Social welfare seems mired in endless rhetoric, many people in positions which indicate experience directly with the issue state positions and make recommendations yet little seems to ever be achieved. There is more noise with little but argument to back it up than is helpful.

Whether assisting addicts directly relates is not clear to me, but it may provide insights. Dealing with addicts it is clear those who ‘hit bottom’ and take on responsibility for their choices and take hard nosed action make progress. Outside input can assist the process but it never substitutes for it.

There seems to be an enthusiasm for empowerment in work with poverty. The Smith Family has moved from a welfare agency to largely a training agency to assist children avoid staying in a poverty trap – historically TSF support has always ranged from material aid to direct assistance to children with their education through to things such as the BMC Youth Orchestra.

There is a need to help people avoid poverty, but there is a pressing need to assist those who are destitute deal with their material circumstance. This organisation is a shadow of its former self reflecting the world view of those managing the organisation rather than the needs of all those it formerly served.

Will poverty be eradicated? I doubt it. Fundamental values in life preclude it and there is nothing governments can do about that. The impact can be ameliorated.

Playing rhetorical games arguing sociological issues gives those engaged in the debate the thrill of the ‘joust’. Dealing with a mother with children without shoes, no rent money and no food requires practical assistance. Confronting a father who has been sacked just before Christmas and can’t take anything home, food let alone presents, demands an answer.

There are a lot of people arguing from the grand perspective – there is sadly few dealing with the reality of confronting people in dire need in a practical manner. Sadly The Smith Family once did this, but increasingly joins the hubbub of the crowd.

Recently it was reported that the rate of child poverty in the Nordic countries is 3%. In Australia it is 12%.

We have had years and years of a economic rationalism, ruthless regime ramming all sorts of follies like "efficiency" "Choice" "let the market decide" down our throats whether from the Coaltion or the ALP. The result is increasing inequality and poverty.

There is an excellent book called "Spirit Level" with data showing that everyone benefits from a more equal society, from the richest to the poorest.

It is clear that Australia has chosen not to reduce its levels of poverty. Maybe it is time someone worked out why this decision has been taken (ideology? ignorance? something else?) and reverse it.

The most impoverishing thing is to have one of your fundamental birthrights stolen, then sold to the highest bidder. 'Charitable support' & 'education' or a 'hand up' then has to be seen in the context of this theft.

If an end to poverty is the objective, the effect of "education" in transferring unemployment to other peoples also needs recognition.

“Education” needs to be controlled by the poor, not designed to make them more efficient servants of the rich. Establish cooperative pathways instead – see http://bit.ly/bloIB7 and change Centrelink’s Activity Test http://bit.ly/asF4Xy and help make public housing a real asset in any neighbourhood.

While land is chained to the market we are all slaves. No land rights? No choice but to serve someone else's agenda, & don't complain!

Please view the case for a right to housing as grounded in our BIRTHRIGHT to land (see http://bit.ly/b92hFj)
We must show viability of land rights + responsibilities.

Until more of us can relate to the land as caretakers, not as owners/tenants, we can't have sustainable development. http://ntw.110mb.com

How can "landrights4all" be secondary to property "rights" 4 some? Will air water or sunlight be the next birthright commodified?

I would like to point out that most on welfare control their money well. Many on high incomes waste the money they earn. There are good parents that manage the money well. There are also some shocking parents that are wonderful money managers. Sometimes parents with little or no skills can benefit from assistance with managering their money. These are more likely to have other problems that prevent them developing parenting skills. You will find these parents among the mentally ill, disabled and drug addicts. They need extensive family support and other support. The intervention by Mr. Howard was unfair and did not help with the problems it was supposed to assist. The latest child abuse figures in the NT show this to be the case. The intervention punished those who were doing the right thing. It would have had little effect on those who were not.

Too much of this for any genuine progress as it may interfere with the free operation of the pedophiles.

Asked what the federal government planned to do on the issue of clerical child abuse, Mr Rudd said it was important to acknowledge the pain of victims but “the church over some time now has established its own process within Australia for dealing with this”.

“And the church in doing so has dealt with many cases from the past, and where there have been imperfections in the process they have also sought to improve those processes.”

one might also say the same about the Philippines, and wonder why a country, blessed with such rich natural resources and talent, finds its best and brightest fleeing for better opportunities overseas and the poor keep getting more and poorer.

Even with 'conditional cash transfers' there are always strings attached to handouts and it is patronising, paternalistic and demeaning to behave toward the impoverished as if they were irresponsible and needed to have their money better managed. It doesn't take much to become poor - a missed mortgage or other necessary payment, robbery, illness, accidents - and you're a goner. Just look at Will Smith and his son in 'The Pursuit of Happyness.'

Material poverty is temporary, but a poverty of the imagination, of the heart and will, is much, much worse.