it has become clear that political discussion is hampered on this site by the weak vocabulary of ozzies. so in future, before you refer to a society as a democracy, would you please consider using the neologism: polliarchy? it is precisely accurate, and preserves the word 'democracy' for those that actually have it. a society that is a monarchy ruled by politicians should welcome such a descriptive word. there will be no charge, i claim no copyright.

Part 1
Yes Demos, you're right to a degree, but I feel that in all reality it's 'big business' that rule our politicians who in turn run our lives.
Big business, mostly US owned is like a twisting, squirming bunch of worms. They and world wide Governments are so intertwined, they appear as one entity. You grab grab one worm's tail only to find the head you were seeking is not the one you get.
Perhaps a newly formed group of Australian citizens acting together to counteract the obscene profits of big business might be required to bring the one sided equation of business and human rights back into alignment.
The group (call it whatever you like) could act through the Internet, postal services, telephone or word of mouth and group events to organise ways to stifle the over accumulation of big business profits that are counteractive to the well being of the average citizen. Eg: Organising Australians to switch en mass from Telstra to another company until Telstra stop abusing their workers and the gullible public that continues to support them. Same with other companies.

Part 2
Still, I can't see it happening while all the mums and dads that have been scammed into believing the money they have invested in the Australian Stock Exchange and in companies like Telstra, Quantas etc will continue to grow on the back of an ever upwards market.
Stock markets are long overdue for a major fall and if that fall should be precipitated by the realisation of the end of cheap oil, it may well never recover. Mums and dads would do well to remember that all the money they think they have invested is only paper money and is being churned out by the US at an amazing rate. It's worthless and this will be proven once the markets finally dive.
Interesting to note that Nigeria's oil workers have just gone on permanent strike. Cities there have closed down, there's nobody on the streets. As the worlds 8th biggest oil producer and a member of OPEC, it will be interesting to see how oil prices go in the next week or so. Could be the start of bigger things to come.

yes, aime, money rules, ok. but i regard politicians as the hyenas of human society, plutocrats/corporations as the lions. they will fight, but both prefer to get their dinner without strife (on us, the poor wildebeest), so they have a mutual respect. in fact, biologists say that at night, hyenas rule. so too in the human jungle- a caucus of pollies in closed session can hurt even the rich, generally by accident.

anyway, in another thread i suggested that 'crypto-plutocratic oligarchy' was the right designation for parliamentary societies, but it didn't catch on. it doesn't role off the tongue...

DEMOS, why have you started a new thread and abandoned one that you started a few days ago on virtually the same subject?

I have a solicited a response from you there that has gone unanswered.

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=722#13061

sry, ludwig, didn't see your query. i rather think an extensive discussion of what oz should be like, and how to get there from here, deserves it's own thread. here's the bare bones:

oz as she shd be:

1. a written constitution, including all aspects of society.
2. direct election of ministers, on their proposed plans and budget, and track record of achievement.
3. public records to be available on mirror web sites. no secret deals, no secret treaties.
4. effective and accessible power of citizen initiated referendum.

how to get there:

1. form a citizen action group to write a constitution. publicize the project to get maximum participation.
2. organize political action to induce a major party to call a referendum establishing the new constitution. this is not so hard as it may appear- the labor party supported citizen initiated referendum until 1968. if 100,000 would-be citizens write 'democracy' on their ballot, and labor loses by 50.000 votes, they will return to the path of virtue.

DEMOS

I basically go along with this.

But it is not going to take us away from the necessity of having a system operated by politicians, is it?