The Forum > General Discussion > How could a union boss justify this salary.
How could a union boss justify this salary.
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Posted by Philip S, Tuesday, 26 February 2019 8:09:07 PM
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Considering the state the economy of this Nation no-one should be on such a salary yet many senior public servants are on even higher salaries.
Want to put a stop to the rorts ? Don't vote ALP/LNP ! Posted by individual, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 8:49:50 AM
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There is no justification for that amount of money for any union operative. Come to think of it, there is no justification for unions these days. Unions are just training grounds for Labor politicians.
Posted by ttbn, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 9:13:59 AM
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Good Morning Philip,
I guess that we could question the salaries of any CEO of any organisation or for that matter the salaries and perks of our politicians. But if we're going to be fair - we really don't know what their jobs involve - what their responsibilities fully entail - and how their salaries are determined. Presumably their employers chose their executives on merit, qualifications, experience, and the results they produce for their organisation. The salary of $500,000 may appear to be huge to us - but how does it compare with the millions that for example the CEO of Qantas gets or the CEO of Westpac, and so on. The HSU is a huge organisation - that covers members working in public hospitals, ambulance, aged care, allied health, private hospitals, imaging, pathology and disability care. It has members in every state and territory. Its members are health professionals, paramedics, scientists, aged care workers, disability support workers, nurses, doctors, technicians, personal care workers, clerical and administrative staff, managers, medical librarians, and support staff. Therefore to question the salary of the General Secretary of this huge specialist organisation simply because the term "Union" appears in its title - doesn't somehow appear relevant. We need to look at the organisation itself and what it's work actually is - what it does that merits (or not) the salary mentioned. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 9:35:12 AM
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Foxy,
Those CEO's are on too much money as are scores of bureaucrats ! Comparing one outrageous salary to another one is utterly beside the point ! Too much is too much full stop ! The playing field is too crooked. Kevin Rudd gave himself a pay rise of over $ 200,000 for near ruining the nation. He still has many peers in the public service. Scott Morrisson has a lot to answer for as Treasurer. Cormann has openly displayed his utter ignorance of base level economy. The joint is saturated with bureaucrats bleeding the nation. Yet, there are people who want to vote them back in AGAIN ? Can we really blame the politicians for exploiting such idiotic voters ? Posted by individual, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 9:51:36 AM
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Individual,
I think it's up to the organisations themselves to decide and negotiate the salaries of their employees. Obviously those salaries will not continue if the employees don't come up with the required results that satisfy their employer. How much a company executive is paid is determined by what a given organisation thinks they are worth (or not). Politicians are a different matter - in which the public can voice their concerns. And have done so - quite often. The public purse and the perks involved should be accountable to us the voters - but private monies we really have no control over. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 10:20:39 AM
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Comparing one exorbitant salary with another is as pointless and childish as saying 'he did it too'; 'I'm not the only one'; 'Everybody does it', and so on. Philip is drawing attention to one undeserving crook in particular. If he wanted to compare or talk about all people who are paid too much, he would be dead of old age before reached the end of the list. Some posters simply have to take issue with others not in their political camp even if they have nothing to say that is relevant to the original post. Empty vessels make the most (unnecessary) noise.
Posted by ttbn, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 10:22:05 AM
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What is the take home pay after tax?
Posted by Is Mise, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 1:40:16 PM
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Dear Philip S,
Of course it is ludicrous but you forgot to mention that this bloke is serving 7 years for defrauding the Union including paying himself 3 times the salary of other leaders of unions, some way larger than the size of his. This article spells out the current salary ranges for different sectors. http://www.michaelpage.com.au/advice/market-insights/industry-reports/jobs-paying-highest-salaries-australia And yes $500,000 is far too excessive. The union has about 70,000 members. While union membership may well be optional it is hard to call it discretionary spending. The Essendon footy club CEO gets more than this with 70,000 members but people aren't virtually forced to take out membership but there is a moral factor here. And the AFL CEO is on 1.7 million dollars annual salary. It is fat cats of whatever stripe giving themselves pay rises. Posted by SteeleRedux, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 1:47:58 PM
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Good afternoon Philip,
It appears that the former General Secretary of HSU not only gave himself the salary of $500,000 but also was convicted and imprisoned for fraud on the 4th April 2014. Following his conviction and imprisonment the NSW Branch of the Labor Party expelled Williamson as a member of the Party. What motivated the man who supposedly was a man of "good character"previously - to behave in this manner? We can only assume as Steele points out that it was greed. Here's what Williamson said by way of explanation and apology to his union members: "As you would be aware from media commentary I was charged by the NSW Police over a number of matters relating to the financial operations of the Union when I was General Secretary. The charges laid by the police will shortly be before the Local Court and at that time I intend to enter a plea of Guilty to a number of charges. The matter will now be remitted to the District Court for sentencing. I wish to place on record my sincere apology to all of you. You placed your trust in me when I was the General Secretary and I abused that trust. I apologise unreservedly to all of you for my actions which were not in keeping with the position I formerly held. I have agreed to assist the Union in recovery actions against others and will honour that agreement. The Court will determine the penalty I am to receive, but it won't remove the fact that I have to live with the matter until the day I die. Please do not desert the Union over this issue as the Union did nothing wrong. It was me that did the wrong thing and I accept responsibility for my wrong doing." - Michael Williamson. I imagine this would have been small comfort for the members of the Union. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 3:08:26 PM
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yep we all dislike those we oppose ideologically getting what we see as 'overpaid'. Its an area that people will never agree. I think good teachers and nurses are underpaid while very average ones are well overpaid. Some Government workers are good value while others are lazy bludging on the taxpayer and using every avenue to decrease work and increase pay. Personally I don't like unions however if the membership are happy to pay mega bucks so be it. It would be interesting to know what people feel different occupations are worth.
Posted by runner, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 3:58:49 PM
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runner,
That's about the gist of it. That's why I'm so much in favour of having public servants on three years probation with further probation periods on promotions. The public service offers above average pay with above average benefits & it therefore is justified that performance is continuously appraised. That is not too much to ask for the rewards. I was in the PS for a couple of years & I have witnessed the rorts & incompetence first hand. The Public really deserves better than what they're getting lately. There are many who climbed the ladder according to the Peter principle & the costs to the taxpayer confirm this. No-one should be on more than half of the present top bureaucrat salaries. It's not deserved morally & not sustainable as it is now becoming apparent. The playing field must be levelled if we are to head into the future with realistic expectations. Posted by individual, Wednesday, 27 February 2019 5:57:39 PM
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Michael Williamson is in jail where he belongs. My wife a union delegate for the HSU spent 2 years out of the union as a protest, because of people like Williamson.
//there is no justification for unions these days.// typical of the begging bowl mentality of some. Does that include all those employer bodies as well? "Don Meij, the long-serving CEO of Domino's Pizza Enterprises, is the highest paid chief executive of an ASX200 company, earning $36,837,702 in the 2017 financial year." Imagine how much he would get if his pizza crap was halfway decent. And its $4 for the poor sod doing the home delivery, all he has to do is about 9,200,000 home delivs and he'll be on Don's money, but there's no union, and no need for one down at Domino's. I wonder why. Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 28 February 2019 6:20:07 AM
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One undeserving crook in particular Andrew Thorburn, NAB chief executive with walk away with an extra $1,000,000.
"Thorburn still made $4.3 million in the year to September 2018, down from $6.4 million in the prior corresponding period." Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 28 February 2019 6:40:53 AM
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Posted by JF Aus, Thursday, 28 February 2019 7:16:33 AM
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We had a Council CEO under whom everything went wonky but they still gave him $6000/week.
The other Council CEO ruined a project worth 25 mills & still walked away with an $80,000 bonus. Local Govt is a show that needs to be investigated. Posted by individual, Thursday, 28 February 2019 7:19:23 AM
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Local councils. That's where a lot of rorting goes on because few citizens are interested in local government. Solution? Abolish them. They are not even in the Constitution.
Posted by ttbn, Thursday, 28 February 2019 8:56:44 AM
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We should try & make public salaries an election issue. Anyone know how to go about it ?
Posted by individual, Thursday, 28 February 2019 4:14:47 PM
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INDY, You could try running as a one issue Independent at the upcoming election, people often do.
Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 28 February 2019 5:47:34 PM
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Paul1405,
I'd love to but standing with one foot in the grave & the other on a banana skin in a remote little village is not an ideal base to start in politics. Posted by individual, Thursday, 28 February 2019 7:53:04 PM
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I will dip my toe in here
See as an ex union official I remain convinced that union should have been shut up closed and its members taken by a real union The maggot mentioned, make no mistake he was and remains that Should be part way in to a 30 year sentence How did that figure come about? No doubt he and others stole more than that but it seem inflated LNP CEO, union heads, that is what they are, get that much but never heard of it in a workers union What was Pells salary? Posted by Belly, Thursday, 28 February 2019 9:05:23 PM
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Hi Belly,
Just down in Sydney for a catch up. Michael Daley is under some pressure in Maroubra, so I'm told, not enough to lose, but. Pat Farmer is running a strong campaign, and with ex disgruntled Labor mayor Noel D'Souza in as well, and sure to pull plenty of Labor votes, its not all plain sailing for dear old Mick. Good luck. Although Daley does have the Liberals disastrous Light Fail project just up the road to win votes for him. Posted by Paul1405, Friday, 1 March 2019 5:56:26 AM
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ttbn Quote "Philip is drawing attention to one undeserving crook in particular."
Correct, his salary can't be compared to CEO's from business etc, his salary was coming from union dues paid by members not selling things or providing services to other consumers. SteeleRedux Quote "Of course it is ludicrous but you forgot to mention that this bloke is serving 7 years for defrauding the Union including paying himself 3 times the salary of other leaders of unions, some way larger than the size of his." Technically irrelevant when collecting the salary he was not convicted it was after he was found doing fraudulent activities, he was not convicted for receiving the salary. ** How did he get away with it, others must have known so were they also being paid exorbitant salaries to keep quite? ** Posted by Philip S, Friday, 1 March 2019 7:40:09 PM
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Where can i fine the reply button, Im just a newbie here so take it easy. thanks
Posted by Comemall, Saturday, 2 March 2019 11:30:35 AM
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Comemall You can read what you wrote so you found the reply button, disguised as { New Post )
Posted by Philip S, Saturday, 2 March 2019 7:02:21 PM
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Personally I do not believe one card carrying working union member would say he or any other Union boss is worth anywhere near that amount per year.
Interesting to know what salaries present day Union bosses are on.