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The Forum > General Discussion > The New Age of Moral Capitalism

The New Age of Moral Capitalism

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Divergence I too like your post, and have always been from the left.
Just a smidgen that is, now.
I like the Australia we live in, its directions and care for those who can not care for them selves.
And yes America has its issues religion and some extremely bad Capitalism.
But without it?.
Ideal world, Capitalism, is not achievable, not yet.
Dreams that allow bad mouthing the country that fought 2 wars, along with Russia's victory in Europe, then rebuilt at its cost Europe twice is blind.
Some countrys entwine them selves in beliefs that prohibit growth and change progress and education.
The true left think in terms of a better world but in truth see only one sides problem.
The first heads to roll if the west falls will be the very lefts.
Posted by Belly, Sunday, 22 January 2012 4:08:43 PM
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An example of 'Unfettered Capitalism' at work. The place King Leopold's II Belgium Congo from 1885 to 1908.
King Leopold had the famous African explorer Henry Morton Stanley secure land for him through land rights treaties which were to be “ brief as possible and must grant everything to Belgium”, Stanley secured 450 such agreements. King Leopold had a new country 76 times the size of his own. Leopold claimed he was going to “ civilize and uplift these indolent and corrupt peoples”. By 1884 Leopold had gained recognition for his new state of the Congo, he then quickly developed a military dictatorship in his new possession, forming the ‘Force Publique’.
What was abundant in the Congo was wild natural rubber, to which world demand was now escalating at a rapid pace. The native people had to be made compliant labour to gather this new commodity wild rubber. In Leopold’s Congo it was an offense to pay any African with money.
One method to get the natives to be part of this free market was to seize village women, keep them as hostages until the men brought in the required amount of rubber, which since monetary payment was outlawed for natives, payment for the rubber was in the form of a couple of goats or some such token.
Private companies operated in the Congo, joint ventures ensued between Belgian, British and Dutch firms. These businesses used prison stockades to keep hostages. If the men of the village resisted the demands for rubber it meant the death of their wife, child or chief. The ‘Force Publique’ supplied military might under contract and each company had its own mercenaries. Profit were huge, for example The Anglo-Belgian India Rubber and Exploration Company was able in one year to return a profit of 700% on investment. Between 1885 and 1908, there were between five and eight million native deaths as a direct result of Leopold's capitalist state of the Belgian Congo.
Of cause this all happened in the dim distant past private companies don't operate like that today, lets talk about West Papua, no.
Posted by Paul1405, Sunday, 22 January 2012 4:14:26 PM
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Paul,

Unfortunately, the concepts of exploiting other people and killing other people to take their resources were invented long before anyone ever heard of capitalism. See any archaeology textbook. King Leopold was one of the great mass murderers of the 20th century, but he was well behind Chairman Mao and Joseph Stalin, who weren't motivated by capitalist greed.

Bad behaviour in poor countries by corporations that have their headquarters or operate in Australia should be treated in much the same way that we treat child sex tourism by Australians, but you need to remember that Papua New Guinea, etc. are independent countries, unlike the Belgian Congo under King Leopold. The corporations are only able to exploit the local people if the local elites are willing to betray them.

Folk on the Left obsess about the guilt of the West but never mention the bad choices of the poor people or the guilt of their elites. This is because many of them see the poor people and their leaders as childlike little brown brothers, not as fellow adults who have made some bad choices. After all, no one expects a child to reliably plan for the future, forego a present reward for some greater future benefit, or consider the rights or welfare of anyone but himself.
Posted by Divergence, Tuesday, 24 January 2012 10:02:14 AM
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Divergence, The present situation in West Papua holds striking similarities to the Congo of 1900. Foreign power Indonesia, military dictatorship, a valuable commodity copper, very profitable private corporations with private militia, 100,000 indigenous deaths in the last 50 years. Total exploitation of the local people. Recognition by foreign powers of Indonesians sovereignty over West Papua, only the time and location have changed.
Given the right conditions pure capitalism will always lead to total exploitation. The capitalist will never grant benefits to those he exploits, other than those benefits needed to maintain the exploited at a suitable level to maximize profits, unless forced to do so.
Posted by Paul1405, Tuesday, 24 January 2012 10:53:38 AM
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Paul,

You are obviously right about what is going on in West Papua, but you haven't established that the Indonesians are behaving badly because they are capitalists or in league with capitalists, or because they are people and they can. Would they necessarily be behaving any better if Indonesia was a feudal society (think of the Crusaders in Palestine) or a Communist state (think of the Chinese in Tibet)?
Posted by Divergence, Wednesday, 25 January 2012 1:26:24 PM
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Does anyone honestly think that the capitalist has a moral conscience? Given the right conditions the capitalist will exploit to maximize profits, the bottom line is all that is important. Why do very profitable banks in Australia exploit people in the third world, purely to maximize profits. How do multinationals act when given a free hand to operate in the poorest of countries, they do what they can to maximize profits.
On a small scale the Howard government introduced legislation to increase the capitalist power to exploit and many took advantage of work choices laws to do just that. as far as capitalists are concerned there is no 'new age of enlightenment' there is only the power of those they exploit that prevents total exploitation.
Posted by Paul1405, Wednesday, 25 January 2012 6:40:30 PM
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