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Climate change: why do the facts fail to convince? : Comments
By Tom Harris, published 4/6/2012Arguments are about logic, but also group identification, which is one of the confounding factors in the climate debate.
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Posted by JamesH, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:14:40 AM
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A good article but disheartening all the same. By the time we convince all the conservative men in suits that global warming is real, the planet will be fried. It does bear out, however, what I've been saying for years, that if you want to convince the middle class of your position (land rights, shut down coal-fired power stations or whatever) don't come to the demo wearing dreadlocks and bare feet. The audience has to identify with you.
Posted by popnperish, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:34:46 AM
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Perhaps the real answer is that the facts are not facts at all but contrivances made by a rag tag group of NGOs and scientists not doing their jobs properly, and a corrupt and incompetent UN/IPCC
On the whole tax payers are not stupid.They see the money trails and who benefits eg Banks, Greengroups, shonkademics and shonky politicians like Al Gore and his mates,incompetent professional societies like the RS in the UK, and say whoah. http://climatedepot.com/a/9035/SPECIAL-REPORT-More-Than-1000-International-Scientists-Dissent-Over-ManMade-Global-Warming-Claims--Challenge-UN-IPCC--Gore Posted by bigmal, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:49:28 AM
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This is the first genuinely convincing argument that I have seen in the entire debate. Unfortunately, it merely highlights the problem, which is both very "human", and thoroughly intractable.
Even the "solution" offered, however logical and sensible it appears on the surface, will gain little traction against the entrenched positions that have been established over the past ten years or so. "...to finally end the expensive and highly divisive climate debate in favor of rational climate and energy policy" Underneath the emotion and hype, pretty much everyone can be persuaded to a position that says "we need a more sustainable energy policy", whether at a national or a global level. But the idea of dropping all the personal positional baggage that has been gathered along the way - from "mega-disaster" to "she'll be right" - will not happen in this lifetime. Perhaps the next generations will take a more sanguine and practical view, and be less prone to the hysteria that characterises much of the debate today. One can only hope. Posted by Pericles, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:49:55 AM
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Seems like a useful thesis to me.
Meanwhile the latest posting at Tom Dispatch is related to this topic. It is titled Bill McKibben Climate-Deniers Have Done Their Job Well. Posted by Daffy Duck, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:53:45 AM
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As James said, the climate changes. I agree. What I see is that the changes appear to be driven by other external factors and cycles. Any human impact is minor. This research just shows that most people bring far more to a discussion than so called pure reason. This is especially so when people find there is disagreement as to whether the science is settled (eg climate change) or conflicts with religious beliefs (eg evolution).
Given how climate has changed and is changing regardless of us humans, I for one am not concerned with stopping it. This isn't the perfect world that needs to be preserved. It just happens to be the one we live in NOW. I believe we just need to get on with life and make the most of what we have. I see the logical conclusion of the green movement being the destruction of everything built up on this entire planet and the resultant destruction of most if not nearly all humans. I for one will have nothing to do with such a strategy. DKit Posted by dkit, Monday, 4 June 2012 8:59:29 AM
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When Humans first walked out of Africa the sea levels were much lower than they are today.
Yep climate changes all the time that is a fact.
Sea levels have risen and fallen, that is a fact.