Ive seen it here a lot and on other websites.
Younger folk with an acceptance of our relationship to China.
With a eagerness to better that relationship...for the sake of the buck.
People with a willingness in their hearts to frequently overlook the abuse of human rights in China for the sake of Australias' economy.
I find it poor wisdom and distasteful to put a nations prosperity before her morality.
I find Australia almost a beggerman to a more powerful adversary that Kevin Rudd has been to such a government in recent times to build a cosy two-way for the sake of money and manufacturing, import and export.
Every day in China innocent people get persecuted, some killed by the States policies.
Shouldnt we take a stronger stand against such a government?
Become independent from her... rather than joining the rest of a morally weak world in "merging" with her.
Do you find Australia weak and kowtowing?
Why did the diggers give their lives in asian wars?
Wasnt it to fight ungodly, avaricious governments?
Not to have their vision of freedom and independence fade away? Surely not for the dollar!

Gibo I truly do not think it is wise to answer you, you are blinkered by your form of Christianity.
But in the 1970s this country took the first step to opening relations with China.
America followed and while not every thing is better we are a long way from the China we found then.
Australia again can talk to them, far better than closing doors, talk about human rights and a host of things like the environment.
Condemn me to a non existent hell if you wish but our fate is in our hands, humanity that is Iraq to me proves a better way than war must exist.
Last the west has strange eye sight- we tend to see others faults with perfect vision but find seeing our own impossible.

China will be, what China will be...

and they will always remember the Opium wars.. just like the Japanese remembered 1854 when Commodore Perry extorted 'openness to trade' from them with his gunboats off Tokyo harbour.

Australia... we are a cloak of many colors. Economics has always been the bottom line of human behavior and attitude. "What's in it for ME"?

So, those who are enjoying economic benefit from importing Chinese goods.. will suck up like a newborn infant.

Those who's businesses are threatened (like mine) will be the opposite.

Politics I guess, is where those competing views josstle for power and influence.

We abandoned 'principle' ages ago when it comes to politics and international relations.. we like to pick and choose our targets to portray ourselves on the high moral ground....but its all posturing and that...for economic benefit...

Me cynical ? haha.. you betcha

Glad you're not 'steering the course' Gibo. It's called TRADE. One trades with other nations for the E-CON-OMY. Without trade we'd have an E-CON-OMY like Zimbabwe. Actually, if you wanna know what it feels like to 'be a millionaire', spend fifty bucks on their currency. Let's stop buying oil from the arabs eh?. Surely there's been some human rights issues there....and African nations too....and Russia.....and Italy...damn inquisition....actually, write of ALL of Asia....and Japan....the sub continent as well....

Yes, I know all of this Belly.
I did live through the "early feelers" into China period.
What concerned me a bit was an attitude in many younger folk that I had observed in newspapers and Your Say columns right across Australia in recent times, perhaps a subconsicous thing, that Australia was now attached to China because of her huge manufacturing powers and her sway over our economy and we were subsequently locked irrevocably into a relationship that we depended on for our survival as a nation.
I saw the beginnings of a false vision, a lie even, in youth, that might one day might lead to some kind of subservience to what is basically an evil government.
The killing of the teenagers in Tiananmen Square (the subsequent denial) and of the people and the monks in Tibet and Chinas own born again christians and the Falun Gong folk and the minor criminals and who, apart from God knows who else has been murdered for small events, sustains that belief that they are primarily a wicked global power. The government that is.
According to the Bible, China never changes right up until the great outward march across asia (kings of the east).
I see a defeat in the hearts of our youth already.
We dont have to allow China to own us, in any way, we dont need to bend to her evil for the sake of economic things.
Thats how I saw the situation developing.
Defence, I fear, has long given up against a "complete defence of Australia".
No guns in the defence cupboard for the citizens. No plans for a home guard defence force. No decentralisation to escape Chinas nukes; and in support of a home guard. No ammunition sufficient for existing forces. Allowed most of the private firearms to vanish. Pathetic.

Yeah,I don't think that the "China Syndrome" of driving everything to the lowest common denominator is all that good.The Italian products I use are now surcumbing to the China Syndrome and quality is dropping off.

People have expectations of everything being cheap hence in my market,the fly by nighters are doing dirt cheap jobs and won't be around to honour warranties.

When the rest of China gets involved in their industrial revolution ie another 900 million people,they will have world dominance both economically and militarily.

We are will be minnows of the lowest order to be bought off at a price of their choosing.We presently sell them gas for 2c a litre under a thirty yr contract and sell coal for a song.We still have blossoming balance of payments deficit!

China will win by virtue of being intelligent,hard working,with a huge cheap labour force.They also have a totalitarian Govt they refuse to be hamstrung by the impotent democracies of the West.

Tibet and Taiwan could be the thin end of the wedge.

Dear Gibo,

It would be unwise to ignore a country with a population of 1.3 billion.

Peace and development should be the dominant theme of our times.

China is a big developing country. Despite China's tremenduous economic achievements, with a population of 1.3 billion, the GDP per capita is still one twenty-fifth of the United States and Australia, ranked below No.140 in the world and the economy total only accounted 4% of the world.

China's development and rise is going to be a long and arduous journey. She has no material basis and subjective intention of seeking hegemony and expansion.

China pursues a peaceful diplomatic policy. That should be encouraged.
And only by maintaining relations with her - can something be achieved
towards bettering their human rights record.

Also we now have a new Government - whose approach to foreign policy is based on 3 fundamental pillars:

1) Membership of the United Nations.
2) Alliance with the United States.
3) Policy of comprehensive engagement in Asia.

The Labor Party has always believed that Australia's economic, political and strategic future was intimately tied up with the future of our own region.

And it was for these reasons that successive Australian Labor Governments have sought to develop the best possible bilateral political relationships with Regional Countries, as well as
developing multi-lateral Regional relationships through APEC, aimed at Regional trade liberalisation, and the ASEAN Regional Forum (ARF),
which is aimed at creating a Regional Security Dialogue across the essentially different countries of the Region.

For Australia, China is at the core of the Government's policy of
comprehensive Regional engagement. Having a Prime Minister who is fluent in Mandarin also helps.

I wounder arjay if you think we are down on our knees in relationships with China?
Would you ignore them?
Rudd has by his ability to talk to them, the chance to tell China of our concerns.
We once did not even have that.
I question some fundamentalist Christians view China is their enemy in the battle of Armageddon, not so long ago it was said to be Russia!
Some may well think closer to the battle Field.
Just maybe a Christian can tell my this.
Why did your God who made every thing make half the world to be so that he would have to destroy it?
Strange but very true BOAZ DAVIDS last post was 100% true we however do not all see our own faults as easy as we see others.
Free Tibet yes by all means but turn our backs on China? no thanks.

My understanding Belly is that at Armageddon they come from the north and they come from the east.
You can do a study on the kings of the east and you will see China moving out across asia, the Euphrates River and onto Armagedon (Revelation 9:16 and 16:12). 200 million soldiers killing a third of mankind.
If only you folks knew the Bible you might understand why so many are to die.
Theres a huge spirit war going on between God and satan (used to be called Lucifer).
Those that follow satan will perish.
This is why "half" of mankind is going to die in the endtimes .
God provided a Saviour in Jesus Christ, His Blood covering the sin of all who come to Him to be saved (Romans 10:13). There are only two camps you can be in. Gods or the other guys evil camp.
There is no third area for men...and they dont stand independent of the war.
One camp of the other the Holy Bible says.
Turn to Jesus and be saved.

Cant agree Foxy that Chinas growth is going to be long.
Part of Revelation speaks about a great world leader with a mark on either the right hand or forehead for everyone (Revelation 13:16-18 and 14:9-11).
They have the mark now as a microchip and in certain places they are micro chipping folk.
Soon the worlds last dictator will appear and the endimes will switch on.
Sorry about that. Its a shock to many hardened christians as well.
All the christians have to do to please The Lord is NOT! take the mark/chip. The last seven years are not far off at all.
I reckon The Lord could come for His believers anytime soon (the rapture). Quielty...the committed christians watch it all unfold.

Gibo you have a right to your belief however must you divert every thread back to your primitive belief in God?
It kills threads and unless I am wrong breaks rule one do not divert threads.
We seem unable to talk politics without such diversions, now yes many of us are Christian, some maybe the five minute conversion kind who become followers when in trouble.
But just maybe our international relationships with other country's should be driven by rational debate and needs not any one of the host of Gods man has manufactured.
And as each God is said to be the only one by those who follow why are they used to keep man apart not unite them?

Oh Belly where have you been living.
Right before your eyes Gods Great Plan for earth unfolds.
We can see it in the great increase in wars, earthquakes, famines diseases (check out signs that we are in the endtimes).
We see it in the rise of the antichrist and his microchip on the right hand or forehead (check out mark of the beast microchip). We see it in the great increase in crime and violence (2 Timothy 3).
You have to get used to it son.
You and I and everyone else are going to live that endtimes period in history ...unless you belong to Jesus first... and He comes for His people early in (the Rapture).
You cant stop christians from talking about what they know.
Adapt your life plans, jump on board with the born againers (give your life to Jesus today ) and reach out and find a lively christian church... one that really jumps for Jesus and find peace.
You non-believers are like a people standing on a beach with a huge tidal wave of events rising in front of them.
You wont resist God in the end. Youve got to join Him and Jesus, His Saviour for all mankind.