Julia Gillard used the cost of rebuilding in Queensland as pretext to dump some of the more ridiculous Labor policies especially relating to emissions reduction.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/greens-votes-on-flood-levy-cost-labor-364m/story-fn59niix-1226007855010

To get the greens' support she has had to put back nearly $400m back on the table. In July the greens will have the deciding vote on all legislation, and one can only expect the demands to get sillier.

With friends like the greens who needs enemies?

In the name of honest debate,I leave you to your self Shadow Minister, not retreat, just no need to rebut you.

"I leave you to your self Shadow Minister"

No you don't.

Within minutes of me posting, you retort with an inane burble with no substance on the issue whatsoever.

I know that you are so fiercely protective of your beloved ALP that you feel the need to put up at least a token response. However, the issue is that the greens support is not conditional, and nearly 25% of the flood tax is now going to silly projects that should by any rights be scrapped.

If you think that this has not been noticed by the wider public you are seriously mistaken.

Fair suck of the sav, Shadow Minister.

>>Within minutes of me posting, you retort with an inane burble with no substance on the issue whatsoever.<<

What issue?

You take up space to deliver your standard anti-Gillard puff piece - nothing new to say, no vestige of interest or controversy - and then mouth off at Belly for calling you on it?

You didn't even pose a question that we could debate. Just made a few cheap points that even the daily papers make more cogently and constructively.

At least the media makes some attempt to understand the politics that are in play at the moment. It isn't pretty, to be sure. But mud-slinging for the sake of slinging mud is simply mindless, and pointless.

Pericles,

Short of spelling it out in small words, the first issue is that if even for small bills which the greens inherently support, they are going to ask for such a huge price so as to make the original flood tax almost worthless, what are they going to demand after July when they have an veto over all bills.

The second issue, is that if the greens are supposedly partners, they certainly act mostly in their own interest, and are quite happy to leave Labor to twist in the wind.

The Flood tax although raising $1.8bn effectively only puts $1.4bn on the table for reconstruction.

Well it is a minority government Shadow Minister. Do you really think the Coalition would govern any differently as a minority? Concessions have to be made in that situation, that is the beauty of democracy - any opportunities for greater consultation should be applauded not diminished.

I seem to remember John Howard making some rather large concessions and financial promises to the Australian Democrats and Harradine to bring in the GST.

Memories are short.

its clear the greens have a winner with global warning
so you ask what is in the 'pipeline'

well more for solar/wind and gas generation
but lets forgo the wind ..that only makes power when the wind blows

and focus on the gas
did you see last nights expose on 4 corners
re the troubles with gas...[expected to be 40,000 LEAKEY gas well's linked into a pipeline...

that our increased electicity charges
are paying to build ..for santos and others

but lets get back to the leaks
they are leaking methane..
[a greenhouse gas 145 times worse than co2]

according to 4 corners expose last night..the 'leaks' are methane
so the socalled cure for global warming is more leakey gas wells

thats where green thinking gets you
[and expect more of it]

like solar...needs industry to build them
more industry more carbon

but it gets worse with this green blindness
solar only works when the sun shines
meaning at night we still need backup power..ie coal

so green thinking gives nio solutions
yet its cost is costing us consumers the earth
building two systems..where we allready built one that does it all

but here is more green thinking
feedin tarrifs..lets pay these solar cell people double[ie 44 cents]
and put thenm on of peak power at night[at 13 cents?]..

that way they get a proffit..and big busness will pick up on the govt gift [subsidy]..to build huge solar cell farms

that get 44 cent's for their day time
[off peak power generation]

now why are solar cells [and green thinking]..costing us the earth?
well they use silver really use silver...that costs 40,000 worth of silver for a few litres...[that makes solar cells cost in production costs 1000? each..thus the need for increased power tosubsidise big business needing the 44 cent fedin tarrif

and even if they go bust
they can reclaim the silver
its win win

just like the greens needed
to get big business to pick up on their green scam

but your lot wont do nothing about it
just as labor does nothing about it

its the 2 party green scam
both parties sell us out

spain went broke playing the green game

*soon the world*

oh and next the green sceme
tax cash/cow of carbon credits
to get yet more cash ..from the poor muggins paying for it all

when we should be attacking the real; green house gasses
like methane..[from greenies home composting]..or like the special fluid NEEDED to clean the solar cells..even worse than methane

notice the wind farms failure rate ..in uk?
since the cold winter..

seems wind power dont like cold..lol

more green folly

and as we are going into a solar minumus..ie cold spell...
aint that green spin keeping you all so warm and fuzzy..at night?

Yes! again OUG is right. The greens are evil and religion is the greater good :) ok then. LOL.

BLUE

Pelican,

The issue is that the greens effectively diverted 20% of the flood tax to their own agenda. When they control the senate, will all future bills have a 20% "green" tax.

I think it will be particularly bad for the right wing sycophants of the Coalition SM. I cant think of anything more positive than that.

Perhaps they will begin to focus on policy instead of their own political ambitions for a change, instead of attempting to generate fear and negative feeling toward anyone in govt whom is not them.

whats up with you blue
your an athiest...[i get it]

but mate...im into god
NOT RELIGEON

all religeons are a scam

[that govt gives them tax egsemptrion alone
reveals..they are PART of the problem]

we both dislike religeons
but you go that one step too far
and deney god...god is good..he dont judge you

neither will i
i wont even judge govt or liars
but like hell ..will i stay silent ..to those decieving gods creation

i can still love them
and expose where they are going badly wrong

solar sells is a scam
bankers are thieves
govt are hookers

yet i still love them

at least they are there doing things[deeds/works]
not just casting the same boring slurs[words]

love ya blue
heck i even love julia
and those greedy greenies

without you lot
what could i do

SM The minority Labor Government should listen to the 1.2 million who voted Green. I don't know how old your are but your side of politics never had a problem using the DLP in the Senate when it suited them. When Howard had control of the Senate we got Work Choices!

Good point paul1405.

Dont forget the coercion of the Democrats to introduce the GST, the mother of all taxes on the people that Howard promised to never introduce.

With solar power feed in you don't have to take the 40 or 60 cent feed in rate. For every kwh you feed in you get 1 kwh off your bill.
If you take the feed in tariff you pay 29 cents / kwh. 21 cents without.

Now from Juliar we have a carbon tax after promising:

"there will be no carbon tax under the government I lead."

It looks as though Bob Brown is the true leader and Juliar and Whine Swan are just puppets.

"there will be no carbon tax under the government I lead."

SM You need to establish if it was a CORE or NON CORE promise have to check with Johnny Howard, he's was the expert on breaking promises. Was not Abbott in favour of a carbon tax and Gillard opposed at one time. Us Greens we are the consistent one's always been in favour of a carbon tax with safe guards for low incomes.
I think Bob Brown should be running the Country.

Paul,

Does Juliar have any core promises? It sounded pretty emphatic at the time. A line drawn in the sand.

The greens have Juliar by the nose, and when Bob Brown says jump she says how high. Notice how petrol is back in the carbon pricing.