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The Forum > Article Comments > Oceans in peril > Comments

Oceans in peril : Comments

By Julian Cribb, published 1/3/2007

If we hope that our oceans will sustain us in the future, we must sustain them in the present.

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Sounds a little over the top....Panic Stations!
Posted by SkepticsAnonymous, Thursday, 1 March 2007 9:11:24 AM
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Cribb has been flogging purple science for more than two decades. Note how there is not a single positive effect in all the things he describes. Nature ALWAYS has winners and losers but don't ever expect the Climate Cretins to mention anything but bad news.

The ocean acidity theory is entirely dependent on an assumed maximum depth of CO2 mixing of only 100m. Average ocean depth is 4000m so these guys have come up with a neat little scare story that squeezes all the CO2 into only 2.5% of the ocean. This conveniently, and selectively, ignores the well documented evidence on thermohaline circulation of the oceans which suggests that it takes about 400 years for the complete circulation of the worlds oceans.

And this means that any projection out to even 50 years must assume that CO2 is being mixed in with 50/400 parts of total ocean volume. And this 12.5% is five times more volume than the 2.5% used by the UK Royal Society. And that means the level of ocean acidity will only be 20% as bad as what they claim.

That is why we call it Gullible Warming. But if you have nothing better to do than wallow in angst then fine, but you'll go blind.
Posted by Perseus, Thursday, 1 March 2007 10:33:31 AM
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Yes after reading over some of Cribb's previous pieces he certainly favours alarmism based on little or no science....
Posted by SkepticsAnonymous, Thursday, 1 March 2007 10:40:10 AM
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There is no evidence of greenhouse or runaway global warming. There is no evidence for runaway sea level rises or ice cap melting. What we are observing are media blow-ups of changes well within the limits of variability of Earth's thermodynamics.

It will be at least 100 years before the Flat Earth style global warming consensus even begins to be properly tested. But by 2025, a population approaching 8billion plus a grinding down of oil reserves will lead to a global holocaust between haves and have-nots that will see up to 5 billion people killed to maintain economic growth and national securities. Thus Vested corporate interests must be a part of the scientific scrutiny of Climate Change and scientists on their payroll should be ignored for the good of mankind.

Coporate media ownership propaganda males greenhouse warming the Mack&Myer-for-hire scientific consesus just as Catholic inquisitions madeFlat Earth the European scientific consensus for centuries.

This is a disaster for oceans which are the GRAVITAS of Biosphere thermodynamics and thus of the Climate Change problem. If it is insurance to stop CO2 emissions it MUST also be insurance to clean up wastewater discharges.

The proof is about to unfold in this year's US hurricane season. After May 2006 the US was warned in a popular public forum that high-entropy wastewater discharges from US ports were attracting Low-entropy hurricane formations to populated areas. Subsequently SHA(sea height anomaly) maps showed significant retractions in coastal wastewater plumes, SST maps showed a sudden drop in surface temperatures and hurricanes were forced to track the deep Atlantic.

Right now the SHA maps are showing record pollution discharges from US ports. Thus when the US starts to rein them in after May (as they have $100billion reasons) they will stand out for proper scientific evaluation. That will reaffirm that climate change is caused by Human coastal demographics with respose times in wastewater outputs of only about 2-7 days.

The Mackay cyclone within the next month could be stopped if Aussie scientists snapped out of their capitalist stupor.
Posted by KAEP, Thursday, 1 March 2007 11:14:40 AM
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Ah, what joy there is in science, and involvement in grand experiments!
And Julian points us to the grandest one of all. One where the best laid hypothesis of all the Kings'/Presidents' scientists can not be guaranteed. Because - we are conducting a "work in progress" and there is no absolute certainty in our time; only a variable scale of probabilities.
And what does it matter anyway? Why worry - when the world's economic system is running on the grandest of all pyramid schemes. One where, whatever problems may be developing, we take the profits now, at the expense of those coming into the scheme. No conscience-bothering needed - whatever the problems, they will be distributed among an expanding number of people. The individual burden will be spread more widely. Six and a half billion people incapable of handling their problesm? If we reach thirteen billion, maybe each of us will have half a problem? Yeah, not to worry - carry on with the current experiment!
So what if the oceans are kaput! - we can look to our fish-protein needs from farmed catfish and carp. If the rivers don't run dry; if disease does not strike at monoculture fish-farms. Or if sea-floor clathrates and the great peat-bogs don't burp their methane into the atmosphere; etc..
Let it roll on, the grandest experiment Homo sapiens has ever conducted! Be skeptical of certainty! That great mass of scientists can only base their models on the best available evidence, which may not be perfect.
But, most of all, be skeptical of those professing certainty in their skepticism!
As ordinary mortals, we are told that pyramid schemes are illegal. Doesn't it then follow that we should be skeptical of those in charge of the economic system when the model they choose is no more than pyramid selling? One dependent upon ever-lasting growth of human numbers, and everlasting increase in individual consumption? Shouldn't we, when they seem to profess even greater certainty than the climate skeptics?
Posted by colinsett, Thursday, 1 March 2007 11:38:50 AM
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Oceans are in peril... this article talks about one aspect being effect of CO2... what the author missed was the 'acid-base buffer' aspect of it which the following article fills in, and keeping in mind that once buffers are saturated then ph changes dramatically resulting in cell death of all life forms in the sea, so if we keep producing co2 rapidly then its only a question of time before saturation point is reached...

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=169

The other factors mentioned like toxins, fertilizer, heavy metals etc and result like accelerated algae growth sucking most of the 02 out of the water, over fishing all exist. The fundamental issue is do they as a whole affect life at sea right now and if so are the life forms in the sea struggling... And the answer is yes, just look at what happened to inland seas with its 'limited water mass' like aral, caspian and dead sea and the damage was predicted but commercialism took precedence and now little life and no fishermen and 'no nothing to say' by the rogue 'scientists' whom pooh poohed the predictions at the time eg http://java.nationalgeographic.com/studentatlas/clickup/inlandseas.html

Yes the insignificant plankton, but when viewed as a whole the planktons serve a fundamental function, from our perspective the largest supplier of oxygen (this was discovered about the 70s when the question arose of how much of our forrest can we cut without affecting o2 while the eyes were looking at the amazon forests...) yep the same unbalanced self interest is what got us all into this mess, those who damaged for quick benefit and the rest of us who did not act to stop it...

Sam
Posted by Sam said, Thursday, 1 March 2007 11:49:23 AM
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