Oliver,
Not many people would complain about a Bible being in a hotel room. I know people who say they read it when they were there because there was nothing else to do. No one is forced to read the Bible, and it is not taking up space in a public domain. Hotels are generally privately owned. I don't read the Bible when I stay at hotels because I generally have my own with me. If people find the presence of a Bible offensive, what about TV's and radios, newspapers, liquor in the fridge and the list goes on. You could always stay at home.

Oly.. minor theological correction :) (don't you luv this)

Jesus 'was trying' ?... aarrgh.. no my friend.. Jesus was DOING..... (but not what you said in the sense you mean't it)

MARK 8:27

Jesus and his disciples went on to the villages around Caesarea Philippi. On the way he asked them, "Who do people say I am?"

28They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, one of the prophets."

29"But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"
Peter answered, "You are the Christ."

30Jesus warned them not to tell anyone about him.

31 He then began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, chief priests and teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and after three days rise again.

CAREFUL OBSERVATION REQUIRED....

1/ What did Peter just confess to?

2/ What happened next?

3/ What is the 3rd word of verse 31? I'll let you answer this. That word is CRUCIAL to understanding Jesus ministry.

Now..see chapter 9:30-32 (see how the disicples are described? I think you are a little like them :)

Now Chapter 10:32-34 .. what did Jesus say there? again?

Note.. the period from Mark 8 to chapter 16 is around 2 weeks in real time. The first 8 chapters are about 3 yrs. What does this tell you about Marks purpose? and what is he trying to tell us about Jesus?

You might also compare Mark 10:45 for additional insight.

Things often become clearer when we refer to the Bible rather than 'scholars' speaking "about it" :)
blessings.

Steel Mann,

I, personally, am not worried about Bibles in hotels, either. Nor would I be about the Koran or Rosary Beads. My point was to Boaz on the assumption that there are many whom feel religions [Islam, in Boaz's case]should not be sponsored or even visible in the public domain. Good point about hotels being privately owned.

Yet, I do support the separation of Church and State.

Boazy,

Thanks for the references. A bit busy with my own research at present, but will have a look as soon as I can.

Boazy,

MARK 8:31 I read as Jesus' ministry on Earth and, an allusion to suffering and substititionary randsom. I posit the Catholic position to be more direct:

Matthew 16:18: "You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church".

My own position is that Jesus was intending to organically grow a Jewish sect, via the greater inclusion of the Gentiles. The House of David had traditionally ministered to the Gentiles [Thiering]. At Nicaea, the reverse happened, Constitantine substitued the Christian-Jewish godhead for the Serapis godhead and the Roman god Sol Invictas.

Oly..I don't think your position stacks up with the facts.. you seem to be placing a kind of 'theory' on the New testament..rather than letting it speak for itself.

Remember the opening of Mark? "the beginning..as it is written....

Jesus is the fulfillment of all the Old Testament.. as he himself says in Luke 24:44-49 please have a read.

The Catholic position can be disputed, from history and theology.
The 'Pope'... as in infallible leader of the Church? :) I hardly think so.
I am "Sola Scriptura"... The Catholic position is contrary to Romans and the Gospels.. they have structured the dogma to pretty much fit in with an authority structure, and have made the Church an intermediary between man and God. "Jesus" is the Way...not a Pope nor a priest.

By pushing mans access to God back behind a priest or the Church structure.... they gain much power in this world.

This is one reason why the Communists have a partial point in saying 'Religion is the opiate of the masses'.

Look at Matthew 28:19ff Luke 24:25ff (very important)

Don't be surprised if I fade from OLO for a while.. indefinite.. I'm being unfairly censored at the moment (in my view) so..I'll do what I feel appropriate :)
newlifeinhim777@yahoo.com if you want to follow up anything.

warm regards
BD

Good morning Boazy,

I am not arguing the Catholic position for myself, but from the strength of the statement in Matthew, wherein, Jesus clearly mentions the Church, nor do I believe in Papal infallibility:

"In 1870 Pope Pius IX ... compensated for the loss of the Papal States by declaring Papal infallibility on matters of faith and morals prounced, "ex cathedra" ... against the advice from the cardinals of pluralist societies, notably Americian, German and French cardinals and Cardinal Newman from England." - Thomas Keneally

If we moved Jesus' birth back to 7 BCE to have him born at the time of Herod and the conjection of three planets [star-like appearance] and the numerology of Judaic calendar*, it places Jesus' youth at a time when the Herods held ascendancy over the Annas.

Herod was appointed by Julius Caesar. The House of David traditionaly ministered to the Gentiles. Apply Occam's razor to this situation. Recall the Herodians were Arab not Jewish.

Moreover, the history of Nicaea is well documented. Herein, I have explained the godhead on previously posts. Constantine originally believed in Sol Invictas & duality vis-a-vis monotheistism.

Recall Herod was dead, if we take the Bible's timeline.

When dealing with multiple document sources, I suggest it better to compare these documents against each other and, against history and if possible the sciences.

In your analysis, there is a tendency to compare everything to the Bible; rather than, compare the Bible to everything :-).

Will look the passages you recommend. Thanks.

Cheers.* Its complicated, but basically Jesus could play to the end times being the Jewish Year 4,000 [60 CE].