This link pretty much says it all.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/opinion/no-the-rich-dont-pay-a-fair-share-of-tax-they-pay-all-of-it/story-e6frgd0x-1226841174461

And to think that the seven out of every ten want more.

Unbelievable!

This is an opinion piece, based on emotive arguments.

The fact is that high net worth individuals, have two incomes, the first one is the income that is declared, the second is their real income that gets hidden away in various tax evasion structures.

<And please ignore Hockey's rubbish about the top 10 per cent of earners paying 46 per cent
< of total income taxes and the top 2 per cent of earners paying 26 per cent, whereas the
<bottom 20 per cent pay just 2.5 per cent.

<The trouble with this is the definition of "earners". These are ATO figures. The level of
<"earning" is based on DECLARED income. As the corporate figures suggest there must be a
<lot of individuals pulling in very, very large incomes but whose "declared" income is very
<modest indeed.

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/opinion-is-one-thing-facts-are-another-20141002-10ogp4.html#ixzz3FGJPRZ2s

<Someone pulling in a million or two might only have a "declared" income of, say, $50,000.
< We simply do not know the level of tax contribution of people with high incomes for the
<simple reason that the ATO does not know what their real income is.

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment/opinion-is-one-thing-facts-are-another-20141002-10ogp4.html#ixzz3FGK31ihd

Yes Wally, but what we do know is that this group collectively pays in the order of $74 billion in taxes. Which is almost half oir annual tax revenue. Do you honestly believe we can survive without that? Because that's the real issue.

These mega rich companies are paying very high wages, high super, maternity leave, annual leave, high compliance costs, the list goes on.

Now if you throw 30cents in the dollar tax into their mix, I'm sure they would find another country to do business that far more accommodating and appreciative of their efforts, because the taxes they pay are just one thing. It the taxes they generate through direct, or indirect employment that must also be taken into consideration, because if these large companies leave, the workers won't have jobs.

rehctub, almost sounds rational, however historically it really does not matter if a worker is paid $1 a day or $100 a day.

Those who operate businesses, will always complain that the workers are paid far too much and operating costs are too high.

By the looks of it some of these "High operating costs" are being used as a tax minimisation method.

That's the key issue being left out here Wally, tax write offs. When they are legal, why can't they be used? Normal wage earners use them all the time. Why not big business?

In fact, you don't see big business shopping at the markets, buying goods GST Free, yet every day Australians do it each and every week, hence avoiding tax.

I have bought some goods from O/S and even with the GST added, I would have saved some money. However buying from O/S is not something I do on a regular basis.

What I suspect will have a greater affect is the falling Australian dollar, so for a while domestic goods will perhaps be of the same value as O/S goods.

So in reality not having GST paid on imports from over seas is a real furphy. As long as the goods are cheaper than the prices charged in Australia, people will buy and import goods from over seas.

To really discourage people from buying and importing goods from overseas, the GST charged on those goods would need to be in vicinity of 30-40%.

We are all living above our means.
We need higher taxes, general, business and GST to fix the problems and create to steps to growth.
We need to kill the cash economy.

Yes Chris, we are headed for a train wreck.

While I don't have a problem with a cashless society, what we need more than anything is a fair for all tax system. A small flat tax on all transactions. I do believe it's getting closer.

Wolly B,

This thread is about tax paid by individuals and you post twice a link to an article on the federal budget.

The net tax paid (taxes paid less grants returned) is paid overwhelmingly by the high income earners, and this can be found from treasury data.

Under declaring income would seem to be a very easy way to dodge tax. Unfortunately for high incomer earners, their income is declared by their employers, and for those running businesses, regular audits make it extremely difficult to hide income and fake expenses. There are very few people that have access to tax havens that can get away with false declarations of income, and if they get caught the tax penalties and jail time is a strong deterrent.

Yes SM, big business does not fake their incomes as they are listed companies and have serious penalties in place should they do so. They do however minimize their taxes where possible, and where legal and we must remember, while to fed treasurer is on say $500K per year, the accountants in many of these large companies have larger expense accounts than that, so whos out smarting who.

Small business on the other hand, in most cases, are flat out raising enough cash flow to keep the wheels turning, mostly because so many large companies often drag their cerditors out.

Sure, there are taxes that should be paid, that are not, but, would we prefer the taxes raised through the jobs they create, or, would we prefer far less jobs and 30% of much less.

I know which one I would prefer. Its all about balance and there is always more than one side of a story, except the full truth often does not have the same appeal.

Chris
Only an idiot thinks that more tax makes society richer.

If your theory is right, why not make the tax rate 100% for everyone?

But if not, by what rational criterion do you decide the cut-off point? (Hint: there isn't one.)

Chris, I don't think higher taxes are the answer at all, simply because less than three out of every ten pick up the slack and pay the bills. A battle they are loosing by the way. Just imagine how tough it woukd be fir them if we lost our large companies, along with their $74 billion in taxes.

I firmly believe the answer lies with a fairer tax system, like a transaction/spending tax, as this type of tax taxes money transaction, not money earners.

I currently pay about $17,500 annually in tax, company tax excluded. So, a TT of 2% would see myself, and every other average wage earner have an additional $16 THOUSAND DOLLARS to spend each year. That, if my sums are correct is another $176 billion dollars injected into our economy each year

In my opinion it's far better to give people money to spend, then tax their spendings, than to take it from their earnings simply because our sliding tax scales give disincentives to people wanting to earn more.

A TT tax of just 2% would mean every big company would pay that, even if they do take their money off shore, and every wage earner would be less likely to seek out questionable tax write offs as 2% would hardly be worth chasing.

I do think we are getting closer to this.