control him are less than intelligent, in truth he will no more be controlled by unions than any post war government.
Unions know this and even the demented little minded Simon Crean, a product of the ACTU knew this and actively took influence away from unions.
It would serve conservatives better to ask why has Australia turned away from Howard than to try to turn them away from Rudd.
Australia has been waiting for anyone they can trust to get as quickly as they can away from a man they no longer even like John Howard.

'Come on see the strippers lapdance'
The drunken Christian pervert sung
To hell with any respect for women
All the media, the morally 'down-dumb'
will gladly and willingly cover my fun.

But me, at 54, well I'm old-fashioned and just think he's a dirty old buggar.:-)

Is it just me, or is the Liberal party looking a little light on talent these days. If this is the best they could come up with, then I think the Liberal party may struggle in the forthcoming election.

Perhaps, rather then keep telling people how good they have it, the Liberal party (and for that matter, ALP) hacks should have a look at why people are deserting the coalition. Perhaps, rather than unsubstantiated claims like "Labor will ruin the economy", the Liberal party should have a look at its own economic policies and ask them selves "why are they deserting us".

The more I am told by the coalition what's good for me, the more I tune out.

Disclaimer: I'm a recent(ish) member of the Greens

As the lapdancer at Scores flung her legs astride Kevin's loins,his conscience puzzled,"Was this fork in the road a bridge too far?"

Belly if you are not aware 40% is on the low side of winning.

Also for those who wish to have a look
type in labor liberal mp on charges, you will find it is not only the labor party that has had these vial, disgusting predators.
You will find corruption and even the labor party wanting to prob them more.

So belly I will put it out there for the people to decide on what they think is reaasonable as it is always party policy and the party themselves that make the decisions for the people.

How many sexual abusers,how many corrupt people within these parties that make decisions for us for our children , in education.

Oh another thing I do apologise for an error regarding that president of lake macquarie branch.

The error was and I am not sure if there is a lake maquarie branch, but it was the president who resigned from the swansea branch and was a 10 year old child from lake macquarie.

So I do apologise sincerely for that error of fact.

Stuart Ulrich
Independent Candidate for Charlton

Oh dear…Our bill clinton moment happened in a pub in the USA -
Kinda sez it all really

The Liberals will end up with egg on their face over this tangent, Tapp, which BTW is irrelevant to the topic.

What the hay, watch the egg fall back on their faces.

The question is: how many eggs will fall back?

The sqealer on Rudd was no other than Alexander Downer. The man that in surveys, 51% of people think he is gay and only 31% think that he only looks gay because he wears fishnet stockings and a red handbag.

http://www.opinion.com.au/3737_Is_Alexander_Downer_'gay'_%3F.htm

He apparently wore fishnet stockings to a school function in front of children in 1986. Later that year he did the same in a drunken conference party, dancing in his fishnets on again with Colin Powell who was wearing red high heals and make up.

The Australian newspaper's resident cartoonist, Bill Leak loved to draw Downer in comics.

BILL LEAK: I drew him as this comical little Billy Bunter-type figure from a posh English school. And, naturally, that meant that he had short pants. And so when he came along with the fishnet stockings, he did the fishnet stockings mistake, I thought, "Gee, I’m glad I already had him in short pants 'cause I can put the stockings on." And with Alexander Downer, I always think it's as though he's saying, "Oh, look, mummy, I'm the Foreign Minister." (Laughs).

KERRY O'BRIEN: (Laughs)

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2005/s1433914.htm

The Liberals are backing down from this direction for very good reasons, and some know why.

Rudd is not trying to be John Howard, he is trying very hard to get elected.
Current fear tactics trys to ignore the fact Labor has governed this country before.
Once in office Rudd will lead very well.
Now Tapp, yes I have an understanding 40% is not a wining number, but do you understand how unlikely it is you will poll that well?
Greg Combet is the ALP candidate and you will not out poll conservatives or greens or of course Greg, how many times can you divide 100?
40% is unreachable and a dream.
You seem intent on saying both mainstream party's are infected with child sex criminals?
Surely mate you know the contempt we all hold any person like that in?
The likely hood of any party supporting such is zero.
Be assured I will post your final results here, and again NEVER EVER say others fail to answer questions, you are a master of ignoring them.

Saintfletcher you reveal far to much about yourself and your double standards.

I must ask: What is wrong with being Gay?

But oh dear oh dear I'll try and remember that it's all the Liberals fault the dirty old buggar got pissed and perved at young women strippers...eh?

That was a fast little snap! What makes you think Kevin Rudd actually went there "perving"? Aren't we jumping to conclusions? What ever it was, the media took him there, and it was some NY guy thing. How does Alexander Downer know whether or not he was actually looking, how far the women stripped, or was it just poll dancing. Who cares anyway?

I mean, we are not allowed to criticize Allan Jones for playing in the toilet, but when Keven goes to a night club, well, send out the fire brigade! Dial 911, 000, 999 and a valium! Get real, you need to go out more often!

They even did poll dancing on Big Brother. As for perving, you can see more on prime time television than you can at those strip places.

Keven was just being a bloke, or as he says, goose.

Alexander Downer is not a bloke at all, he is a snitch.

I really couldn't give a rats bum about Alexander Downer being gay. I'm really not bothered. It is how the queen gossips like a nasty drag queen that is of concern.

Saintfletcher

"poll dancing?"

A pun or a Freudian slip? ;-)

LOL

Keith we know exactly what Howard and Costello will do. They will do what they have always done , deny the problem, try a jingo to dazzle the plebs and blame the weak.

We know Howard does not possess the credibility , the moral or intellectual fortitude to deal with a real crisis. Howard and Costello have learnt well from their beloved American culture. All PR and no substance.

Rudd will probably do the same, unfortunetely the Commonwealth has lost relevance over the past decade and I fear it will be another decade before we get an Australian Government rather than another useless media construct. Or what seems to be our destiny we will cease to be a nation and become a united collection of independent states like Europe.

Either way Rudd or Howard/Costello makes no difference , neither have their head in Australia.

West,I think that it is the State Govts that have lost their relevance.They signed of gleefully on the GST and blew it all on bureaucrats and mismanagement.John Howard is on the right track.Slowly remove their realm of influence by taking over health ,education and infrastructure.Then we eradicate them entirely.We will then have plenty of money for housing and infrastructure.

The Unions have 85% of their power base in the Public Service.Why do these people belong to a Union when they cannot be sacked or disciplined.Sick days and workers comp claims are 3 times that of private enterprise who pay the taxes to keep them.

The States have out lived their usefulness.

Arjay on the contrary it is the federal government which should be scraped. If the Howard government has taught us anything it is that the commonwealth government has become a waste of resources.

The commonwealth government offers no services to the Australian people , holds no expertise in service delivery, holds no concept about what Australia is , the differences in its regions and especially the needs of Australians.

The only thing it has to justify itself is a defence department but even here we are wasting resources in unneccessary wars. the Commonwealth has mismanaged the economy , only those resource rich states and catchments have done well out of the Asian economic boom. The Commonwealth politicised education and health , destroyed the tertiary system and is currently destroying families with its 19thy century employment policies.
Labour is no alternative to the rot. Scrap the federal Government and replace it with a common treasury with one state one vote.

Arjay says; "The Unions have 85% of their power base in the Public Service. Why do these people belong to a Union when they cannot be sacked or disciplined?"

A good point, which, to be 'fair and balanced', is also applicable to politicians. If you want democratic accountability, representatives should be recalleable and subject to strict mandates - in which case they become delegates rather than representatives. If you really want a democratic society then fight for democratic reform. We all know that the corruption of power is not limited to Union Bosses. "What's good for the goose is good for the gander"

Of course public servants can be sacked , bullied , exploited or injured and it has happened to many.

A politician both state and commonwealth should only do what is promised at elections. If he/she fails to deliver within a reasonable time she/he should be sacked. If he/she does something not promised at an election he/she should be sacked fined and if it involves lobbyists imprisoned for then the lobby had been represented (corruption) not the constituent. If an electorate decides they wish to dispose of a politician for any reason at any time they should be able to sack the politician with a 50.1%. All this the politician is still more protected from being sacked than most Australians including union members.

I still feel the commonwealth should be scrapped because it is an inefficient use of resources. As a tax payer I dont pay taxes just so an incompetent government can claim to have a surplus. Thats like putting oil in an engine for no other purpose other than to be able to say the sump is full.

West ,we know you are a Public Servant,fear not,it will be a slow process of evolution,your super will be untouched and those who have real ability will be premoted rather than lobotomised.

Actually I am not a public servant, nor am I in a union. I just have no gullibility when it comes to spin and inane jingoism. To me a spade is a spade and a shovel is a shovel. I assume to be called a public servant is supposed to be some sort of slur and to be labelled as a trade union member is also some sort of slur. As I said I dont belong to a union , I believe people who give up their time and orientate their life styles to help another to gain wealth should be free to form a union, even fringe looney unions such as various Chamber of commerce's that are dedicated to undermining the nation and in the name of personal greed have a right to exist. Business mens association or airline pilots union all they are about is looking after members.

The public service is about looking after the country , even though you wish to throw me in with "public servants" doctors , nurses , soldiers, police, administrators , postal workers and librarians
it would be no slur. The only problem with the public service is when it is politicised and the public service are used for the purposes of the party and in the case of this current government to the detriment and shame of the nation.

Political parties are also unions , for a political party to be anti union is about as silly and unintelligent as a group of people can get. How many anti unionists have ever voted for a political party thereby undermining their entire philosphy?

It is probably a symptom of this countries underlying problem, too many people and apparently most politicians never think.

Maybe its human nature , maybe many Australians are simply too bone lazy to have a thought and the worst of them enter politics.

Whatever the reason the policies of the Howard government have been bizarre and weird at best , with no positive or constructive purpose. Rudds response is just as cooky and supporters of both are led by the nose by an intellectually void yet equally peculiar media.

Long gone is the age of reason, this is the era of Monty Python politics meets the dark age superstition of the pitch fork armed mob.

The Oz's "Cut and Paste" today had an article from the Wall St Journal Asia by Sinclair Davidson and Alex Robson (the same "economists" who stuck the boot into the Sydney Uni report that was hostile to AWAs) - that new article looked like it ripped every word out of this article. Lazy bloody Libs!

The strip club comments are off the mark. I am a young man and some young women DESERVE to be degraded, some of the even take it up as a hobby.

I will support a government that makes education and employment opportunities for social mobility widely available. I do not see howard has been doing this. Limiting access to education.

Otherwise any argument along the lines of rewarding risk takers and high achievers is simply a cash grab for a two tiered economic system.

Decent SOLID education, not 'arts' students, tech school, electricians, plumbers teachers, ENGINEERS & scientists (with research opps). Opportunities not just a glossy piece of paper. R&D spending.

Howard has not done this. I will vote Rudd. Labor deserves a chance its labors turn.