The Forum > Article Comments > In defence of juries > Comments
In defence of juries : Comments
By David Galloway, published 11/2/2014There's no escaping the fact that someone has to demine guilt or innocence in criminal matters, and if not Ms Thompson's know-alls, know-nothings, don't-cares and cod psychologists then who?
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Yes. I've often wondered why known criminals often opt for a judge-only trial for their latest alleged crimes.
Posted by NeverTrustPoliticians, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 9:35:13 AM
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Your argument against Thompson's claims might have some weight if we enjoyed a legal system that did NOT let the "star witness" REMAIN SILENT while the defence solicitor lied his/her head off in court trying to get his/her "client" off, in most cases a Legal Aid solicitor helped by his mate "the judge". It is necessary to have a prosecutor who is just as cunning and devious as the defending solicitor and this goes against the very basic concept of JUSTICE, the outcome should be based on the EVIDENCE. There are far too many opportunities for cunning opportunists to hoodwink Juries under our current legal system.
A good start would be to have our "judges" trained as "judges" (judges school) and NOT come from the tainted legal system, also we must remove this dishonest practice that allows the defendant to remain silent, they must tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth! Posted by lockhartlofty, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 10:37:16 AM
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Dear lockhartlofty
I think you’ve been watching too many American TV shows. Posted by drgal1, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 10:57:46 AM
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An ever increasing problem with the judicial system is trial by media.
Take the CT affair. I didn't even knownthe guy existed until he was all but found guilty by the media. Same went for Dennis Furguson and now Daniel Morcombs accused killer. I always thought the aim of a trial was to find a jury bench that had no knowledge of the crime on trial. Good luck with that, unless of cause we want 16-25 year olds as jurors. Posted by rehctub, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 2:05:27 PM
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No dagal 1 I don't waste my time watching US TV shows, seems you do, my comments are based on personal observations, maybe you should take note of what goes on in our legal industry, solicitors in this country are crying because they are scared that the dishonest rort "the right to remain silent" is coming to and end, it has ended in the UK despite being a 400 hundred year old "tradition", now Great Britten's lawyers can't conjurer up the usual disgusting, degrading, defaming, stories about rape victims designed to get the rapist "off". Potential US jury members are given a comprehensive booklet regarding their obligations before accepting positions on the panel, you will not see anything about that on any TV show.
Posted by lockhartlofty, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 2:27:38 PM
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AUther/quoTE..,,..< Pointing's trial looked like a formality until the jury simply refused to convict an honest man who had stood up against wrong.>>
yes god bless 'jury nulliFICATION' TILL JURIES ARE TOLD THE TRUTH..[they have the dutY TO judge the law and the crime*]..i have faced 3 juries..[they are specially.selected by the sheriff..who is free to use any inquiry means to get the right useless idiot..[who knows their DUTY*[follows the leaders/think the sir joe trial..a sheriff got him IN. the justice system is insane..lawyers make lAWS..defend the laws judge the laws..then hear appeal..of the law..[its all in house]..where the separation of powers but even worse..legal/aid..is there 'to save the courts time''[not justice][further all lawyers swear 'loyalty'..to the law society. see law comes in two forms..[injury or victim law]..then civil..[or contract law]..see govt made artificial..'persons'..under the acts[they can only Judge..those seeking a benefit..via statuted personhood[but even that WEAK SOCIAL CONSTRUCT contract..iS VIA UN-INFORMED CONSENT[NO MEETING OF MINDS see the state..is a construct/..a fiction..essentially..its a dead trust/betrayed..[where the living serve the dead..[IE THE STATE/CORPORATIONS FORMED UNDER THE ACT..ARE DEAD. AND JESUS SAID LET THE DEAD TEND THE DEAD but juries..arnt TOLD any of it.. learn the truth jury nullification THE Duty to judge the law and the act. the dead CAN FEEL NO Pain/thus HAVE NO LAWFUL Standing. standing is everything.[ie personally hurt/or hurt by defrauded contractual terms uninformed consent see ignorance of the law is no excuse8 Posted by one under god, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 2:34:17 PM
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Jury Nullification: Exercise Your Right to Fight Unfair Laws
http://www.thedailysheeple.com/jury-nullification-exercise-your-right-to-fight-unfair-laws_022014 What would you do if you were selected for jury duty, but felt that the "broken" law itself was unjust, unfair, or unconstitutional? Did you know that, as a juror, you have the right to acquit a defendant in a criminal case if you determine the law itself to be flawed? Even if the court proves the law in question was actually broken, a jury has a right to find the defendant innocent if the law is found to be unfair, immoral, unjustly applied, or unconstitutional. This is called jury nullification. Posted by one under god, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 4:31:45 PM
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I never bother with the Fairfax commune news. Never read the article but the obnoxious jury person obviously was a Fairfax of the first order.
Juries acquit more than they convict dummy! I am with some of the other posters The right to silence is only 400 years old prior to that no one expected the truth from the accused so it was ignored. We do need an inquisitorial system without lawyers on piecework. That would reduce costs by two thirds. Sadly lawyers make up such a proportion of politicians we have no hope of getting that through. Perhaps the author of this piece would be better served by changing his own rules first? One Barrister has been bankrupt many times every time because of non payment of his taxes owing. How can we treat lawyers as anything but, words fail me here, whilst they encourage this sort of totally unethical behaviour? Posted by JBowyer, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 5:37:05 PM
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Good point about “jury nullification,” god/1. From Crikey about a year ago:
“In Defence of Juries Gavin R. Putland writes: Re. “Keane: online activists and exemplary punishment”. The propensity of governments to punish activists and whistleblowers out of all proportion to the harm that they do, or indeed in spite of the good that they do, in a blatant attempt to deter dissidents from embarrassing the government and the rent-seekers who control it, is one reason why we need a constitutional right to be tried by a jury of fellow citizens who are not obliged to give reasons for their decision. If the jury concludes that the prosecution is politically motivated, or that the punishment is likely to be manifestly excessive, or that the “law” is, in the immortal words of Thomas Aquinas, “no law at all, but rather a species of violence”, then the jury can simply acquit the defendant in the teeth of the “law” and the facts, in which case the acquittal is binding. “Jury nullification”, as this practice is called, is impeccably democratic. Its direct democracy by sortition — the jurors being a random sample of the electorate. It also conforms to the principle that a more extreme decision requires a stronger democratic mandate. It asserts, in effect, that if a law creating a crime is to apply in a particular case, it must not only be passed by the legislative branch and approved by the executive branch, but also cleared by whichever 12 electors make up the jury. Moreover, jury nullification is essential to the equality of the three branches of government, and to the efficacy of the separation of powers as a safeguard of freedom. The legislative branch, by itself, can free the accused by changing the law. The executive branch, by itself, can free the accused by exercising discretion or clemency. But only through jury nullification can the judicial branch, by itself, free the accused. Thus, only with jury nullification can it be said that it takes all three branches of government to take away your freedom, but only one to give it back.” Posted by JKUU, Wednesday, 12 February 2014 12:52:52 AM
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thanKS JKU..i needed that[see im in couRT today..yet again
for a 'summery OFFENSE''[THUS NO JURY TRIAL OPTION.] ie its a statuted/offence..[for persons under the ACT]..im not a person/under the act[or rather i had 'personS'..UNDER THE ACT[THEIR ID]..their licenses their compulsory COMMERCE [THIRD PARTY INSURANCES ETC] SORRY the caps key keeps shifting anyhow im charged with possession..LOL..of a 'consumable' MADE A 'THING'..via the lie of putting a plant onto a prohibited drug list..THEN NOT EVEN JOINING ..the thing.. anyhow 35.000 kids are criminalized each year in qld alone..fOR 'simple possession'..[IE NO JURY TRIAL]..it raises 65 million plus each year..IN REVENUE..with 20 out of 21 pleading guilt its a nice little money earner for lawyers/judges..[like in a day in court the 'legal aid' lawyer..can sheppard through INTO CRIMINALITY..IGNORANT 35,000 KIDS EACH YEAR..FOR MONEY.. its a grand scam..[see god gave all manKind the plant[gen1;29]..so we all 'posses the damm thing...YET ONLY ONE PERCENT OF the population..IS 'DEEMED'..TO POSSES IT.. the concept is demonically clever..possession is 9/10 the law/yet noe a god given duty has been profitably criminalized..BUT MOST GROW OUT OF IT..but silly me lacking in peers never did..[after 9 months jail i got out and went into social isolation[self imposed HOME detention] [i was cautioned leaving jail not to talk to anyONE]..SO I DIDNT. I WAS EVENTUALLY PUT ON A PENSION..BY ALLOWING A..phyc to make me a 'person'..under the act[but have been person free now for years[as i refused to seek advice ..and deliver a letter saying im nuts..to yet other govt agents..BY THE LIE OF 'PERSON'.. CTD Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 12 February 2014 5:41:28 AM
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...im sure I COULD CONVINCE A JURY TODAY
but that isnt an option..but i got many other cards up my sleave..so today..I GO IN TOASK A MAGI-straight..qUE WARRENTO[BY WHAT RIGHT DID GOVT DECLARE WAR ON ME BY STATUTED LIE. anyhow i prepare for court i know in 8 previous court io have been found..to have poSSESION yet the police taking it away..proves i neVER HAVE..i gop to claim posesion..[but cant plead guilty TO POSESION..because clearly[by cops taking it by force..donT] BUT ALL THEY SEE IS PAPER..they live in the realm of delusion THEY EXPECT ME TO PAY Commerce..in paper/credit/yet only coin is lawful tender[so catch 22\..they resolved that by spers repeatedly punnishing me/canceled my license/canceled my rego/levied my bankaccount..and now have a lien on my house for a lie and no jury of peerts to hear BUT ITS CRIMINAL MATTER NOW..[I WAS ASSAULTED] i know i stILLCANT WIN..AS this is satans realm but just to show up means i have towalk 5 hours..or pay commerce to get there. anyhow..im angry im in court in 4 hours asking q'warrento..by what right. they allready killed me..im a corpse walkiNG..im so bad..the world will be much better without..me stinking up the joint. [but i know god is watching..saying do it for the kids jonny.] so i go..[the commonwealth CON SAY NO LAWS FOR RELIGION IM BEING RELIGIOUSLY PErcicuted..by satanists of state fictions.] they will win yet again but spers will have to modify the lien WITHOUT NOTICING ME AGAIN/CLEARLY Unlawful[que warRento] I Wish they would just shoot me..[] i been..alone since 1986..govt made my life hell i prepare for battle..THE FIRST TIME..i was informed.. 'ignorance..of the law..is no excuse'.. well im not a kid no more. I NOW KNOW..THE RULES. Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 12 February 2014 5:44:49 AM
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FINALY..AFTER..three court 'appearances'..of person
i get a hearing on 6 th may..[d day]..there i will have the ear of one sworn to srve hrh /her airs and suck ceasers..[just like the police perciuter and me all sworn..to serve hrh/herself..[ie govt/the crown]..and we the air that sustains the delusion[regardless..under the magna carta..a maGGI..MAY BE HEARD BY HER ROYAL HIGHNESS IN CASE OF MALFEASANCES AND ACTS OF TREASON ..well i get my hearing on 6 th of maY EXPOSING THE HIGH TREASON..I HAVE REVEALED..ON THESE VERY PAGES the govt noticed me to notice them this is thyne notice..declared me this day i have found high treason..in so many ways..from quewarrento doth the crown..declare war on me hrh treasure/income servant etc BY WHAT RIGHT DOTH HER CROWN IMOVERISH US WIth endless taxes levies fees fines surcharges [payable only in credit or paper/plASTIC..BUT NOT IN HRH DEBASED COIN? coin debasement is high TREASON and as we are under marshal law..we are yet at war[high treason your maJESTIES SERVANTS..god save the queen..was our truth[not advance australia capitalist exploiters,,fair..by unfair top dopwn bailout they went broke now try to break us..your majesty i go TO SPEAK WITH ONE SWORN TO SERVE AND PROTECT asking by what right..they double the price of services by what right they run..a protection racquet..that wastes 3 days of my time SO FAR. I NEED WITNESS..TO CALL TO TESTIFY BUT FIRST NOTICE YOUR NOTICE VIA MY NOTICE http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=6152#178808 Posted by one under god, Thursday, 13 February 2014 8:16:42 AM
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What an Orwellian declaration:
"it is the lamp that shows that freedom lives" Upholding freedom by denying the freedom of others, innocent people at that - the jury! This is a lamp of total darkness. The day that jury duty becomes optional/voluntary, is the day when we can start discussing the functioning of juries on its own merits or demerits. Posted by Yuyutsu, Thursday, 13 February 2014 12:47:12 PM
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Henry Magee, John Quinn, and the "Right of Resistance"
http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2014/02/henry-magee-john-quinn-and-right-of.html [The] constitutional security for `the right to keep and bear arms’ implies the right to use them … This is the only remedy suggested by the Constitution, and is necessarily the only remedy that can exist, when the government becomes so corrupt as to afford no peaceable one. The people have a legal right to resort to this remedy at all times, when the government goes beyond, or contrary to, the Constitution. And it is only a matter of discretion with them whether to resort to it at any particular time. – Lysander Spooner, “The Right of Resistance," from "An Essay on the Trial by Jury" (chapter II). Posted by one under god, Friday, 14 February 2014 8:15:54 AM
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just..so we are clear here
the right to bare arms..referS to thE coats of arms..[ie title] heraldic law/the LAWS OF PATENT..warrent/licence etc. my coat of arms IS THE HEAD..of the deer plus my totum duty..is of the golden horn THESE ARE The arms i bear in court[under a state shielD OF THE QUEENSLAND..[VAN DIE MENS LAND]/GREAT SOUTHLANDS..OZ ANYHOW THE 20 YEAR OLD STATE COAT OF ARMS..BEARS THE ENTIRE DEER JUSTIPOSED..INTO A PERVERTED POSTITION..representing hrh..that when joined tO AN ENTIRE COWS HEAD[SEE QLD COAT OF ARMS..JOINS TO THE DREAMING OF why i hold the head and the horn..as my arms/alms] i HAVE explained[noticed]..on these pages how i hold tHE HEAD..from the times of the first judgment..of the herbavors/getting reigned iN BY THE CARNIvors[i hold the head..because my ancestor gave up his body i hold the horn..[golden horn of plenty]..via the tribe issiah [the second judgment..of blood sacrifice..saw the fallen angels eat so hungry were they this time..they ate the head[the old carnivors needed the brain and eye and soft tongue..of the ox AND STILL WRE SO HUNGRY..THEY ATE ALL BUT ONE HORN..and transmutated..the learning into the horn of plenty. but of course ..i cant talk of this in court so say it pre court/by public declaration..that your mates know..i noticed them/my cred..lies in my coat of arms[you already stole my 'FIRE ARMS]... I COULD EXPLAIN..it better..but articles limitations..nessarlilly force brevity..its scatterd over my years here..take that as official notice/join the dots...6 MAY=JUDGMENT DAY FROM ONE WHO BEEN THERE BEFORE. the second the trial ends [but dont sweat..it dont end..funny enough mankind got it together,,this times[though doing more damage to gods perfect creation...that every carnivor eVER DID[or that those eating gods garden into desert sand..could concieve but we know..this TIME..WE CAN AVOID THE JUDGE..speaking his last judgments..as long as the judge dONT HASTEN TO JUDGE. AHHHM MEN. NOTICE TO servant=noTICE TO MASTER [im no longer in the arMY/IE..im not mister/but change the i to an a...[eh] Posted by one under god, Friday, 14 February 2014 8:37:12 AM
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