loved the way Ms Wong remained silent on Q & A last night as Palmer called Wong's people of origin ' mongrels ' who shot their own. How badly and sadly that Labour need Palmer so much with his wrecking tactics that again she is willing to compromise everything she claims to believe in. She could not help but to butt in each time Truss spoke. Could you imagine if Abbott had said what Clive said. More sisterhood hypocrisy.

Minister Penny Wong had enough class to not dignify a response to that disgraceful racist rant from a bloke who turned on his true colours for all to see last night.

Palmer bought his way into politics, and he will go out the same way that other racist disgrace of a politician, Pauline Hanson, went.

He is not worthy to be on the same panel as Penny Wong, and it showed.....

Penny Wong did put on a cringeworthy performance, stroking and patting Palmer, while her non-verbals, examples being her extreme lean back away from Palmer, and her eyes and facial movements too showed strong dislike for the obese, wealthy man next to her. She is probably jealous of his wealth anyhow, which wouldn't have helped.

I would like to see the political parties put forward fewer career politicians like Penny Wong. She is superficial and 'full of it'. She is all cheap lines and student politics debating tricks. Wong could talk under water with her mouth full of marbles and still be claiming credit for something. In preference there need to be more leaders with life experience outside of politics, who can demonstrate successful achievement and contribution to Australia.

Heather Ridout, AO, board member of the Reserve Bank, was on the same Q&A and presents as the 'real deal' if you want someone with credibility, results on the board (no pun intended) and ethics. Penny Wong seems to be her exact opposite.

I don't believe that Ms Wong demonstrates strength of character. However that was proved long ago in the treatment of Kevin Rudd. Penny Wong did alright out of that and advanced her interests.

I suppose some here might also remember other occasions where she appeared to put personal career future ahead of principles she espoused elsewhere. An instance could be gay marriage where she appeared to run with the fox and hunt with the hounds.

It would always be Penny first and Penny last I would think.

Typical example of fundy christian misogyny from OLOs resident extremist runner.
Palmer goes off on an insulting rant about China. Truss gives perfect examples of pollie (non)speak. The vinnies guy nails it and Heather
Ridout contradicts the government on everything.
But all runner sees is Penny Wong and her race.
You really are a nasty piece of work runner.
Jesus would be so proud.

Penny Wong had enough class
Suseonline,
You'd better read up on the definition of class.

Lol!

Palmer goes off on a racist rant...but...but...runner starts a thread on Penny Wong on the issue.

Well that makes sense - not!

Here's a tip, runner, the next time a pollie goes off the deep end - how about starting a thread on the person who actually did the rant - not someone sitting at the same panel.

Suse,

"Minister Penny Wong had enough class to not dignify a response to that disgraceful racist rant from a bloke who turned on his true colours for all to see last night."

Precisely!

mikk,

"Typical example of fundy christian misogyny from OLOs resident extremist runner.
Palmer goes off on an insulting rant about China. Truss gives perfect examples of pollie (non)speak. The vinnies guy nails it and Heather
Ridout contradicts the government on everything.
But all runner sees is Penny Wong and her race.
You really are a nasty piece of work runner.
Jesus would be so proud."

Precisely!

Palmer is a fool when he lets his mouth run off. Wong knew he'd dropped a clanger - why would she get involved in the fall out?

Here's what Clivey posted on twitter once he'd realised he'd gone too far...

"My #qanda comments not intended to refer to Chinese people but to Chinese company which is taking Australian resources & not paying #auspol"

Penny Wong is every bit as self serving as Clive Palmer. Penny Wong is just as arrogant and even more condescending. I can't stand her.

'Typical example of fundy christian misogyny from OLOs resident extremist runner.

I see Mikk only 'progressives ' and Isalmist are allowed an opinion in your warped eyes

'Minister Penny Wong had enough class '

no Susie just cunning enough to know that Labour needs the wrecker. I would call it gutless.

'Penny Wong is every bit as self serving as Clive Palmer'

well said Hippie

All politicians are self serving by nature Runner, but this fact was not what you were alluding to was it?
The fact she is an Asian female politician who supports gay marriage would have to put her in the worst category of politician for someone like you.

Luckily, you are well in the minority with the views on this exchange.
Palmer has been well and truly pilloried re his outburst, and has done himself huge political damage by showing us all his true identity.

I watched that episode of "Q and A," and I
must have missed what others got out of it.

I thought both Penny Wong was her usual intelligent,
well reasoned, self. And Clive Palmer was his usual
theatrical self. Which is what we've come to expect
from him. Like him or loathe him - he is entertaining.
Only time will tell how long Clive remains in politics.

We all interpret the same phenomenon in very different ways,
whether its a government's policies, or a TV program, people
tend to see things from a viewpoint of subjectivity.

It will be interesting to read further comments on how the
posters of this forum (those that watch "Q and A") interpreted
the panel's comments on Monday evening.

There have been many errors made by various politicians in
their speeches over the years - including those recently of
the treasurer and the PM. Clive Palmer is not the first or
the last to make this error.

America kill lots of there own people and innocent of anything people in other countries (drones) I am expecting Clive to point this out bet it won't happen.

Statistically in America now you are more likely to be killed by a police officer than a terrorist.

Where are you now Clive?

Suse and Poirot,
I don't bother watching Q & A as it is hardly balanced. But I have read press articles about what Palmer said.

While his rant was such that you can go at him on any number of things, it could not be termed 'racist' as you both claim.

Now I have little time for the bloke and think him a fool but your criticism should be more accurate. I did not see anything I could term as racist.

To be critical of a persons conduct, a culture or religion is not being racist.

Suse, Pauline Hanson was before tribunals for racism on a number of occasions and in each and every case the charges were found wanting. so again your allegations are false.

Lol!...Banjo,

Palmer said:

"On Monday night's Q&A program, Mr Palmer called the Chinese government "bastards" and "mongrels" that "shoot their own people"."

Fair enough, he was having a go at the govt of China...although he quickly changed tack and accused a Chinese company of not paying for Oz resources.

I wonder why, then, runner is making such a big deal out of Penny Wong not stepping in, as in...

"loved the way Ms Wong remained silent on Q & A last night as Palmer called Wong's people of origin..."

He appears to be criticising Wong for not stepping in to berate Palmer and defend her "people of origin".

runner, appears to dismiss the possibility that Wong, being an intelligent person, realised Palmer was mouthing off (as usual) in regard to the Chinese Govt/whoever in China has upset him lately...and decided to let the public critique take its course.

So, if, as it seems, it was not a racist swipe...why is runner deriding Wong for not defending her people or origin. Is she supposed to step up and defend the Chinese govt every time a disaffected business man-cum-pollie gets his knickers in a knot?

Seems the catalyst for this thread was a furphy....

It was fair enough that runner took up the racist accusations by the commentariat in the media and then asked why Suseonline's 'Minister' for every possible victimhood going didn't have the bottle nor the inclination to murmur some protest.

Runner was perfectly right to ask that Penny Wong be judged by her own ideals, after all she has ridden the discrimination, victimhood and affirmative action wagons mercilessly to get where she is. To add the obvious, her excesses in that and those of the gender and class warring Julia Whatshername saw them out of government to boot. Or should that be booted out of government?

Anyone who could not see her patting and stroking her previously declared enemy, and the opposite message of her non-verbals in his respect is either in denial or is lacking in the sight department. More likely it is those 'special' partisan glasses again.

Labor buddied up to the Greens and paid the price for that. Labor's credibility and membership are still being eroded and compromised by the Greens. Cynical back-room deals with the Palmer Party will come to haunt them too.

Having said that, it is still incongruous and gross, creepy gross, to witness Penny Wong trying her feminine wiles out on Palmer himself and on national television. From one of the Big Hitters of the infamous Handbag Hit Squad and expert on 'sexism' and misogyny who bats for the other side it was inappropriate, double standard, and creepy-gauche.

Runner is entitled to his views. The main stumbling block here seems to be that he is once again pricking egos made very thin-skinned (where they want to be!) by the prevailing political correctness that is a scourge.

Tough game for the PC crew to play all angles on this one but that doesn't ever stop them from trying. Funny to watch.

All here seem to agree that Clive is a joke.

you are wrong Susie to claim

'The fact she is an Asian female politician who supports gay marriage would have to put her in the worst category of politician for someone like you. '

It certainly would put her last as far as the good policy for this nation but I would be happy to vote for an Asian female pollie who had any decent policies.

What the Labor/Greens supporters are in denial about is how they let Clive get away with what he said simply because they need him as a wrecker. Had Truss said that Chinese were mongrels who shot their own Wong would of gone straight to one of the disrimination agencies. Again she showed as she did by backing Rudd that she is not the intelligent reasonesed pollie that the 'progressives 'like to laud but willing to tolerate anything if it serves the party cause.

Now you're being silly, runner.

As if Truzzzzz would say that kind of thing.

Even foot-in-mouth Abbott and Hockey wouldn't go there "in that particular manner".

otb,

I know how much you like to put the boot into female lefties, but...

"It was fair enough that runner took up the racist accusations by the commentariat in the media and then asked why Suseonline's 'Minister' for every possible victimhood going didn't have the bottle nor the inclination to murmur some protest."

The "racist" commentary in the media - is just that.

After the fact, as well.

So is Wong supposed to deduce in the seconds after Palmer opens his big trap and slams the Chinese Govt, that the commentary in the media is going to opt for a racist slant....Is she supposed to do that? - And then come howling out of the boxes defending her Chinese antecedents?

She didn't make the foolhardy comment - Palmer did.

It sure is fascinating how you guys reach way down into the barrel to find something to throw at a female politician on the left.

(..and, otb, I'm sure you'll have fun putting Poirot through the ringer for the "Truzzzz" comment - my gift to you - yawn...)

'It sure is fascinating how you guys reach way down into the barrel to find something to throw at a female politician on the left. '

You can't be serious Poirot. Your Abbottphobia (conservative male)is without equal. Yep just play the victim in order to excuse incompetence or anything else for that matter.

LOL Poirot, you are having problems sorting it.

Because it suits your discourse on this occasion, you deliberately underrate the PC sensitivity of members of the Handbag Hit Squad, who could (and did!) find sexism and misogyny in a man looking at his watch. Finding 'racism' in what Palmer said would ordinarily be child's play for Ms Wong. She is usually so hair-triggered as to lay the charges prior to the event - speculative gossip to create a story line.

Ordinarily they (and you, LOL) would experience no difficulty at all in finding racism everywhere. Penny Wong could instantly turn the indignant outrage 'ON' over a wee li'l meow in the House, a place where she herself is a tricky and ferocious berater and insulter, with a hide like a rhino.

Runner is talking about the B.S. and hypocrisy of the outrageous censorious political correctness that is endemic in Australia. Runner has wielded his pin deftly to again prick that huge smelly balloon of political correctness, fraud.

Amusing watching the PC crew trying to play all of the bases on this one. Maybe after some of the leftist gurus have indulged in their mental gymnastics and wordsmithed a tricky, contorted explanation to suit. You and others must be hanging on something to appear in The Drum, Crikey, NM and so on. Never mind, soon all will be 'On Message' after being told what to think and say.

runner,

"You can't be serious Poirot. Your Abbottphobia (conservative male)is without equal..."

However, I'm not required to scratch around in the dregs of some other party's faux pas to have a crack at Abbott.

He sprays his incompetence around like confetti.

It would be remiss of me not to comment on it.

We enjoy almost a gaffe a day from Abbott and his crew of dingbats.

(cartoonists refer to this govt as "The gift that keeps on giving":)

.........

"Ordinarily they (and you, LOL) would experience no difficulty at all in finding racism everywhere..."

What's yer problem, otb? Wong acts like a grown-up and you and runner-boy can't handle it. In desperation you go looking for the person who was sitting next door to the one who screwed up - and then pass judgment on her.

Reminds of America after 9/11. Saudi Arabia funds the mission - so the yanks go in and invade the country next door.

Figures....

Heh, heh, you are struggling and casting about for traction, Poirot.

You will get the lines for your indignant, self-righteous hysteria when your 'Progressive' gurus sort their PC hierarchy - the order of priority - from their PC Manual and produce some words for The Drum, Crikey, NM and so on.

Then you can all be 'On Message', after being told what to think and say.

You'll just have to hang fire and wait, trouser that gun and both hands out of your pockets, Big Boy.

I must have missed what others got out of it.
Foxy,
Unfortunately not just on Q&A you don't see what others see. I really believe that you must have had such a blessed life that you can afford to view the world through rose-coloured glasses. You always contradict the experiences of others simply because they don't fit your goody, goody rose-coloured world. I & others don't have a problem when someone doesn't agree with our ideas but when actual experience is dismissed then that's a totally different game.
I agreed with Derryn Hinch when he said no good complaining about the Chinese buying up Australia if Australians are stupid enough to sell it without giving other Australians a second thought.

Dear Individual,

Everything is relative; everything has its story, and
everyone has obstacles to overcome. They are our greatest
teachers. Each of us goes through transitions and
transformations.

The important things is that we acknowledge them and learn from
them.

Take care.

cont'd ...

Dear Individual,

"Don't call the world dirty
because you forgot to clean your glasses."
(Aaron Hill).

Foxy,
You're in big trouble if you can't distinguish between dirt & delusion. This Aaron Hill is not an academic by any chance ?

Dear Individual,

Aaron Hill is an English poet.
And because he uses words of
more than one syllable - you'd probably
consider him an "academic."

There you go.

There you go.
Foxy,
you must admit I was pretty close, my next guess would have been rich kid. Cheers

Dear Individual,

Of course you would have -
you're not happy - without a delusion
of some kind. ;-)

Clive would appear to be digging a very large hole for himself legally, ironic, no?
As for Ms Wong, how soon we forget!
Think back to her performance in Gov', she was a tortured speaker and an absolute bane to good communication, a consummate politician, and exactly what's wrong with our Two Party System.
She is now playing the role of Opposition just as adroitly, and able to be a little looser in her pronouncements thereby. I don't doubt she's enjoying that, the irresponsibility.
However, as I said, she's a perfect example of everything wrong with the Australian political system, she's a party hack, a dirty infighter without heart, morals or ideology, good at acquiring power within the corrupt system we suffer under but as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike when it comes to good policy for Australia or our common weal.
Like all politicians here her time is roughly divided into 80% striving for personal power or influence, 15% scheming for her Party's advantage and what's left devoted to Parliament, with electoral business squeezed into any gaps as and when she feels like it.

G'dayBruce,

Re Ms Wong, that is my assessment of her exactly.

I am hoping that she and other career politicians like her are creatures of a particular time, the dark period of political correctness, which is slowly lifting.

There always were quick-witted opportunists like Ms Wong. It is just that a perfect storm in human events created the environment for more of the same selfish, egocentric, mercenary frauds to bloom for a time.

Types who always escape responsibility for errors, but are the first in to lodge personal claim for the results obtained from the efforts of others who never ask for and rarely get credit themselves.

And I always understood Penny Wong was born in Malaysia and educated in Australia.

Ah, the Penny just dropped, we were wong all along.

Agronomist, "And I always understood Penny Wong was born in Malaysia.."

What is your point?

Dear Agronomist,

Penny Wong was indeed born in Malaysia and educated
in Australia. The following link may be of
interest to you:

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2014/08/15/penny-wong-overcoming-racism-make-political-history

So Foxy you are agreeing that runner was right and Ms Wong should have spoken up. Refer to runner's original post.

With the alleged racism against Chinese in Malaysia then and now the migration to Australia was a good idea.

You did say before that Australia is the lucky country, and Penny Wong has done rather well wouldn't you say?

BTW, what prevented the Penny Wong promoted in that SBS interview from taking her political rival, Palmer, to task?

otb,

We've already established that Palmer was directing his vehemence at the Chinese Govt....ostensibly, it seems because he was shirty about a business deal/Chinese company he was involved with.

So runner's opening post was based on his take that Palmer was referring to "Chinese" people in general.

Why should Wong, in the ensuing seconds after Palmer makes one of his famous big-mouthed balls-ups, jump in to defend the Chinese Govt?

She had more sense than to buy into the ravings of a self-aggrandising pollie who was mouthing off for his own selfish purposes.

Might I also inquire - since runner, ob and others are choosing this issue to sledge Penny Wong - why you are not also questioning the behaviour of Chinese born PUP Senator, Dio Wang, for his defence of Palmer's injudicious remarks?

http://www.smh.com.au/national/its-the-medias-fault-wang-on-palmer-chinese-bastard-comment-20140819-105u3w.html

"Mr Wang said many comments in the media ignored the context of Mr Palmer’s statements, which he said were a result of “persistent and even provocative questioning by the host”.

Given, runner's logic....why ignore this statement from Palmer's close colleague, while putting the boot into Wong?

Are some of the anti-Asian resident raciest on the forum crying crocodile tears about Palmer's comments and Penny Wong's response or lack of.

I'm not a Labor Party supporter but I must say they have a fine asset in Penny Wong. Came across very well sitting between Truss and Palmer.

otb,

I suggest you read the link I gave regarding
Senator Penny Wong.

Read it out loud and very
slowly. Then read it again. And again.
And it may help to read it even one more time.

One can only hope that you will eventually get it.

One can only hope.

I think this comment on the remark by Dio Wang was correct:

<<Senator Wang said he recognised the remarks were directed specifically to certain enterprises, as opposed to individual members of the Chinese community>>

But moving away from that. I have a question for the ABC --and anyone else who has the technical knowledge

One second/less than a second after Clive made the comment the camera flashed to a Chinese lady in the audience and we saw her mouth which looked for all the world like "wow!"

The time between his comment and her response was too narrow for the camera jockeys to have panned across and caught it.

How were the ABC camera jockeys to know that that Clive was going to say something that would impact on a Chinese member in the audience.
Even allowing for multiple camera (and I''m not sure how many they use) There seems something very contrived about it all.

Good question...SPQR...I noted that too.

Albeit, I expect the production team was primed for Palmer to go of the deep end (after all, he had a national audience) - so they thought they'd pan to someone Chinese-looking for effect.

The ABC can skew something as readily as the others.

Why just this morning ABCNews24 jumped off the feed of Morrison at the HRInquiry while he still being grilled and went to an outside presser of Abbott unveiling a "project" in Adelaide (one which was organised in 2009 - but which he's now happy to associate himself with)...and we were treated to Abbott waffling on his multitude of policy bloomers.

But why should runner and otb hammer Wong for not taking Palmer to task - and not Wang?

Have you ever been to a studio audience program SPQR?

To go back to my earlier comment, the whole reason I pointed out that Penny Wong has no links to the Chinese Government or even allegiance to China is that it should not be a big surprise that she didn't respond to Palmer. runner in his own inimitable way could only see that Penny Wong looks Chinese and that was good enough for him.

It says a lot more about runner (and some others commenting here) than it does about Penny Wong.

Wong is damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't.

If she sits quiet and doesn't argue with Palmer, people come onto this forum and complain about it. If she speaks out and replies to Palmer, the same people would come onto this forum and complain about it.

Given a situation like that studio and with Palmer in the hot seat, with his well known loose-cannon reputation and a mouth that's faster than his brain, any director worth his salt would have had one camera watching any Chinese person whenever the subject of China came up, awaiting just such a moment.
Dear Miss Wong was perfectly correct to not react overtly to the big oaf, politically, and, as I said, she's a consummate politician.
Just as with Abbott a couple of years back, allow me to paraphrase, God help us all if Wong ever becomes PM!

So the argument now is not that Ms Wong was somehow taken by surprise, but that she is the consummate politician who measured her (nil) reaction.

However that is what the OP is saying is it not? That Ms Wong's legendary sharp sight, hair trigger and ferocity for all things 'racist' and discriminatory stem not from commitment at all, because it can be turned on and off as she pleases, especially where there is an advantage in it for her. In this case she was smooching up to a despised rival - all pats and strokes - and cynically focussed on her political secondary gain. No different from her flexible principles demonstrated by her before.

That is political pragmatism and convenience. Hypocrisy as well from a politician who rides the victim bandwagon and constantly lectures others from the Manual of Political Correctness.

That makes her no better than any other political attack dog and the comparison with Tony Abbott of the past is a good one.

G'dayBruce, "God help us all if Wong ever becomes PM!"

Yes, many would agree with you too!

Come off it, the so called deputy PM Wazza Truss was on the panel, where was the "leadership" from the plonker? If Palmer wants to make a fool of himself on national TV , who are we to stop him.

Come on, Paul..

Apparently one is only expected to censure Palmer if one is sitting on the panel and happens to be of Chinese extraction.

Then they get a whole thread dedicated to impugning them - even though they didn't actually make the offending comment themselves.

otb is especially excited to be involved in the sledging because the said candidate is not only a woman - but a leftie as well!

(Hoorah!)

Dear Poirot,

This entire hooha is all about Clive Palmer's
dispute with the Chinese Mining Company -
Citic Pacific. Apparently according to articles
on the web Palmer is in dispute with Citic
over just about every facet of a mining joint
venture in WA's Pilbara region. Citic claims
Palmer stole $12 million from a trust account.
Whereas Palmer doesn't deny this - but he feels
he was entitled to that money and he's suing Citic
for royalties he claims they owe him.

Hence his anger on "Q and A," and rant.

Complex situation that I daresay will eventually
come to light. There's no denying though that this
guy can attract media attention.

However, the attacks here on Senator Penny Wong
simply don't make any sense. She's not Chinese,
and as you and others have pointed out - why
focus on her simply because she's a woman, looks
Asian, is a Labor MP, oh wait.

I guess I've answered my own questions.
Of course a certain calibre of men would find her
a threat.

What was I thinking.

Well Fox, I realise you can't be referring to me, at no point have I denigrated Wong " simply because she's a woman, looks
Asian, is a Labor MP".
I denigrated her for being exactly what she is, a highly successful part of a decayed and rotten to the core Party political system.
However, it's highly disingenuous of you to say " a certain calibre of men would find her a threat", that's a classic fudge from feminists, and not worth the energy it took to type it.
Dismissing contrary opinions in that manner is not conducive to good communication or debate, and it demeans you as much as you might wish to demean men

G'dayBruce, I think your reply to Foxy is not conducive to good communication or debate, and it demeans you. The fact is that many people would find Wong a threat, and the last time I looked 'men' were considered to be people.

yep trashing the budget is more important to Ms Wong than racism and sexism. She would not want to upset Clive no matter how much of a pig he acts. Oh but that wicked sexist Abbott.

Good Evening Bruce,

I do not demean men or anybody else.
I leave that up to themselves to do.

"...she's a party hack, a dirty infighter, without heart,
morals or ideology, good at acquiring power... as useful
as an ashtray on a motor bike..." and more.

This was from your opening post in this discussion.

No need for any further comment. Your post speaks for itself
completely.

Yes it does, and nowhere therein do I mention her gender, race, appearance or anything else beyond her political type and abilities.
My denigration of her, happily admitted, could as easily be applied to any of her male counterparts, it's gender-neutral.
Also as I said, she's a part of a system, one she's excelled at utilising but one that seriously needs changing, wouldn't you agree?
Or are you content having all those self-serving corrupt ideologues ruling your life without let or hindrance?

"I denigrated her for being exactly what she is, a highly successful part of a decayed and rotten to the core Party political system."

Jolly good, G'dayBruce.

When can we expect your denigration of Warren Truss on the same grounds?

He was present for Clive's big night too...

Or did you just happen to note that this thread was set up ostensibly to slam Wong - and decided you'd pop in for a bit to protest the "Party political system" by bopping her one?

The OP quite rightly criticised the double standard and hypocrisy of a career politician who knows how to ride the victim bandwagon when it suits her, which is 99% of the time, but whose principles and 'commitment' are flexible enough to look the other way when it suits her as well.

As a disappointing Finance Minister in the discredited Julia Whatshername's Labor/Greens government Wong proved she had very few claims to a leadership role. Wong is a talker, but it is all the same old, same spin. Her forte is is acting horrified, put-out and self-righteous, wielding the big stick of politically correctness.

It is a particular time and political environment that has spawned so many political opportunists like Wong, but fortunately the electorate is onto her and others.

By rights, Wong should be paying subs to Actors' Equity.

Well Poirot, since the opening post was specifically about Wong I was offering my opinion thereon, as seemed appropriate.
As I said, my observations were unisexual, applicable to all successful Party pollies, unless you expect me to list every local, state and federal member and print and reprint it endlessly?
My opinion was formed whilst the alleged lady was in Gov', long ago now, and she has consistently stayed true to form, so why should I feel any different now she's in Opposition?
Or does the fact that there are many more just like her, of both genders, mean that it is somehow permissible for she and they to be the nasty fakes they are?
Or mayhap one is NOT allowed to besmirch a "lady" political actor, because of her gender?
How sexist is THAT?
Would dear Penny agree with you?
She probably would actually, she plays fast and loose with her supposed principles already, doesn't she?

G'dayBruce,

Gee, you come over as a bright articulate person.

So let's call a spade a spade.

"My denigration of her, happily admitted, could as easily be applied to any of her male counterparts, it's gender-neutral."

"I denigrated her for being exactly what she is, a highly successful part of a decayed and rotten to the core Party political system."

Like I said, Warren Truss was part of the action that night....why not have a go at him as well. After all, he's part of the Party political system" you claim to be slamming.

You say:

"Well Poirot, since the opening post was specifically about Wong I was offering my opinion thereon, as seemed appropriate."

The opening post was "specifically" derisive of Wong for not intervening to defend her "people of origin".

You posted - "Dear Miss Wong was perfectly correct to not react overtly to the big oaf, politically, and, as I said, she's a consummate politician."

So, what you're saying, it seems, is that you saw a thread about Penny and thought it was an appropriate opportunity to slam her - even though you disagree with opening statement."

Okay.....

I actually don't have too many personality issues with any of them but seeing that it is impossible to get comensated for the financial & social losses we incurred courtesy of Labor, the least we could expect from them is an apology for the mess they made of our lives.
If Penny could perhaps stand up & clearly say "I'm sorry on behalf of all labor Politicians for what we inflicted upon Australians" then she could gain some credibility. The way it stands , well we'll just have to hope that the present outfit can pull us out of the mess, massive opposition to sense from the Left notwithstanding.

Absolutely Poirot, dear old 'Underfuhrer' Beach sits there in his snappy black uniform banging away at his keyboard, delivering a stream of insincere clap tray about "non whites, progressives, anyone considered left wing, and minority's in society, all awhile claiming to be some even handed and virtually non political. If he was fair dinkum on this he would be delivering a serve to Warren Truss the deputy PM who was also on the panel and said nothing. Did any of the 'Usual Suspects' actually watch the program, if they did they could be court marshaled next time they visit the bunker! Watching Q$A is deemed treasonous and defeatist by the Fuhrer.

Actually Po, if you stop and think you'll realise I wasn't disagreeing with the OP at all, it was deriding her and I did too, ergo sum.
Since she and Truss were not alone up front what was I supposed to do, critique each and every one? The audience too? The tweets also?
I said she was right to not react overtly to the big oaf, POLITICALLY, as in, it was good politics for her, a ploy, a mechanism, call it what you will, and indicative of the malaise infecting all our Parliaments.
If you'd like my opinion on Truss, start a thread about him, or any other pollie you care to name. Still, bar a very few, my opinion would be much of a muchness anyway, but since this is about that particular "person" I don't see what you're point is?
Perchance you object to ANYONE knocking her, at all?
Individual:
Why do you keep banging the Canetoad's phony drum?
All Australia knows full well that that is a load of.., so why don't you just move on to serious, real, problems, like the crime-wave we will all face if the Canetoad gets his way with the budget, or the deaths that will follow from the same cause, or the absolutely ludicrous mash-up he and Bishop are making of Foreign Affairs?

Why do you keep banging the Canetoad's phony drum?
G'day Bruce,
perhaps your definition of banging a drum is different to mine. What I am saying is that I hope like mad that despite all the negativity flung at the present Government, they will be able to make good at least some of the massive & unacceptable stuff-ups by Labor governments over the decades since that big Goaf. If you you think that Labor don't do massive stuff-ups then you're the the one with the drum banging problem. The Coalition thus far have been pretty disappointing but considering the idiotic opposition they are battling against one can understand the under-performance.

Well Individual, I see we can agree about something anyway, the truly appalling nature of the Opposition, al la Labor, they're only exceeded in their ineptitude and idiocy by the Liberals.
However, that being said, they too are a part of our overall problem, which brings us right back to Miss Wong and her success at being one of them.
Yes, Labor pulled some stunts, good and bad, but the Libs are just as bad, they just play different games is all. At least when Labor blows the dough it gets spread all over the place, but with the Libs it ends up in their mates overseas bank accounts as a rule, so guess which I prefer?
The Canetoad could easily save us all a few quid just by opting out of that ridiculous Fkup35 floppy-fighter deal among others, that alone would save more than his current plans to ream the defenceless amongst us

G'day Bruce,
I maintain that we can't afford another Labor Government for some time however, as you state the Liberals aren't performing either because of the mess they inherited & a lack of care.
All up though it is Labor that got us here. Had Labor not been so abysmally incompetent we would not have this under performing Liberal Government either.
The public service is a Labor machine & is the single most importantant factor in the decline of our political & economic system. The public service is too large, too costly, too incompetent, too selfish, too unethical & lacks integrity. All because of lack of discipline. A non-military national service would re-build this discipline but do Australians want discipline is the big question. My guess is they do they just want everyone else to exercise it it.
I'm convinced it'll still happen in my time when there'll be ads on chinese TV for Australian Mothers for sale !

"....Had Labor not been so abysmally incompetent we would not have this under performing Liberal Government either...."

Lol!

....and the fact the present regime are a lying bunch of incompetents who don't know their arse from their elbow.

Poirot,
Yes & Labor are far worse !

One of the Canetoad's now major problems is that the general public is getting really tired of the endless blaming of Labor. It may have assisted to some degree in helping Labor lose the election but is now well past it's use-by date. Remember, Oppositions DO NOT win elections, Governments LOSE them, an old political truth. It's almost as if the Liberals have got so used to the habit that they are unable to accept that THEY are now the government, they don't need to keep fighting that election any more.
Quick little slogans, whinges and brain-farts may be acceptable from an Opposition, maybe, but they're NOT from a government, we need real actions that advantage ALL Australians, something the Canetoad and his cronies have singularly failed at delivering.
As for the PS, blaming Labor for them is ludicrous, they have existed and been a difficulty for one and all from long before the Labor Party was even formed. Remember those Yes Minister/Prime Minister TV shows? Classic depictions of the genre, and dating from Fraser's time in government but we wouldn't blame him for the PS would we, so why blame labor?
It would appear that the Liberals and their supporters are locked into blaming, everyone and anyone else but themselves, no matter what the discussion and it's as ridiculous and self-demeaning as it is when little kids do it. We train our children not to do it and to accept responsibility for themselves, so who will train the Canetoad and his clumsy, convoluted and chronically cruddish cronies?

Liberals and their supporters are locked into blaming, everyone and anyone else but themselves
G'day Bruce,
No matter how much the supporters of incompetence try to shift the blame, they can not escape the fact that the blame does indeed lie with Labor. The liberals will be locked into this blaming until such time that they can unlock themselves from that dreadful Labor legacy, which is a broke Australia.

".... they can not escape the fact that the blame does indeed lie with Labor. The liberals will be locked into this blaming until such time that...[insert the excuse du jour]"

Dear Poirot,

Isn't that a convenient tactic - and of
course the other Liberal tactic is continuing
to appoint Commissions of Audit - and spending
even more money in doing so. Makes perfect
sense in these supposed "difficult"
financial times doesn't it - then it becomes
easier to explain their horror budgets.
"Not our fault - they did it!"

Thank you Poirot and Foxy! You've made my Sunday morning. Mikk said it beautifully.

Why is it not possible for the conservative wannabee rich people to be surprised by Helen Ridout's comments? Sounds like the thinking, articulate conservatives ( the Liberal hero Howard comes to mind to as well) are also very dismayed by this odd government.

Individual, you are very funny with your suspicion of educated and rich people. Have you actually looked at the makeup of the present Liberal government? All had free tertiary education. All are wealthy, some have tax payers help pay of multi-million dollar investment houses http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/taxpayers-footing-bill-on-treasurer-joe-hockeys-15-million-canberra-house/story-fni0cx12-1227026624945. I sourced a non-left wing paper report for you and Julie Bishop's law firm Clayton Utz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julie_Bishop) defended Hardie's when they where being sued for compo from Asbestos sufferers, who were all left to rot.

This government is not so much 'conservative', just completely removed from normal daily life. Of all Australians and their families. Even thinking hard-working 'rich' ones who do not need government aid, like ourselves.

Dear Yvonne,

Well said - and spot on.

I've just re-read Peter Costello's book,
"The Costello Memomoirs," and goodness
me - you certainly are right about this
odd bunch that we have in government
currently. They are not true conservatives
or Liberals - not in the calibre of either
Costello or Sir Robert Menzies. These ratbags
have been bought and paid for. It's all about
money and power. It's the ideology of greed
which leaves no room for social equity, compassion,
or the idea of an egalitarian society.

Australians need to take a stand at the next election.

Indy, you are a classic modern Liberal, addicted to blaming Labor.
The Canetoad was handed an Australian economy that was the envy of the OECD, if not the world, the "problems" were an electoral furphy invented by him and rejected by bankers and economists world-wide.
Considering that amongst his first actions were to dump millions into political witch-hunts, which coincidentally are now blowing up in his face, lol, and to raise the debt-limit by billions, and a slew of other spending excesses, where was his economic restraint then?
Honestly, The Canetoad and his supporters, like you, remind me of nothing so much as schoolyard bullies, whinging and whining.."It's not MY fault, HE did it first" when called to account, and busily harassing and hounding the defenceless whenever and where-ever they can, and blaming the victims yet again.
That is unacceptable behaviour from children and is just as ugly and nauseating when followed by those who are supposed to be adults, let alone leaders of our nation!

G'day Bruce,
Fyi, I'm a Nationals supporter, I have no time for the Liberals. My old man was Labor & even as teenager I could see through the academic Labor smoke sreen.

handed an Australian economy that was the envy of the OECD.. Furphy !

"It's not MY fault, HE did it first" when called to account..furphy.

and busily harassing and hounding the defenceless ... another furphy.
Defenceless ? Come on. With all the meadia on their side ? Get a little real.

You cannot escape the fact that Labor all but ruined Australia no matter how you want to put it. The Linerals aren't exactly doing a great job but then the best Captain can't run a ship with a crew as bad as the australian public service & the Labor voting hangers-on.
They are the real mongrels. Unless of course it wasn't them who turned a great surplus into a huge debt. It was a labor outfit that took my job, it's a labor cronie who wants me to lose my job again now. It's labor cronies who cost me dearly over the years . In a word in my experience Labor doesn't stink, it's utterly putrid !

indi,

"handed an Australian economy that was the envy of the OECD.. Furphy !"

Er.... http://www.abc.net.au/news/linkableblob/3727694/data/possum-graph-8-government-debt-as-gdp-data.jpg

Er.... http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/jul/09/australia-american-path-to-inequality

"The Australian model has performed far better. Indeed, Australia is one of the few commodity-based economies that has not suffered from the natural resource curse. Prosperity has been relatively widely shared. Median household income has grown at an average annual rate above 3% in the last decades – almost twice the OECD average."

But don't take any notice of Nobel Laureate, Stiglitz....after all, he's 'educated".

Yer economically dumb, indi

G'dayBruce...I'm quite enjoying your commentary : )

The oft-quoted surplus was a direct result of the Howard Gov' NOT doing it's job, it ignored infrastructure needs, both present and future, handed out tax relief like it was going out of style and set the agenda for this rag-tag bunch of losers attacks on the poor and middle classes. Huge debt? In real world terms our debt was way below the average and completely within our ability to cope with, until the Canetoad got his hands on it anyway.
It's amusing that you claim not to be a Liberal because you support the Nat's, as if there's any difference. Once upon a time there was a modicum of difference but that fell by the wayside long since, now the only reason they stay separated is purely to do with hype and personal power, if they actually had any ideals beyond greed and might-is-right they would be the identical anyway.
As for Labor "ruining" Australia, Oz was far from ruined at the time of the last election, we were leading the economic world, thanks to Labors policies and actions, apart from their immigration policy and they share that with the Lib's completely, only the details on boat arrivals are different.
You happily call Labor voters and the PS "mongrels", ignoring the fact that they are intrinsically AUSTRALIAN VOTERS, citizens of our nation and entitled to their beliefs and associations, and if THAT doesn't clearly demonstrate the Liberal elitist and anti-democratic attitude I don't know what does.
It's always interested me the way so many young reject their parents political mind-set and justify that by claiming to think independently, whereas in fact they are only following the normal human growth pattern, breaking free of their parents as they achieve adulthood, and believing they know better is just a foolish part of that. To me the real shame is that so many then go on to lock themselves into rigid unthinking obedience to another political narrative rather than truly thinking for themselves, just as you appear to have done.

I was told long ago to never argue with a mug, well haven't learnt my lesson but do draw the line at arguing with selfish morons.

Individual, you're a Nationals voter? And have no time for the Liberals? Wow. I have noticed an awful quiet from the Nationals during this budget debacle. You know why?

I live in a country area in a very small town. A long way from the city. This budget is going to hurt the small minority of Australians who live outside the cities very much. What city people take for granted, a choice of good education, access to good medical care, good roads and some form of transport other than the family car to get to the city is lacking now. It will only get worse.

Bruce hit the nail on the head re the budget surplus from Howard. Howard sat on his ass during an economic boom. It had nothing to do with policies. He did nothing. Absolutely nothing. Except get rid of any Liberal who was not prepared to brown nose him. Hence, we are left with a group of intellectual arrogant midgets. Bishop and Turnbull are the only Liberals who seem capable to communicate past 2 or 3 word slogans. And Turnbull is being side-lined.

And before you go on your ridiculous anti-Left rhetoric, I voted for Howard until I saw what he was doing. I was very angry with him, still am. This country lost a lot. He used fear based and divisive politics to stay in power. Sadly, the other major party, the ALP has followed suit.

Dear Yvonne,

Amazing.

You mirror my thoughts exactly!

the ALP has followed suit.
yvonne,
wrong phrasiology, they fell ar$e over backwards to out-do them & that's the only plocy they ever excelled in.
I never said the Conservatives are brilliant,but what I maintain is that they're not as bad as Labor even if they tried. That's the whole gist of my argument.

You mirror my thoughts exactly!
Foxy,
Bull ! You'd never get yourself to vote against the Left, stop trying to fool us, we're not Labor voters.

haha!...individual,

"I was told long ago to never argue with a mug,..."

Upon reading the first part of your sentence, I was already composing my congratulations to G'dayBruce for escaping your favourite epithet.....

However, it was not to be....

As you turned the corner and headed for the straight, still not a "moron" in sight...right up to the finishing post, in fact...and then right at the last minute....

"....well haven't learnt my lesson but do draw the line at arguing with selfish morons."

Oh well...

Quite so, yvonne...and keeping in mind that just under half of the debt bequeathed to the Howard Govt was left over from the Frazer era - when Howard was Treasurer.

(I must say, it's rather uplifting to have another intelligent woman contributing regularly to OLO...we've suffered a dearth these past few years...Welcome!)

Dear Individual,

Actually, I have voted for the Liberals in the past
and come from a Liberal-voting family.
I also have voted Liberal in the state elections.

You should not make assumptions about people
you don't really know. Otherwise we just may have to
use your favourite descriptive word -
on you.

Foxy has got you there, individual. Foxy disputes that "If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it is a duck".

She is correct of course. It is no duck. It is a Fox pretending to be a duck.

All up though, I'm enjoying this forum, even with the diversity of opinions there's precious little of the personal abuse that wrecks so many others, thank you all.
Agreeing to disagree and still being able to conduct an intelligent discussion is the mark of a civilised and rational mind, and there appears to be a majority thereof herein, this very moon-cycle I shall sacrifice a gilded choko to the Great Wombat in gratitude!

You should not make assumptions about people
you don't really know.
Foxy,
Don't delude yourself, you're as transparent as a freshly cleaned aquarium.

"The wombat lives across the seas,
Among the far Antipodes.
He may exist on nuts and berries,
Or then again, on missionaries.
His distant habitat precludes,
Conclusive knowledge of his moods.
But I would not engage this wombat
In any form of mortal combat."
-Ogden Nash-

Dear Individual,

How can you tell - your glasses are dirty.
And you can't see anything through them.

Now now little ones, don't spoil it for me.
Remember what our Grannies used to say..."Little birds in their nest must agree"? (to disagree?)

Dear Bruce,

My gran used to say -

"You can't demand the same from a sparrow
as from an eagle."

The Country Party (Nationals) is a strange breed, at one time it was very much a socialists party in many respects, but serving a very narrow sectional interest. Although embracing conservatism on most social and moral issues it was prone to voice economic socialism when it perceived it was to the advantage of its constituency, that is "the man on the land".
In NSW The Greens have been running a strong anti coal seam gas campaign with the most radical supporters often being people who in other respects are very conservative and vote National. When their interest are threatened some become very radical.

Dear Foxxy, my saintly Nan, a tough old farm girl with a heart full of solid-gold love, also used to say:
"You can best judge a person by the smiles they leave in their wake",
and that always struck me as very accurate indeed.
Eagles and sparrows each have their niche, but they're both still feathered flying creatures and equally deserving to be taken seriously.
Within the context of this forum (nest) that means belittling either for being different is counter-productive to good communication, wouldn't you agree?

Dear Bruce,

You're preaching to the converted.

Try addressing your post to Individual.

He's the one who needs to know about your
wonderful golden-hearted Gran - and heed
your advice - given so generously and freely.

Good Luck with that - we've been trying to reach him
for years on this forum. But his favourite descriptive
words are "moron," and "idiot" and that makes things
a bit difficult as you'll find out for yourself.

Paul you miss the important point, in fact the only one.

It is just as well the idiot inner city chattering class, are so incompetent, or their efforts to destroy farming & mining would be like committing suicide.

In earlier times, without the farmer, & today add the miner, there is no reason for any of the cities & their population to exist.

In fact there is no possibility for cities & their population to exist without some productive people to supply the food & pay for the imports that the rest of the country depend on for their existence.

So what is good for the farmer, [& miner], is essential for people like you to exist. If ever you do succeed in making mining & farming economically impossible in Oz, it will be you & your mates doing that impersonation of the wahoo bird.

Do be careful, it's dark in there.

Hasbeen,

Which, of course, gives the perfect opportunity to quote Donald Horne's sentiments from "The Lucky Country".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_Country

"Australia is a lucky country, run by second-rate people who share its luck."

"Horne's statement was an indictment of 1960s Australia. His intent was to comment that, while other industrialized nations created wealth using "clever" means such as technology and other innovations, Australia did not. Rather, Australia's economic prosperity was largely derived from its rich natural resources. Horne observed that Australia "showed less enterprise than almost any other prosperous industrial society."

Not much has changed.....

Donald Horne went to his grave regretting the use of those words that were always misunderstood and misrepresented by hack journalist and lazy politician alike.

He was not the first to criticise the cultural cringe that permeated society and limited success for locals with talent and merit, Australian business included.

He was arguing against complacency, not for it. There are many who have either deliberately or stupidly misunderstood. Not many people and rarely journalists actually read books though. They skim for bits that suit their own pre-existing opinions.

The cultural cringe remains as strong as ever in some quarters. Tall poppies too are soon lopped.

otb,

Precisely!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_Country

"The Lucky Country" is a nickname for Australia,[1] taken from the 1964 book of the same name by social critic Donald Horne. It is generally used favorably, although the origin of the phrase was negative. Among other things, it has been used in reference to Australia's natural resources, weather, history, distance from problems elsewhere in the world, and other sorts of prosperity."

half of the debt bequeathed to the Howard Govt was left over from the Frazer era - when Howard was Treasurer.
Poirot,
And what did Howard do once he began to get control over the Whitlam debts that plagued Fraser ? Well, I tell you what Howard's Government did, it created a futures fund (now gone) & also a healthy economy (now gone).
I think the Rudd/Gillard stuff-ups will take even longer to overcome.
The really sad part is that these two cookoos couldn't have had a chance in the world to almost ruin Australia if it weren't for their supporting morons at the polling booths.

Dear Individual,

Your ignorance is becoming alarming
because it's so damn consistent.

Foxy,
Ok, what's the ignorant bit in my last post ? can you point it out please & why ?

Palmer's rant was his typical response to avoiding difficult questions about himself.

The original question was about how he financed his Party's election campaign but it suddenly became about something else.

Palmer was a member of Joh's "white shoe brigade" and got his start from insider information about property rezoning and had been financing the LNP until only recently, when he fell out because he couldn't get what he wanted.

His qualifications to be a political leader are extremely exaggerated and depend on media coverage which he is eager to maintain in any way he can.

Add this comment to ones like Murdoch's ex-wife being a Chinese spy plus the Greens/CIA conspiracy theories he was throwing around a while ago and it's easy to see him for the short-term phony he really is.

He's as honest and competent as Abbott and will go the same way - probably sooner than he expects. The "love affair" with Hansonism didn't last as long as many expected either.