Dear Belly,

You are right.

For millenia, people have hoped for peace in their
time. Today, as usual, there is no shortage of
grand proposals for peace - such as new defensive
devices, or the acceptance of one religion or
another, or the establishment of a world government,
or even the reform of so-called human nature.

Yet arms races and wars continue as before, sometimes
creating the discouraging idea that hopes for peace
are too "idealistic." And indeed, we are likely to
be disappointed if we expect dramatic results in
the form of an immediate end to war and militarism.

The prospects for peace look much more encouraging,
however, once we recognize that war and peace are
really opposite ends of a continuum and that
movement along this continuum, in either direction, is
the result of social processes that develop and change
over time under the influence of government policies
and popular pressures.

Sorry David Lewis but you’re not facing reality.

A REALITY CHECK FROM THE ASIA TIMES:

>>Afghanistan's economy could face a sharp shock after international troops withdraw in 2014, removing the one factor that provided investors and businesses with a measure of confidence…

…Afghanistan still lacks a stable economic infrastructure and suffers from massive institutional corruption, which means that much of the tens of billions of US dollars that have flowed into the country has been squandered.

[…]

HAKJO SAYS 60% OF AFGHANISTAN'S GROSS DOMESTIC PRODUCT (GDP) IS IN SOME WAY LINKED TO THE FOREIGN TROOP PRESENCE.>>

(Capitalisation added)

See:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/MH25Df04.html

Afghanistan is a basket case being propped up by a massive and unsustainable Western military presence.

Afghanistan is also a victim of the battle between India and Pakistan.

See:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/09/23/eveningnews/main20110965.shtml


(Watch the video)

>>The Pakistani spy agency uses the Haqqanis to sow violence so Afghanistan cannot emerge as a strong and stable country allied with Pakistan's arch enemy India.>>

Australia should high tail it out of Afghanistan as soon as we can. Afghanistan is a tragedy but there’s nothing we can do about it. In the end it is none of our business.

And we definitely should not be sacrificing the lives of Australian soldiers in a HOPELESS cause.

And the Canadians should also leave - for the same reason.

It is not within the power of any Western country, or alliance of Western countries, to avert or even ameliorate the tragedy that is Afghanistan.

That is reality.

Steven I have come to see you are right.
From a warrior class, unafraid to admit it, I believe we do great things there.
That one day true full war will be our only way there.
But the thing that is PAKISTAN, its hate lies and deception is going to one day take much more than ground troops to fix.
Lexi how very sad, humanity divided by? differences, a early need to defend its self from,, them, has sunken in.
I do honestly think, our inability to control world population, starvation,financial matters, wars, is driving us to, like it or not be ruled as one.
By the passing of 2 or 3 generations we will forget the things that divide us.

Belly,

Just to be clear.

I am not a pacifist. There are things worth fighting for.

My admiration for our troops in Afghanistan is boundless.

If I had a child who had died in Afghanistan I would hate it if some “know it all” told me it was all for nothing.

Which I’m afraid is exactly what I am saying.

But it is what it is.

There is nothing useful we can do in Afghanistan. 29 diggers have already died. Many more have been wounded. It is not reasonable of us to ask brave young men and women to risk their lives for no good reason.

Afghanistan was a s*it hole before Australian troops arrived and it will be s*hit hole long after we’re gone and there’s nothing we can do about it.

Dear Steven,

I'm not sure that I agree with your summation.
As David points out - perhaps things are not
happening as quickly in Afghanistan as we in the
West would like - and the costs in human lives
are huge. However, improvements are happening.
Should we keep pursuing them or simply
leave the Afghans to their own devices?
I don't know the answer to that question.
Can we really turn
our backs on them now - and tell all those who
died that it was all for nothing?

Not sure I could do that.

I again thank David, understand things are better.
And I honor our dead.
Steven is not far wrong.
Every step we take forward Pakistan's action force us to retreat.
A war will come open hot and total.
No matter what our actions.
Free loading members of the world community, ever willing to hold hands out for a handout are not helping ,they should.
While a war, against militant Islam is inevitable, we would be better fighting in the country bringing this pain Pakistan.