Mandatory service a subject that has come up a number of times over the years pushed by governments and countries alike and yes since the last world wars there will never be any compulsory war lotteries for the general public ever again.

Generation Y, my generation are considered a crosslink between the older generations and younger alike. We as a generation are very mindset with broader views on life in general.
As a generation; look at life in somewhat a more modern prospective in ways of how we dress, how we conduct our self’s in the public eye, with modern ideals on how our future will be set out in relation to laws & human rights.

We look at our self’s as the more adventurist generation; fast learning, equipped with modern technology with a keen focus on what we want our future to be sculptured like.

Clearly we can see a lacking in mental growth structure consisting of leadership skills and focus in the ways of career direction making.
The fact that younger generations are more and more housebound, less adventurist in the ways of exploring the great outdoors due to game consoles, online chat and mobile text msging. Generation x and below need an introduced setting at a point in their lives to counteract such things and inturn strengthen their focus on what’s important for their future.

Introducing mandatory service at the age of 18 to 19 for one year of service within any of our countries military forces would help structure the minds and aims of our younger generations in an aim to not only speed up career choice decision making, but also sculpture mindset discipline required for maturity and leadership decisions, as well as helping younger generations to aim for realistic short and long term goals.

The benefits to our country are the boosting of our armed force numbers, an increase in attendance relating to jobs, increase in creation of industry jobs, increase of part-time & full time military servicemen, further education applications such as universities, tafe colleges, training facilities and a more structured profitable economy.

OK, I'm sold on 'Gen Y' I'll take a kilo to try.
How do we cook them they sound a little green to me?

Great stuff examinator! ROFL!
I think self praise is no recommendation.
my grand fathers thought they knew it all.
maybe we will one day see one generation that does.
While I am not going to be here to see it put me in for half a pound of gen y, I am on a diet.

Which one is GenY?

If it's the generation my children are part of I have a lot to say to young Brett.

Probably a lot of swearing too so thank goodness he left the same message over on Altnews today.

When the US expands the war in Pakistan and Afghanistan Bretthutton will you offer your sons /grandsons up for cannon fodder? I'm for national service but everyone must be involved.In the US of the 435 congressman on one had a son in active service in Iraq.

Better still when the war breaks out,put the son's of the international banker's,arms dealsers etc on the front lines and you will see all wars cease very quickly.

when I was about 17 I went to a youth camp sponsored by the local Apex club. There were young people from all over the state all sponsored by their local Apex club. We did lots of airy fairy hippy crap like trust games and learning to meditate but we also went to art galleries saw theatre shows and independant films. Overall it was a very eye opening experience for me and I met a lot of different people that I would not have been exposed to otherwise. I was a changed, and I like to think, more mature person after that camp. Thankyou Apex

This sort of program for all young people would be a much better idea than giving them guns and showing them how to be proficient killers.

This has to be a spoof, surely.

BrettHutton is actually a crusty old fart sunk deep in a big leather armchair, whisky and soda at his elbow, pretending to be a young whipper-snapper who's keen to do his bit in khaki for King and Country. Sitting there screwing his monocle into his one good eye ("lorst the other in the desert fighting Rommel") and extolling the virtues of a dose of army life for every jack-the-lad.

>>...boosting of our armed force numbers... increase in attendance relating to jobs, increase in creation of industry jobs, increase of part-time & full time military servicemen, further education applications such as universities, tafe colleges, training facilities and a more structured profitable economy.<<

And don't forget it takes them off the streets, egad.

Stops 'em hoonin' around in their souped-up Subarus, all leather jackets and fancy haircuts.

And self disciplin' dontchernow, that's what kids these days don't understand. A few weeks with my old Sar'n Major, that'll sort out the little softies. Give 'em a bit of spine. Get rid of those haircuts too.

Nope, not falling for it BrettHutton, your cover is blown.

Either that or you're the youngest fogey of them all.

...and again you guys squash people from a generation other than yours. Well done. Why do you think most people who sign up here are one post wonders....(it's rhetorical, don't bother).

National service doesn't NECESSARILY mean handing them a gun using them as 'cannon fodder'....that one's a WW1 term...isn't it?. Our current conflicts have resulted in the deaths of HOW MANY Au soldiers?. They can do basic training and then find themselves in support roles.

I guess we should expect the sort on comments from people whose generation created the issues we have with youths these days. Thanks guys, BRAVO.

I think that the old style service model deserves our scorn, it’s 19th cnt’ thinking, and I doubt anyone would even try to get it up, they’d be tied up in legal battles for a century!
And quickly out of a job.
The basic idea is still good though. A military style structure with the health, discipline, and fitness aspects, but no military training, no foreign work component.
They could be set “green” tasks, or helping the elderly or infirm, all the sorts of emergency work that the Yanks use their National Guard for at home.
I can see value in making it universal, just as many other countries do, and with voting rights as a reward. It would do a lot of good, add structure and discipline to their lives, and give them a greater sense of connection with the nation that supports them.

The most dangerous man in Obama's Govt is Polish born Zbigniew Brzezinski.He sees himself as being a being the grand chess player of global geo-politics.He has admitted that he used the CIA in Afghanistan to suck the Russians into war there.He has a passionate hatred of the Russians and could create a missile crisis in Poland and Georgia far worse than Cuba.

In his book of 1997 "The Grand Chessboard" he says;"...moreover as America becomes increasingly a multi-cultural society,it may find it becomes more difficult to fashion a consensus of foreign policy, except in the circumstances of a truely massive and widely perceived direct external threat."

If you don't want war,then get involved and see who our real enemies are.The US people are not evil.It is those like Brzezinski who manipulate things in the background who are the real threat to peace.

see; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V-bxx7OyZ0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzRSzYZg22M&feature=related

Brett,
All bad jokes aside your piece simply repeats several generation myths.
Every generation thinks it knows better than the one before. History suggests that if they do have some extra wisdom it is at best incremental.
The crusty members of older generations argue 'put them in the forces it will make a man/woman of them' and 'it worked well for me'.

My dad was a survivor of the Burma Railway, loved the structured life. *But* he impressed on me to be in 'B' company (B there when they go and B there when they get back). He also trained the CMF (reserves) but always said they were under trained/under prepared (as he was) for unimaginable horrors of war. He maintained one needs to be committed to be a good soldier and conscripts were rarely that.
He died at 42 as a result of his war injuries.

Being a baby boomer I was in the generation of conscription (Vietnam). And that wasn't a raging great success. The Soldiers did their duty and deserve the respect. But the error was sending them there for someone else's power play. Read the *real* reasons for subsequent wars and weep for the waste of the genetic best of our races.

Then one needs to consider the historic resistance to conscription.

Notwithstanding that I would depending on details not be opposed to a “peace corp.” type of arrangement where a non discriminate gap year could be spent doing community activities before uni or work. That year could involve relevant basic training and field work.
In this way people with disabilities/elasticities/ special skills etc. could participate too and develop further personal/life skills including the self discipline. *Selected* wayward youth could be given this as an alternative option to remand or community service orders. i.e. away from comfort zones.

I learned so much from my time as a volunteer crisis intervention counsellor.

Examinator

When I was at Uni, Architects, Engineers and Interior Designers were expected to complete a minimum of humanities subjects each year towards their degree.

A better strategy would be to expand on what you have already outlined; work in the welfare sector as part of education. This would give a foundation in real life for future lawyers, economists, engineers, architects etc.

I don't get why Army life is always raised as the one-size-fits-all solution to "uppity" youth by the preceding generation. Clearly it hasn't worked in the past (take a good hard look at Baby Boomers), yet it is trotted out like an old suit that never quite fitted, but is considered better than nothing. It is not a solution and youth are no worse than previous generations.

PS
Checked your email?

This link is really worth viewing."The Men Behind Obama ParT 2" by Webster Tarpley http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-KJCMWcoms&NR=1

Webster is very articulate and presents a convincing case. We have real reason to be concerned,since as the US economy becomes more unstable Obama will have 2 choices.He will either shrink the US influence and bring the troops home,or expand the military machine thus creating a big external threat uniting the US population in war.

What we could see here,is a whipping up of a public frenzy towards a war mentality via national service to defend the homeland.Kevin Rudd is spending enormous amoounts on new military hardware.We are the world's 13th largest spender on defence.

Obama is developing his own civilian army bringing compulsory national service for all 18-25 yrs.
Obama," I want a civilian force ,just as strong,just powerful and financed as the regular forces." Why?

Dear Brett,

In theory it's a good idea that you're suggesting,
but not always practical. Many young people have
planned their future life and education and
compulsory military service would in many cases
greatly upset the balance of their future.

For example, in mine and my husband's experience,
young school friends who have opted to go into
the work force before undertaking studies have
ended up remaining in the workforce - and not
undertaking any studies.

Therefore those that do have a plan for their
future, should be allowed to pursue it, and
those that don't have any plans could be
encouraged (as they are in the US)
to join the military forces as an
option until they decide their career paths.

To divert all young people (male and female) into
a mandatory National Service could affect the
economy of the country with less people going
into business and industry and remaining in the
military forces - or totally being disenchanted
and becoming a burden on the welfare system.

My husband attended a school where army cadet
programs were compulsory at least for two years
of his high school education. This gave him an
understanding and a grounding for military
service in the event of a national disaster.
To this day he has not regretted the experience.

He has noticed that today fewer schools have that
program. And he feels that it should be
introduced in all schools. Which gives the school
leaver an understanding of military service and
the opportunity to join the military forces if
desired.

Where's Brett? Has Brett Hutton already gone missing in action and the war of words has yet begun!

Pericles could be charged with cyber bullying by Kevin Rudd's thought police.I could be charged with blasphamy for inferring that the Messiah Obama is not what he seems.There is a whole scope for argument here and the leading conscript is AWOL.

Hey Foxy, you're like the best information gatherer I have come across... Can you tell me which is which generation?

We have StG accusing people of being a generation that messed up the next one and I am at a complete loss at to which one they're on about.

I think Mikk had a good point, it doesn't have to be military training but maybe some sort of compulsary something to gather young people and see how they are doing and let them aquire new skills.

Piper

Well, Examinator and I suggested community work as being a more beneficial alternative to learning how to carry a gun. Learning about people outside your own little group tends to bring out empathy in people. I know I learnt heaps working with immigrants, refugees, mentally disabled, druggies, ex-crims and so on. Other programs could be environmental work such as clearing weeds, planting indigenous plant species. There is enough variety to suit the talents and temperament of any individual Gen Z.

OK - this is approximate

Baby Boomers - those born after WW2 until 1965 - were conscripted into military for Vietnam war.

Gen X 1966 - 1976: Never had to be conscripted.

Gen Y 1977 - 1994: Brett Hutton, the author of this thread, is a member, but I suspect born closer to 1977 than the rest of the Gen Y's, so feels safe proposing mandatory military service for those born later than him. Ironic huh?

Gen X 1994 - 2012: Brett wants these people to be conscripted because like each older generation, they think the younger one needs a bit of discipline.

Well I'm going to disagree with all you old farts here and agree
with Brett :)

I did 17 weeks in the Swiss army, which all Swiss men have to do.
I was actually in the airforce communications sections, so escaped
the infantry (whew)

Yes, we all hated every minute of it. For once in our lives we
had to learn to shut up, comply and cooperate with a team.

Much as we hated it, with hindsight it was character building for
all of us. We learnt many skills, made a whole lot of friends and
now remember the whole thing with fond memories.

I'm not sure about a year, but 17 weeks in bootcamp, does no teenager
any harm.

"Baby Boomers - those born after WW2 until 1965 - were conscripted into military for Vietnam war.

Gen X 1966 - 1976: Never had to be conscripted.

Gen Y 1977 - 1994: Brett Hutton, the author of this thread, is a member, but I suspect born closer to 1977 than the rest of the Gen Y's, so feels safe proposing mandatory military service for those born later than him. Ironic huh?

Gen X 1994 - 2012: Brett wants these people to be conscripted because like each older generation, they think the younger one needs a bit of discipline."

Thank you Fractelle. Did you mean Z for the last one? Those keys are close together.

I am an Gen X and my kids are Y's (just scraped in). To tell the truth, my kids are much nicer law abiding teenagers than their father and I were. Yet we had much stricter parents than I think I was.

I can see community work as a great way to go but maybe just anything is a great way to go to help expand the Z's focus and understanding. But yeah, I wouldn't see teaching them all things military as anything particularly advantageous. Would be just as interesting for city kids to be sent to farms and the farm kids sent in to a city.

Looking back at verious "work schemes" I was placed in as a horrible teenager I did learn a lot of stuff without once being taught about weapons. A really nice Dutch man taught me how to make the perfect pancake once. And I learnt how to use a gestetner - okay that wasn't so useful.

Foxy is also right aye - some kids already have it sorted and don't need to be directed.

Thanks Piper

I did make a typo, please read as Gen Z.

I agree some kids don't need any extra aid.

I like the idea of an exchange program for country and city kids.

The opportunity to spend some time in another's shoes has benefits far beyond the usual "conscript them, that'll learn 'em" and "if it was good enuff for me, its good enuff for them". Both of which are completely devoid of any thought. Time spent cleaning gun barrels and snapping to attention is unlikely to produce broad-minded individuals who can empathise with others.

Question to ask, what does the community of the future need most?

Yep Fractelle I agree that is what I meant everything from acting as guides for visitors in cities, galleries, museums. Doing work in teams for the elderly etc in home maintenance. Working in the outback communities alongside with the local aborigines or even doing fly and builds (under supervision) to some of the south Pacific Islands etc. Anything so long as they learn and do good for the communities.

Maybe they CAN do what my gen tried naively to do but didn't really succeed at. Failing that they can join the curmudgeons and tell the next generation how much better they were. Then Gen Z can earn their name Gen Zzzzzzzzzz. (joke) :-) he he

Dear Piper,

Thank You for the compliment of "information gatherer."
I love it! (Big hug!)

Fractelle has answered the question you asked me about
the various Generations.

However the following website may be of interest to you -
just for your info.:

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-army-today/cadet-history.htm

"Today the Australian Army Cadets which is fostered
by the Australian Army is one of the 3 youth military
services organisations that make up the Australian
Defence Force Cadets. The other organisations are -
1) The Australian Navy Cadets that are fostered by
the Royal Australian Navy (RAN).
2) The Australian Air Force Cadets that is fostered by
the Royal Australian Air Force (RAAF).

The aim of the Australian Army Cadets is:

...to better equip young people for community life by
fostering initiative, leadership, discipline, and
loyalty through various training programs ..."

Take care.

A big pat on the back to:

Foxy
Examinator
Pied Piper
Maximillion

and

moi

For finding solutions for our youth which benefit both themselves and our community. There should be some sort of merit involved (no not for us!) for our young people, depending on time spent and achievements, such as a diploma and salary could be equivalent to what they'd receive as Privates in the military.

*Question to ask, what does the community of the future need most?*

Fractelle, interestingly enough, only a very small part of my military
training, had to do with carrying a gun.

But did that training make youngsters more employable? Absolutaly.
Did it untie some of the apron strings for those still tied to
mommy? Yup.

Did it teach kids self discipline? Yup. Did it teach kids how to
work in teams and assist one another? Yup.

Was it character building? Yup.

17 weeks, that would do no teenager any harm, but many would surely
benefit.

Yabby,disciplne is good but it does not necessarily have to be military discipline.In this climate I don't think that putting 18-25 yr olds into military training is such a good idea.With the US looking for new wars to start,many people can be seduced into conflicts that are no business of ours.

If we are to have military training,then part of their education should be an unbiased view of how the US is entering to pre-emptive wars that are not justified eg Iraq and Pakistan.Let them know how this Zbigniew Brzezinski the foreign policy maker of Obama thinks.

War is the most horrific thing anyone can experience.Even if you are lucky enough to survive it with all your limbs,your psyche is changed for ever and this is usually for the worse.We should only go to war in defense of our country and not at the beckon and call of the US seeking to extend it's empire

Arjay, I remind you that despite every male in Switzerland doing
their 17 weeks of training, Switzerland has been involved in no
wars.

It did however stop Hitler from invading the place, as he realised
that his losses would be far too great.

OTOH, has all that training benefitted the Swiss? I remind you
that its a tiny country, with no resources, a great education
system in the way of trades etc and as a nation the Swiss have
done better then just about any other nation.

Just look around you, from Nestle coffee to a host of pharmaceuticals, to ship engines to lifts, the Swiss are involved.

You would be consuming their products nearly every day, without even
being aware of it.

I've now employed enough young Australians to realise, that some
are so pampered and spoiled by their well meaning parents, that
they are hardly employable.

17 weeks to shake them up to the real world, would do them no harm
and perhaps alot of good.

Great spin Yabby put forward, pity it is neither objective or truly accurate. We should also consider the fact glossed over or ignored (because they didn't suit the his biased argument.

Their army had nothing to do with why they didn't get occupied. It had more to do with their being a clearing house and bankers for the 3rd Reich and it's ill gotten gains.

Even today they hide (destroyed) records that shows their nefarious activities. GWB's Gran daddy (Prescott)got into bother for the same activities.

Switzerland have one of the most discriminatory migration systems in Europe.

Do we really need to talk about the Switz corporations skulduggery/abuses.

The corporations are there because of tax laws etc nothing to do with the army or any thing else.

Their army is to boost patriotism nothing else.

In short Switzerland is hardly a model to strive for. It illustrious status is a myth....PR.

The whole purpose of military is to either provide or support "cannon fodder". Rarely in defense usually for political or other reasons.
Simply look at all the militarist countries and with hand on heart tell us that they don't have another agenda beyond mere defense.
The US, Russia, China, Burma, Israel, Nth Korea et al.

Dear Yabby,

My husband worked with a Swiss National who spent
2 years in the Swiss National Service. He was
given a bicycle - for transport, a Swiss knife
for defence, and a mountaineering pick -
to fight the enemy.
These are not my husband's words, but that of the
Swiss National. That was back in the early 1970s.

And, that was the Swiss Army bicycle division.

Militarily - the natural geography - gave more
protection to the country than the Swiss Army.

Have a look at the Vatican State - the Papal
Swiss Guard - their uniforms and their weaponry.
Straight out of the 16th Century.

The only 'protection,' Switzerland has is its
Swiss banks. Where enemies of varied political
persuasion can stash their 'loot,' under the one roof -
with the blessing of the Swiss Government.

Any form of military training be it in school cadets,
National Service, Army Reserves, or the regular military,
gives the Nation an organised pool of manpower in National
emergencies or catastrophes - and that can't be all bad.
For example - in the recent Victorian Bush fires - when
the regular authorities could not cope - with the extent
of the bush fires - the army came in with assistance of
air and road transport and temporary tent accommodation
for the victims. If they wouldn't have had people in
military training they wouldn't have been able to call
on them.

My husband who was in the Scouts camping near a bushfire
area - together with all the campers helped fight the fire.
That's a small example of an organised unit assisting
in the event of a disaster.

ROFL, you two turkeys know about as much about Switzerland, as
most ignorant Americans know about Australia :)

A couple of links, so that you at least are informed about
the basics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Switzerland

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Switzerland

I noticed with my teens over the last two years and with many of their friends and classmates that they got tired or sick of it or just wanted to do something else after so many years at school. It seems to happen around 16 – 17. Maybe something put in place to interrupt near the end of the school year where they all go off and do something else for a couple of months.

I think if something different had happened many of them would have returned to school for Year 11.

“Question to ask, what does the community of the future need most?”

A firm identity? Empathy? Ethics? I just asked husband and he said "Law and Order" Asked the 17 year old, "big parks" she says Fractelle. God help us.

Hey Foxy, hug back at ya. That site was interesting, my son would have loved it and my daughter would have been expelled (or shot) within days. DoCS should make more use of these places. And boarding schools.

I don’t know how I feel about Switzerland not being in any wars Yabby. Nice that they were okay though.

Dear Yabby,

Who are you calling a turkey?

As I told another poster -
"You're the reason God created the middle finger!"

You can quote as many websites as you like about
the Swiss military - and I can match everyone
of them with information about the 'fabled
bicycle brigade - the combat cyclist regiment!

If you don't believe me try these websites:

http://www.63xc.com/stefs/sabike.htm

And -

http://articles.latimes.com/2002/oct/20/news/adfg-newsswiss20

One's In praise of Swiss Army Bikes and
the other is about the - Swiss Army adapting to change.

"In time of war, head for the hills."
Is an old Swiss military doctrine - and confirms
how the mountains were used by the Swiss militia.

Dear Piper,

To me it's always a joy to read your posts.
Keep them coming, Dear Heart!

I served in Greek military for 26 months (compulsary). A very good school to create YESMEN!
We used to say that where stop the stupidity and beyond from it starts the military.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide

Ah Foxy, I was calling you a turkey, even if an endearing one,
for writing such uninformed gobble gobble :)

*Have a look at the Vatican State - the Papal
Swiss Guard - their uniforms and their weaponry.
Straight out of the 16th Century.*

What on earth do the Swiss army have to do with the tourist
attractions in Rome?

Do you even know anything about the Swiss army? Yes indeed they
also have Swiss army bikes. I remind you that Mullah Omar escaped
the whole modern US military on a motor bike! You clearly cannot
think outside of the square.

If your read the URL about the Swiss army, you'd know that every
trained soldier gets to take his assault weapon home, along with
a can of sealed bullets, so that the whole Swiss army can be
ready to go in 12 hours. That is hundreds of thousands of men.

Yes indeed, the Swiss army uses its topography wisely. I got to
see what was inside some of those mountains and you would be amazed!
Fully equipped hospitals, dormitories, weaponary etc, protected
from nuclear attack, which was the big threat during the cold war.

Switzerland is a country of huge mountains, tunnels and bridges and
Hitler had plans to invade, but knew full well that the army could
have destroyed the lot in a few hours leaving his troops totally
stranded.

Swiss jet fighter pilots are some of the best in the world, as
they train to fly in those mountains.

Desite all this, Switzerland has been neutral for hundreds of
years and does not get involved in wars, unless it is attacked.

Militia fighting defeated the US military dear, do not undererstimate
its capabilities.

The Swiss army indeed played a vital role in the war and Hitler
knew it, so he never did activate those invasion plans.

Dear Yabby,

There you go.

That's more like it!

You're now seeing the bigger picture.

Well done!

Yabby ,Why would Hitler or any other economic rapist invade Switzerland when their money is already in a Swiss Bank account? The Swiss have very cleverly played both sides in European conflicts.You call it neutrality but I call it banskter opportunism.The banks loan to both sides in wars.Often they create conflicts for their own gain.

Yabby:”Switzerland is a country of huge mountains, tunnels and bridges and Hitler had plans to invade...”

Oh well that’ll be why NZ wasn’t invaded either.

Hey Foxy, this Brett never turned back up over on Altnews either but he had a photo of himself. I’ve noticed this here before; someone leaves an introduction to a thread never to be heard from again. I sort of understood on here that if you have a thread you are kind of expected to pop back in and respond. And I’m drifting off topic again. Had a couple of managers point out that I have an amazing capacity for distraction – nah I don’t, I just forget what I was answering.

I did read (or saw something on TV) that in WWII England and then America weren’t ready; their boys were not fit enough for war. After that there was an attempt to encourage a healthier lifestyle in the young. This seems to have petered out now. I’d like to see the younger ones head of and learn about physical and mental health, ethics, self worth, their role in communities and how to identify and obtain what they want for their futures.

And for it to be done right near the end of Year 10 before they all start drifting off. This also seems to be an age when the more experimental drugs become attractive. And it coincides with that youth allowance thing that they can get here?

Dear Piper,

It sounds to me that you know how to deal with
children of all ages - and they're really lucky
to have you in Fostercare. You're like a great
big huggable 'mama bear.'

With my children - It was a matter of 'learn as you go.'
We go them involved in sporting activities (- mainly
basketball), then the youngest got interested in martial
arts (he now has a black belt), they both joined the
scouts - and so on. We kept them busy - and it seems
to have worked. (Fingers-crossed).

But one things for sure - they knew they were/are -
very loved - and no matter what - we'll always be
there for them.

Hey Foxy, Belly is the bear![grin] Oh basketball, my boy loved basketball (years of listening to a ball bounce on concrete, chemists made a fortune in nuerophen sales). My girl, her tae kwon do instructor rang me one day when she was about 7 and said he didn’t want her there because she kept hurting the other kids. I laughed so hard I nearly had an accident. Then it was explained to me with great patience that my attitude was incorrect. Oops. Maybe my attitude about military training is also incorrect?

And of course they are loved, you sound lovely Foxy. This isn’t something I can encourage in return with fostering – it’s a thin line us short term fosters tread to avoid causing harm. I won’t always be there for them, weird huh.

Brett showed up again over on Altnews, his reply surprised me so I hope he cruises back in here.