Still, get past s.51(ii),(iii)&(xx) used in combination...

My personal problem with mining is fly-in, fly-out, NOTHING stays in the area with the resource, they spend nothing, they buy nothing (and that is just the workers).

The Mining Companies are not local except in very unusual circumstances, the bulk of the money is offshore and the way these things are structured as it is now, bugger all stays in Australia anyway...

The High Court has a LONG history of taking centralization of power, ie. handing power to the Federal Government, and I think this is one of those occasions that will happen.

By the way, given they have agreed on the Commonwealth taking over Health, how do you think the States would rather pay for it? Losing their GST or locking in the miners and letting them pay for it?

That is the choice Canberra will give them, and it is no choice at all

*or is it a charitable thing, a public service from the banks to us.*

Sonofgloin, in fact quite a bit of what banks do, is indeed a public
service. I can assure you that paying staff, rent etc, to hand
over Joe Blogg's dole cheque in notes every fornight, is not a
profitable business!

*A bit of creative accounting there Yabby*

No creative accounting there Sonofgloin, but perhaps just facts that
you overlooked. Sure banking is profitable, as it should be.
People don't deposit their money in banks going broke, they want
safety of their savings.

The fact is however, that banks need tier 1 capital to operate and
guess who our banks turned to, during the GFC, to top up their
tier 1 capital? Shareholders of course, were asked to cough up
tens of billions. Should those shareholders not have a return on
their investments?

I also remind you that when banks get it really wrong, like in the
UK just recently, shareholders lost the lot and the UK Govt took
over many banks.

What return on your savings do you think you should receive, to
risk your life savings? You are free to buy bank shares, like
everyone else, if you think that they earn too much.

So my whole claim is really this. That your claim was wrong and
that given the huge amounts of money involved and the risk,
bank profits are not unreasonable. But what few Aussies actually
understand is that the largest shareholders of banks are in fact
Super Funds, which they too have a share in. So you too Sonofgloin,
would benefit from bank profits, even if you are not aware of it.

Yabby>>I'll tell you something. If you lot tried to stop iron ore exports from WA, you would not have a buckleys chance. The population would revolt against you and tell you to get stuffed, secede if
required. WA would thrive without you.
What would you do? Send your troops to shoot us?<<

Yabby that’s the spirit of Eureka, secede.
I certainly understand your sentiments given the dog’s breakfast management of Labor governments in the other states, not to mention Rudd. There is a growing idiocy in the other states, I can not put my finger on it but it has to do with consecutively voting in incompetent Labor governments. It defies logic, logic is defied.

Yabby, some numbers for you.

Australian Bankers Association 2009>> The profit performance of our major banks is equivalent to earning $1.40 profit return on $100 in assets. If banks earn $6.40 worth of income from the $100 worth of assets, they pay out $5 in expenses before delivering the $1.40 in profit.<<

VS

David Uren, Economics correspondent From: The Australian September 24, 2009
>>AUSTRALIA'S major banks were enjoying record profit margins when they cried poor and lifted mortgage interest rates independently of the Reserve Bank.
Official figures show the profit margin for the major banks was 54.8 per cent in the March quarter, resulting in $1 profit for every $2 in interest and fee income they charged.
The banks' profit margin during the quarter was more than double the long-term average return of 26.9 per cent.

I know which statement is credible, I know which statement reflects reality. The banks are a conduit, of themselves they produce nothing.

And a last example of how poor the banks are.
From: The Daily Telegraph May 06, 2010
>>Westpac has been voted the worst bank for customer satisfaction on the same day it announced bumper profits / AAP Source: AAP
Westpac voted worst bank in survey
Commonwealth Bank comes in second
Almost half of Aussies are crippled by debt
WESTPAC customers have emerged as the unhappiest in Australia as the bank announced a whopping net cash profit of nearly $3 billion in its half yearly results.<<

Cash profit of 3 billion in six months, the spin doctors will have to find more fixed costs to bring their profit down

http://www.westpac.com.au/docs/pdf/aw/ic/fy09-fullyearprofit-asx.pdf

Sonofgloin, the above URl takes you to Westpac's full year's profit
last year, in detail. If you check it out, you will find that
my claim is correct.

*My personal problem with mining is fly-in, fly-out*

Custard, your personal problem simply does not matter, unless you
are a miner, having to make a decision in consultation with your
family. As it happens, many wives insist on living in a capital
city. If more money was spent in some of these regional areas,
perhaps more would live there. That is the point really. These
areas have been screwed of resources, to send you city slickers money.
It is time that royalties flow back to these regions, to improve
services. Just because they don't have your number of votes, does
not mean that they should be treated like dirt.

*the bulk of the money is offshore and the way these things are structured as it is now, bugger all stays in Australia anyway*

Sheesh Custard, you are not the brightest poster on OLO, you
really arn't. I remind you that BHP, the world's largest miner,
is 60% Australian owned, with over a half a million direct
Australian shareholders. Super funds, in which you no doubt have
an interest, take another huge chunk. So money indeed stays here.

*The High Court has a LONG history of taking centralization of power*

The High Court interprets the law, they do not make the law. At no
time in our history, have States handed over their mineral rights
to the Commonwealth. Suck on your lemon, but that is the reality.

*By the way, given they have agreed on the Commonwealth taking over Health,*

Err not Western Australia old son, Barnett told them to get stuffed.
You really are out of touch with everyday politics, Custard.

Perhaps all this will be far easier solved by getting rid of
the present band of Canberra comedians. People have had a gutful.

Custard>>For mine, the assets that are being sold belong to US

This is why we get paid roalties.

>>As to the flow on effect, so be it

Now you're treading on thin ice. Be carfull what you wish for.

>>My personal problem with mining is fly-in, fly-out
Mining companies cause major problems in towns, but, the government can't now shift the goal posts because of this.

Pericles
After all, the stuff that they fail to dig up, for whatever reason, is not going to go anywhere, is it?

There can be a billion$ of minerals that cost 2 billion to mine.

>>The only people who will suffer in the meantime are those folk who rely upon the mining industry for their livelihood

Which is most likely 85% of us, indirectly!

thinker 2,
We receive royalties for the minerals. What I say is that if we want additional profits, we must share the risk. Remember, we are talking 40%. That's huge!

>>Should taxpayers refund BP it's investment's for having such bad luck?
Yes! If tax payers want an additional 40% of the 'super profits', with zero risk investment.

Finally, Imagine a gambler backing his favourite horse at say 3-1.

He lays out $100, it wins and he goes to collect his winnings, $300. How good is that!

Now imagine this scenario;
Of the winnings he gets $6.00 at first, that’s 6% return on investment and, of the remaining $294 he pays 117.60 in tax, (40% super tax) then walks away with the balance being $174.60.

His new winnings become $182.40, instead of the initial $300.

Do you think, he may think, the risk is to high and he may re-think his bet?

Now multiply the dollars by billions and you may see where the miners are comming from.

Mining is about investment v risk v return.