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The Forum > Article Comments > Uncapped university > Comments

Uncapped university : Comments

By Andee Jones, published 8/7/2013

Apart from the odd compulsive student, like me, or the odd obsolete teacher (also like me), few people know that what now passes for a university isn't a university.

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In "Uncapped university" Andee Jones (8 July 2013) writes:"Last year I enrolled in Masters-level courses ... academic equivalent of a chockers London Underground lift...". But which university and which masters course was this? My recent experience as a masters student was not like that, with small face-to-face classes and good on-line programs: http://blog.tomw.net.au/2011/08/tertiary-teaching-for-research-led.html

Universities, at least the ones I have attended recently (ANU and USQ) and the institutions I teach at (ANU and ACS CPEP), are very sensitive to comments from students. Students can complain to the university and government regulators. If you are unhappy with your course, then raise it with the internal university feedback processes, complain to the government regulator, and/or blog it.

If classrooms are grossly overcrowded, this may be a fire hazard which is a matter for local government authorities, who can order the building, or the whole campus, closed. When I have raised safety problems at a university, these have been quickly addressed. It helps if the VC's staff are reading your blog. ;-).

Another avenue for complaint is professional associations which accredit university courses. Universities are very keen to retain accreditation.

Also if you are unhappy with Australian universities, you can take your business elsewhere. There are other forms of education in Australia, such as Registered Training Organizations (RTOs). The RTOs have expanded beyond traditional trade courses. Recently I went through the certification process to teach in RTOs.

In addition there are smaller boutique programs connected to universities. I teach a course in the Australian Computer Society Computer Professional Education Program (ACS CPEP). The classes typically have twelve to twenty four students and the program is articulated to some university masters programs: http://www.acs.org.au/professional-development/cpe-program

Ultimately, if you are not happy with Australian education, there are on-line university programs available from around the world. At the moment I am looking at doing the Masters in Learning Innovation by Distance Learning at University of Leicester : http://www2.le.ac.uk/study/postgrad/distance/education/innovation
Posted by tomw, Monday, 8 July 2013 10:05:00 AM
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I am amazed ... I was right!! Philosophy IS being devalued in universities (some anyway). About 12 years ago, I noticed a lot of the 'thinking' units were being discontinued, and Philosophy was one. However, because Philosophy is still required in some degrees (Legal springs to mind) certain units were left in the course (Philosophy of the Enlightenment). I was 'outsourced' from my university to OpenLearning university and consequently I am finishing my degree On-line through Macquarie University.

If you want to control people, do not teach them to think. I can still study some Philosophers, but my learning is limited. It's like having a huge box of toys but only being allowed to play with certain toys. I love to learn, and I have just learned there are more ways than one to skin a cat :)
Posted by mally, Monday, 8 July 2013 1:03:36 PM
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The notion of physically fronting up in an 'airless closet' -- or anywhere else -- so that you can snap up the pearls of wisdom issuing from a lecturer's lips is very twentieth-century. An increasing number of universities are moving their courses on to the web, and an increasing number of students are finding that they can do most or all of their work from home. One day your grandchildren may marvel at the fact that you were actually expected to leave your bedroom in order to get an education.
Posted by Jon J, Monday, 8 July 2013 1:09:34 PM
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I find it really funny that the tertiary educated caste who are supposed to be oh, so rooly, rooly smart, and who are the prime advocates for Socialism, and letting anybody who can find a boat just walk into Australia with their hand out, are now screaming because their government is short of funds.

Instead of whining about class sizes, ask themselves why there are so many foreign students taking up space in Australian universities? It may have made sense from a foreign aid point of view, fifty years ago, for Australia to get brownie points from their still broke but economically growing Asian neighbours, to allow some Asian students to study in Australia. But all of these countries are now wealthy enough to have their own universities, and they do have them. Why are these people now flocking into our country and displacing our own?

It seems odd that we now allow so many Asians into Australian universities so that the Asians can continue to become more educated than Australians and eventually lead us scientifically.

Stop the boats. The fantastic amount of money that we are squandering on illegal immigrants, and legal immigrants from dysfunctional cultures, can be better spent on educating our own people.

Educated people in Australia should be able to understand cause and effect. If we waste our money on foreigners and we screw our productive class to buy the votes of the unproductive class (too many of whom were born overseas) then sooner or later, we go broke. And if the sundry "Philosophy" departments can't figure that out, then they are useless and should be abolished.
Posted by LEGO, Monday, 8 July 2013 1:46:16 PM
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Jon J. I can remember having a conversation with one of my lecturers about modernity and globalisation and he told me that one day not in the too far future, we, the students, would all be listening to our lectures over the internet, and all the students (in whatever country they were) of each unit would hear the same words. Gone would be individuality of lecturers. Now I am listening to my lectures over the Internet and my tutorials are also on the internet. There is no personal interaction. Sometimes the tutorial seems dull and boring for there is nothing personal happening. It is very easy to get side tracked and take the other students with you.

I hate to think of studying to think and understand but know that everyone else is seeing/hearing exactly the same thoughts and words. I am different and want to keep my difference.
Posted by mally, Monday, 8 July 2013 2:05:20 PM
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tomw's puff reads like a PR handout, and are certainly not the views of ANU staff. Andee Jones is much closer to the truth, which, in fact is even worse. Just to cite a couple of other ways in which universities have been destroyed: most business courses do not include accounting, accounting courses often have no mathematics, some science degrees have no physics, and so on. Articles in history journals are usually pop sociology. And corrupting all is the not-to be- mentioned requirement to pass full fee paying foreign students with inadequate English.
Posted by Leslie, Monday, 8 July 2013 2:05:47 PM
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