Folk, (and how I miss Kim Beazley),I can attest to having seen 9(nine) angels on the head of a pin; but I cannot attest as to whether or not there was room for any more.
Verbatim quotation of texts of dubious origin, stated through a prism of literal understanding fuel an argument; but camouflage a failure not of intellect, but of observation.
Don't relegate our religious and spiritual side to just Another Roadside Attraction.
This discussion condemns us to 'days of future past'.
Hypothetically, if Boaz, Fellow Human and Stevenlmeyer were to embrace the implications of a, let's say Buddhist viewpoint, of reincarnation, then each might a) stop bickering ,and b)begin to really empathise with that other guy over there.
If the good Episc. can embrace both sides of this intellectually poverty stricken argument, then good luck to her.

Palim... I was not aware that myself FH and Steven were 'bickering'..well not yet anyway :)

Steven is presenting very important information about some socio/religious realities occurring in the world, and we are all exploring this. I've not seen any verbal scuds zooming across the literary horizon just yet.

Is Mise. While I basically agree with your very simple definition, I think it needs a framework. You mention 'try to follow' the teachings of Christ.

I suggest that our Lords teachings are virtually impossible to follow all the time. Well..not impossible, but improbable, why ? for the same reason that

35Then James and John, the sons of Zebedee, while travelling with Jesus, asked to sit at his right&left hand in his GLORY.(too heavenly minded to be of earthly use)
In other words... the old 'flesh' raises its ugly head, and we are prone to following it. I realize you said "Try" to follow.... but in your statement there is the admission (and my confession) that we don't succeed.

So, if we cannot attain moral perfection in line with our Lords words and example.. how can we expect to stand flawless in the presense of a Holy God in who's presense sin cannot dwell?

Aah.. THAT is the most important question in the universe. It also leads to why Paul said in 1 Cor 15 "I passed on as of first importance that which I also received...that Christ died for our sins" and so on.

Salvation is a free gift of God for those who have faith... in Christ.

Being born again, is being born into Christ. That...is the absolute key.
Jesus said "Without me, you can do nothing" and he is right. (in the salvation sense)

Repent....and Believe (In Christ, as Saviour and Lord). Inseparable elements of the glorious Gospel.

For FH. benefit, everything Jesus said, and did, is meaningless without His resurrection. As Paul underlines "If Christ is not raised, we are:
a)Still in our sins
b)Of all men, most to be pitied.(because we believe in a blatant untruth)

1Cor15

Palimpsest, Buddhism is not supernatural and its effects can be scientifically analysed and explained; reincarnation is a scientific certainty if the universe is infinite but the supernatural including religions Christianity and Islam are quite the opposite of Buddhism and science.

BOAZ. I guess I did malign Steven. My apologies.I see this ongoing discussion as being unhelpful- same old same old, the study of the entrails of the corpses on innumerable battlefields.
I like alot of what Elaine Pagels has written re the political imperatives at work with the selection of gospels that became the Bible.
Writings of the time that emphasised a personal spiritual dimension that did not rely on capital A authority and a subservience to an accepted concept of god were suppressed. Pagels documents people of the time ridiculing those who insisted on a physical resurrection. They believed in a spiritual and eternal life and laughed at the literal interpretation of Jesus' resurrection.
Boaz guys like you and Fellow Human often argue very intelligently your cases, but only from your fixed paradigms. You condemn us all to more of the same. There are other ideas out there on the subject of religion that are worthy of consideration

Hmm...might be mistaken here but I imagine that Christ would say that anyone who followed the basic principle of "love one another" was a Christian.

Those that recognise that the very character and attitudes of Jesus exactly express the very nature and character of God are followers of Christ. They recognise he [Jesus] was in his spirit born of God to use a paternal term - thus he was the Son of God. God is the father of spirit. Jesus human birth was very natural and it never classified him - God. We recognise him as God clothed in humanity because the very character of God was expressed in and through him. Those that express the very character and attitudes of God are sons of God. They are not worshiped in any way because of their humanity, but the purity of spirit who is born of God [for God only is worshipped]. To be a son of God means to be born of the spirit of God. That is - God is "Our Father", father of our spirit. Certainly not in any natural sense but in a spiritual sense.

By failing to grasp the concept of a spiritual birth by the spirit of God one will naturally deny the divine nature of Christ. That the spirit at indwelt Christ was exactly God. To fail to grasp one's rebirth out of the self centred life to follow the teachings of Christ as Lord fails what it means to be Christian.

A Christian truly recognises the life and teachings of Christ as of God and we respond to live by them that identifies one as a Christian and reject our self centred immature id drives.