The Forum > General Discussion > The rise of atheism
The rise of atheism
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Posted by Squeers, Tuesday, 2 March 2010 12:16:58 PM
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Blue Cross and Democritus,
You are correct: the parallels I am making are not always obvious , otherwise this discussion would be , like too many on OLO, just over categories and "the obvious". Platos point about the cave is a bit about forms , shadows and what they mean - so am I . All rhetoric is confined by words and form. Some would prefer to still do what the greeks did, but I prefer to speculate and test - Call it leaping. If we are going to talk rationally about questions of purpose ( as Grayling did) and science ( very important ) I think it is also helpful to use the paradigm of modern psychology which basically says "we all have a religion of sorts" . Start another thread if you disagree, but not here ? Denial of this framework confinement doesn't help the case of atheists ----if they want to destroy the framework. While we are still with appearances , Grayling was even tempered on the TV. But below that, the thrust of the conference is clearly threatening doom and gloom - "the end of the enlightenment ". "The enlightenment is under threat. So is reason. So is truth. So is science ". I don't disagree that "some of these things are under threat" but to blame just one congregation is too simple : Like polys we see things going wrong - but beware of too quickly labelling the cause . especially when , in truth you may be part of the congregation. There are other words in my list that i think you will find apply to describe( in part )what happens in such meetings ! A bit of market and plate survey between the back and front rows is always helpful for getting closer to the truth about whose thinking and whose sleeping etc .Whether its all nooding or nodding off and so on I wonder if even being in church maybe just a little too comfortable for some next week? Posted by Hanrahan, Tuesday, 2 March 2010 1:13:45 PM
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There is no such thing as "the rise of atheism".
There is only an increase in the number of people questioning long held beliefs not based on evidence and this has generally been confined to Western democracies (not as high in the US). There have been no reports of growing atheism in the Middle East nor in Asia that I am aware of. The fastest growing religion is Islam according to some reports and some increased interest in Buddhism in the West. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism Posted by pelican, Tuesday, 2 March 2010 1:26:18 PM
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Snake you ask
'As I have asked before on OLO, who do the devout pray to and what for ? I wonder how many people in Haiti prayed to their interventionist god.' Might not of occurred to you that some people have got enough manners and are grateful to their Creator for giving them life, food, clothing, water despite their own unworthiness. Not everyone is a selfish wretch who take take take without gratitude. Maybe many are thankful also that God's mercy has been poured out upon them day after day instead of receiving what they deserve (judgement). You are certainly a good example of God's mercy despite your obvious arrogance. Posted by runner, Tuesday, 2 March 2010 2:49:18 PM
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No, no no, Runner.
You are supposed to turn the other cheek, not descend into sniping and name calling. The people in Haiti may have prayed for intervention Snake... but God works in mysterious ways, as we all know, and instead of not dropping all the buildings He crushed innocent people under them and then he sent some child-looters from the Baptist church to help out in his most-gracious and merciful plan. But never mind.... He's busy organising a tsunami here, a 'quake there, overthrowing demons and witches all over Africa and guiding Kevin Rudd and Tony Abbott on their one-true-path, so He cannot get everything right all the time, surely? Now Haiti is in even worse shape than before, also part of His merciful plan of course, that the Archbishops-of-the-World have demanded the national debt be absolved, so all will be right shortly, and the locals can get back to rebuilding the hocus-pocus emporiums to thank Him for sparing them and taking their 'loved ones' instead...and getting back to their constant tithing duties to pay for the hocus-pocus emporiums and their endless lines of staff. Posted by The Blue Cross, Tuesday, 2 March 2010 3:46:56 PM
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If the two fastest growing world views are atheism and Islam then we can expect World War 3 as both believe it is legitimate to destroy unbelievers of their world view. The USSR tried to enforce atheism and where has it led, more Christian theists than ever. Thousands murdered by the KGB for teaching their children belief in God. The Taliban tried to enforce shari'ah laws upon Afganistani people where has it led to thousands being put to death for violation of the laws. The fact is man's heart is basically evil and neither view deals with the evil heart of mankind.
No world view based on a negative view of others inspires man to higher ideals and a better society, as both self distruct from suspicion. Try a world view that teaches, "Love your enemy, do good those those that hate and despise you." A wholesome society must demonstrate compassion and concern for all persons no matter their beliefs. Posted by Philo, Wednesday, 3 March 2010 7:09:59 AM
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atheism is not a doctrine and it has no creed. It need not even have a political voice. It might keep quiet and not disclose itself. We don't generally shout our other personal feelings from soap boxes--unless they're denied or repressed!
Atheism has to speak up in a society that continues to foist theism, both tacitly and ex-cathedra--also via television advertising, button-holing the media, seducing children and other innocents, door to door, mail box delivery and accosting rabidly from street corners!
Atheists have no pact with the devil (to them he's another silly fiction) and no dark existential theology--they prefer the light. They are just as capable of experiencing and appreciating wonder, beauty, love, compassion, good will towards others etc. Indeed more so! But you can add a few more things to the archetypal atheist's list of virtues: humility (jovial acceptance of mortality and an insignificant place in the universe), Equality (no one is saved), reason, love of learning, and experiencing life without cringing before a vengeful God--that is, primitive superstition.
Again, love of "LEARNING" and "EXPERIENCING LIFE"; as opposed to getting it secondhand.
Atheists question the unreasonable, traditional and all too often primitive, prejudiced and pietistic, constructions forced, or imposed by stealth, upon THEIR experience! The archetypal atheist uses his brain, his senses and his experience of the world FOR HIM/HERSELF. The atheist tastes life to the full, accross the whole range of the palate! Whereas the (dogmatic) theist tastes only old parchment and dreams of the next world.
If light prevailed over darkness, freedom over psychological tyranny, in this world, the atheist would keep to himself.