The surge in petrol prices due to the ongoing conflict in Iran is a stark reminder of our reliance on fossil fuels.

As the cost of petrol skyrockets, millions in Australia are grappling with unpredictable petrol prices that are a strain on their budgets and threaten their financial stability and way of life, with people 'panic buying' petrol here and overseas.

This is where electric vehicles (EVs) are not just a choice, but should be seen as a serious solution and an essential part of our lives. They offer a direct alternative from overseas oil markets owned by a few.

We've tried so many things to get 'competition' into the fuel market to reduce prices and they simply are not working.

Now, more than ever, embracing electric cars as a result is vital. We don't have a choice anymore either as petrol goes over $2.00 per litre and over $2.60 a litre for diesel.

Yes Nathan,

There is a current surge in fuel/energy costs.
This will certainly make some of those who are considering a car purchase evaluate both hybrid and electric cars.

I find it ironic, however, how many of those who rail against perceived removal of personal freedoms seem to be the most vocal opponents to the decentralisation of energy and the personal choices that go with that.

The Forums TRUMP SUPPORTERS have been rather quiet since their mad folk hero launched his war of aggression on the people of the Middle East, gambling on how many innocent women and children they can murder. In Australia we are fortunate that the consequences thus far have only been economic, with higher interest rates, higher mortgages, higher inflation, higher petrol prices and supply shortages. Lets thank the Un-Australian Trump supporters and the dogs of the Coalition and One Nation political parties who support Trump and his attacks on all of us.

I look forward to a reply from mhaze, ttbn, GY, Individual, and a few other brain washed TRUMP SUPPORTERS.

We had toilet rolls disappearing at prolific rates and now we have petrol disappearing at prolific rates. We are in panic mode. How dangerous is it to store an oversupply of lawnmower fuel for no reason. All it has done is set fuel in short supply because their next delivery date will not come until that date is due.
Stoc piling of fuel should invalidate insurance claims hopefully.

"The Forums TRUMP SUPPORTERS have been rather quiet since their mad folk hero launched his war of aggression on the people of the Middle East"

Actually the war is on the manic leaders of Iran who are violently and viciously suppressing the people of the Middle East. But Paul has always supported the totalitarians against the people they suppress so it's little wonder that he supports the mad Ayatollahs

Trumpster,

As an Un-Australian you have supported the actions of Trump against our country. If the only person killed in this aggressive war waged by the mad fool in the White House was the Ayatollah, I wouldn't be terribly concerned, but since the warmongers in America, in cooperation with their Zionist mates, are killing thousands of innocent men, women and children, then I am concerned. Did you not agree with the Zionists indiscriminately murdering thousands of innocent women and children in Gaze? Now you are happy that the Iranians are suffering the same fate.

Why is the perversion of war so appealing to you?

40000 civilians killed by the Iranian regime - nothing to see here, move along.

Report, but unconfirmed, 1400 people, including soldiers, killed by the US/ Israel - OMG end times.

At least Paul's consistent in his hypocrisy.

"40000 civilians killed by the Iranian regime"

Stop selling fantasies to convince Aussies to give blood and money to fight Israels enemies.
You can rack those Iranian deaths up to Israel and America too btw.

Scott Bessent Admits US Created Dollar Shortage in Iran, Triggering Protests
http://youtu.be/2wXE_j590FE

Iran ‘SEIZES’ Thousands of US-Linked Devices; Starlink Drops Big Bombshell
http://youtu.be/FCL8qINkc1A

Iran arrests rioters in possession of 'weapons and bombs' as protests enter second week
http://thecradle.co/articles/iran-arrests-rioters-in-possession-of-weapons-and-bombs-as-protests-enter-second-week

Iran police say 139 foreign nationals arrested over protests in Yazd
http://www.iranintl.com/en/202602039320
Negahban said the detainees “played an active role in organizing, inciting and directing riotous actions” and that in some cases they were in contact with networks outside Iran.

When you engineer currency collapse to get people to riot the government
When you have western intelligence agents on the ground directing the operation
When you provide bombs and guns and encourage provocateurs to attack police and government buildings.
When you ship in starlink to co-ordinate attacks with a outside power

Then it's not an attack by the government upon the people
It's a foreign attack dressed up as grassroots civil unrest.

Now go pull the other one and stop wasting everyones time.

The West and Israel think they're clever.
They're pathetic scheming weasels.

They portray Trump to be some kind of genius.
He's actually the most dumbest clueless person you could find.

'Nobody could've known Iran would respond like that'
'What Iran is doing is a little unfair'
'They have no right to be doing what they're doing'

http://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2355853251557211
Are you freaking kidding me?

At this point if you still stand by Trump, then you'd have to be one of the stupidest people around.

I am already seeing people go way off topic again. I am opting out of this debate if it continues and will be doing so into the future if it happens again.

Why do you have to be so pedantic NathanJ?
Lesson for today: You can't control what others do.

"This is where electric vehicles (EVs) are not just a choice, but should be seen as a serious solution and an essential part of our lives. They offer a direct alternative from overseas oil markets owned by a few."

Can they power semi trailers and tractors?
Maybe everyone should rush out and buy an electric mower too?

"We've tried so many things to get 'competition' into the fuel market to reduce prices and they simply are not working."

Did we try buying fuel from Russia?
Or Venezuala maybe?

'Diversify' imagine that?

Some people seem to think that we should dance to America's tune because they will save us, when they can't even protect their own military bases and embassies.
They don't have underground bunkers to protect their own troops on-base from attack.
They send them to the Marriot instead.
And that's why the hotels got blown up

(These Americans are a really intelligent bunch)

mhaze started it "40000 civilians killed by the Iranian regime"
You think you can discuss the fuel crisis while banning any discussion of what lead to it?

Now go on over to my Iran thread and post something about gardening, if you want to.

AC;
Can they power semi trailers and tractors?

Yes they can and you can buy them now.
They are used for line long haul in Europe.
There is even a section of autobahn that has overhead
contenary to ah la trolley buses in Sydney, some Mercedes
trucks get power.
I think it was experimental.

Hi Bezza,
I vaguely remember that news story.
Maybe this removal of oil and gas from the Persian Gulf (as I expect will happen) will push a greater investment in these things in time, but I'm not sure we're at that point just yet, probably getting close though.

Today's Australian has an article on electric trucks and semis.
One article is on Tesla's truck.
The plan for Australia is to have a chain of rest stops at
a spacing to suit legal rest times.
There a truck will pullin & park and a forklift will pull off
the battery to be charged and a charged battery replaced while
the driver has a meal and a rest.
All seems reasonable and no doubt the problems would be sorted
out quite quickly.
I suspect the Chinese may done all this already,

Electric & hybrid cars require as much if not more oil to manufacture than just driving cars on Petrol. So, shortage of oil = no electric/hybrid car production !

Not so Indy; the oil to manufacture is used just once, petrol cars
use it all day every day.

This is the 'fuel crisis we had to have'.
If the LNP were in charge as Israeli handmaidens they'd have been cheering on the strikes on Iran even more,
So basically democracy did not afford us any avoidance of this effing mess.
And they weren't even prepared for their own aftermath either.
Between the two useless major parties they couldn't even keep to their own rules about having in place an adequete 90 day supply in case of emergency.

What should I expect from a bloke that looks and acts like Elmer Fudd?
How on earth are these people the best we've got?
How do these idiots even get on the ballot?

Supporting a strike on Iran was not at all in Australians interests.
This kind of thinking got us here and will keep us here.

And people like John Lyons who stated as such are under attack by he Antisemite gatekeepers stupid zionist lobby meaning
COMMON SENSE IS NOW BANNED AND FACING CENSORSHIP IN THIS COUNTRY AS WELL

Our leaders should have enough common sense as to not step in the kind shite that would lead us to be involved in a major war.
- They're going to get Australians killed, I absolutely guarantee it.

But I can't support shiterer either (LNP) just because I want angrily want to get rid of the shite (ALP)

Honestly, when it comes to foreign policy in this country all I see is grown adults rolling around in their own urine and feces, completely clueless all of them.

<<Why do you have to be so pedantic NathanJ?>>

Because this topic is about something very specific. We are seeing too much here of some people going way off topic, even when there is one small reference to something else.

Let's say you were to post something about I don't know let's say Gaza and I start going on about climate change and people living in stone huts in Africa. Everyone else jumps on board and your original post is pretty much worthless. Would you like that? I doubt it.

Going off track discourages people from posting here and getting involved. We already have a lack of a diversity of topics here, we cannot afford to make it worse.

Electric cars/trucks are so impractical in Australia that it takes a very temporary and entirely avoidable surge in the price of oil to even make them appear to be an option. But they aren't.

They may be barely viable in city conditions where the most driving people do is from the farmers market to the facial Pilates class, but in the wider world, the short range and long recharging times just doesn't work. Equally for trucks and goods transport. Again, they are barely viable in Europe where they can make it form one major centre to another on one charge (eg Berlin to Munich is c.500km) but simply can't do it on one charge between the major centres in Australia (c1000km).

Whatismore, if there was a sudden rush to EVs in Australia, the grid would collapse as unable to supply the electric power required.

Best to just sit back, let the US do what needs to be done (without our help which is an all-together different problem and error) and then wait for the oil prices to return to their low pre-war levels

"Going off track discourages people from posting here and getting involved. We already have a lack of a diversity of topics here, we cannot afford to make it worse."

I don't want that, I want you to say whatever you think.
But you can't control what other people say or do.

I can't control what you think or say, nor you me.
It's not a big jump from your issue 'rise in fuel prices and electric vehicles being an sensible alternative' to 'discussions of what caused the fuel crisis'.
Trying to police that is like trying to stop people from doing what humans do, is it not?

You can't control what others do, and there's a bigger lesson in that.
We can't control what the U.S. Israel or Iran do,
We can't even control what our own government do for that matter.
They were cheerleaders in the current fuel crisis themselves.
Their position doesn't make any sense.

They support the U.S. attack that assassinated their leader/s.
The supported those actions, and now they're issuing demands of how Iran should and shouldn't respond, when Iran stated in advance what it would do if attacked. 'We told you what would happen, but you tried to murder us all anyway, and are still actively trying'.

Dear Iran,
We tried to murder all your leaders but unfortunately some of you seem to have lived.
To the ones that lived we say 'Please don't mess with the oil exports, like we always mess with yours'
- But please know, we're still trying to kill you.

Many Thanks, Australia.

- Accept the reality of that that we can't control what others do or say in the big world, and worrying about what people do and do say on the forum because they're human and that's what humans do, and you might not get as frustrated with it.

There's bigger things to get frustrated about, is there not?

Un-Australian Trumpster!

Of course you would be supporting your made folk hero Donald, not satisfied with waging economic war on "friend" and foe, the madman is trying to set the world ablaze with his idiotic militarism! And YOU claimed this warmongering maniac should be given the Noble Peace Prize. Are YOU totally delusional? No need to answer, it bloody obvious!

Careful Paul. You'll upset Nathan if you keep trying to change the subject like that. I was writing about EV's in Australia and how inappropriate they are.

BTW, "And YOU claimed this warmongering maniac should be given the Noble Peace Prize."

Well I never claimed that. Just another piece of utter rubbish that you've conjured up. Indeed I hope he doesn't get it.

Trumpster,

I believe the Noble Peace Prize was a photo finish, and your man Trump got pipped on the post by Bibi Netanyahu. BUT, Donald did get a consultation prize, he took home the 'Idi Amin Memorial Humanitarian Award' to the thunderous applause of Pol Pot, Papa and Baby Doc,Saddam Hussein, Adolf Hitler, Benito Mussolini and of course you can't leave out that true humanitarian from such a celebration, good old Joe Stalin.

I suppose we shouldn't admonish you too much for simply fabricating claims and making up all sorts of rubbish. After all, without that, you'd have nothing to say.

Poor boy Donald had a big sad face.
Maria Machado gave him her Peace prize.

Just on electric cars,

Our niece in NZ has a Tesla, gets 2 hours a day free charge at home, but is required to buy kilometres of driving, I thinks its like $700 for 10,000km. Also the servicing on the Tesla is very expensive, and its always requiring new tyres for example. The original purchase price was about $60k I believe. I'm all for electric cars, but there has to be incentives for people to buy and operate them.

p/s They also have a 2nd little petrol car, for hubby to drive to work, about 20 minutes, with petrol over $3lt got himself an electric bike, great in the summer, but if you know the winters in NZ you might think twice about riding a bike to work.

Just came across this, modern fuel rationing using QR codes linked to vehicle rego
http://www.dailymirror.lk/breaking-news/Explainer-Sri-Lanka-Fuel-QR-Code-System-Complete-Guide-to-Register-Download-and-Fuel-Quotas/108-335342

Sri Lanka has implemented a QR Code-based National Fuel Authorization System for fuel distribution across the country, requiring vehicle owners to obtain a registered QR code before purchasing fuel from filling stations.
Under this system, fuel will not be issued from any filling station without a valid QR code linked to a registered vehicle.
The system is designed to manage fuel distribution during ongoing supply pressures and ensure that available fuel is allocated fairly among vehicle owners.

A relative has an MG4 electric car that he is very happy with.
He has a large number pf photocells and a couple of ex PMG lithium
batteries which he uses to charge his car.
He only ever charges it when home.
He is down the Sth Coast on a touring holiday at present and at most
motels he just uses his "granny" charger plugged into his motel room.
Had a phone call to say traffic on the road very light because of the
petrol situation. Some servos got pump not in use signs for some
grades.
EV drivers will be very happy chappies !

I wonder what they will do with fuel rationing.

I reckon if they are to do it, then it should be QR code matched to registration, which would make it a state managed thing with federal assistance and oversight.

I'd maybe give private vehicles a limit.
40 litres a week with the first 20 litres free of fuel excise and the second 20 litres double fuel excise..
So if you limit your usage to a minumum it costs less.

If people use less, the government gets a little less excise but the fuel gets shared around between everyone more.

Increase the limit for business vehicles depending on the usage.

If they make it a $ amount fuel limit people will be buying fuel, going home siphoning it out and then going back for more.

As Trump continues his war of aggression in the Middle East, cutting off fuel supplies to "friendly" Australia, China has come to our rescue, with the delivery of tanker loads of much need aviation fuel.

WHEN YOU HAVE A GREAT FRIEND LIKE AMERICA, WHO NEEDS ENEMIES!

As Trump thrashes about in his war of aggression, he has had the audacity to criticise "friendly" Australia for not getting involved in his murderous war. Other than a couple of NAZI style despots like Netanyahu, Trump has no friends!

Sooner are later if it continues all private use cars will be banned.
Re food, there was a plan in emergency planning that food would only
transported to the extremities of the electric train network.
There was still a lot of single decker red rattlers available at the
time and the seats were to be all removed and they would be loaded
by market agents to bring food such as fresh food to suburban stations
where is would be picked up by local supermarkets and green grocers.
The agents who travel on the train would handle the charging for food.

That was when the last petrol crisis was getting bad.
It all ended before it was implemented.
The plan is probably sitting in Emergency Management NSW office.

The below from Wikipedia Energy Density Matrix is interesting...

Material Specific energy(MJ/kg) EnergyDensity(MJ/L)

D+T (fusion) 337387388[69] Depends on conditions
Uranium 80620000[71] 1539842000
Thorium 79420000[71] 929214000
Petrol (Gasoline) 46.4 34.2
Aluminium 31.0 83.8
Ethanol 30 24
Magnesium 24.7 43.0
LiAirBattery 9.0[49]
Sodium sulfur battery 0.54–0.86
Lithium metal battery 1.8 4.32
Lithium-ion battery 0.36–0.875[52] 0.9–2.63

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density_Extended_Reference_Table

Note in the table above that ...
1. Lithium batteries are much lower energy density than
2. Petrol/ Aluminium Rocket Fuel and these are orders of magnitude lower in energy density than
3. Fission and Fusion.

So small modular reactors are much better than hydrocarbons in ships. With the difficulty in obtaining oil based fuels, and the increase in ship fuel and food prices, we should look at modular reactors for shipping that last as long as the ship.

The comments are more back on track, so I am coming back to discuss.

On the Insiders program over the weekend on the ABC it was acknowledged by the panelists including Greg Sheridan from the Australian, that Australia has failed dismally on the fuel matter and places like New Zealand have more backup supply in terms of fuel than places like Australia.

There has to be change made on those grounds alone. I can't believe it is that bad here. We have also had some State Governments virtually live in denial over the issue and ruling out free public transport to reduce stress in terms of the fuel market.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-03-30/sa-treasurer-says-free-public-transport-not-on-the-cards/106510092

This is despite many petrol stations running completely out of fuel, people panic buying and some hardware stores running out of jerry cans. In one case a person bought eight jerry cans at one time.

http://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/adelaide-breakfast/jerry-cans-sold/106510050

More people are buying electric vehicles at the moment as a principle, but we need to do more to encourage people to buy them. Maybe we should remove all taxes on them, to encourage people to purchase?

I have not heard a mention that tells us who will pay for the tank farms.
As it will be a government requirement and no mention of just where
they would be the government must pay.
Probably Sydney (Silverwater where the previous one was)
The pipelines from Botany are presumably still there.
Not a word from Albo about them unless mentioned in his Press Club
talk when I fell asleep.

The critical factors are battery storage cost, battery lifetime, and battery safety. Battery costs are predicted to fall by about 40% by 2030. Add to that lifetimes of over a million kilometres and safer chemistry, it is hard to see them not being taken up.

But when that happens there might also be a mass exodus from the electricity grid. I've heard speculation that the daily connection fee could rise to five dollars. I can't think of anything more satisfying than giving the finger to all those morons, traitors and con artists that have subjected the nation to the horrors of renewable energy.

Well Fester don't put too much hope in better battery chemistry.
A scientific group did a study of all the elements table and came to
the conclusion that we are now using the best combinations.
Take farm machinery I do not see much hope there for battery ploughing
machines, or harvesters etc etc. The power needed is really large.
I did see an article where mains power cables were suspended over
paddocks and farm machinery had pantagraphs to pick up the power.
However that was in the UK with much smaller paddocks.
The sag in the middle of a large paddock would be a major problem.

Hi Fester,

You rant against the facts by; "giving the finger to all those morons, traitors and con artists that have subjected the nation to the horrors of renewable energy." The debate is now over, with over 90% of new renewable projects providing more cost-effective electricity globally. Renewables offer lower, stable lifetime costs because they lack fuel expenses and their technology matures, whereas fossil fuels face volatile market prices. BUT YOU KNOW THAT, unfortunately you politicised the whole debate, believing that renewable energy is all a "commie plot".

"The debate is now over, with over 90% of new renewable projects providing more cost-effective electricity globally."

Repeating the lie of the con artists doesn't make it true. Why has Australia's mineral processing gone to coal burning Indonesia if your statement is true? You have been conned Paul, and Australia is being gutted economically and environmentally by the idiotic pursuit of net zero. The fuel crisis merely gives us a glimpse of where we are headed if the idiocy continues.

Bezza,

"A scientific group did a study of all the elements table and came to
the conclusion that we are now using the best combinations."

Yes, scientists regularly make stupid statements (as we all do). No one knows all. Things could change little or dramatically. That is the unpredictability of life.

https://interestingengineering.com/energy/3d-organic-polymer-battery-record-lifespan

Did you see the pictures of the lines of EV's at charging stations during Easter holidays? If it takes half an hour to charge one EV how long does it take to charge ten?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11580989/Tesla-owners-waiting-large-queue-charging-station-Wodonga-Victoria-NSW-border.html

"
Australian Tesla drivers have been forced to wait in 90-minute queues at charging stations as thousands take to the roads over the holiday period.

Queues for charging stations have been spotted nationwide, including in Victoria and NSW.

Members of a Facebook group called 'Tesla Owners Club UK' expressed their frustration at the queues.

One said: 'Someone taking the mick at Tebay? Been here over an hour. Still 15 in front of me in the queue for a charger. Easily another 2 hours to wait - minimum.'

A second added: 'We need more superchargers. I love Tesla, but this country is not up to standards if they want total electricity!'

A driver in Westmorland, north-west England, added: 'Two-hour 30-minute wait for a charge. Worst journey as (a) Tesla driver. Q now 40 deep!'

At an unknown charging location, a Twitter user said: 'UK services this week have been insanely busy for Tesla charging, currently car 15 in a queue of over 20 ... but you can always rely on the British public to make an orderly queue.'
"

http://www.drive.com.au/caradvice/electric-car-charger-wait-times-australia/

Calem, there have been in existence for some time systems either in
cars or in chargers to enable the owner to preset a charge level where
the charger or car will call the owner on his mobile phone to notify
the preset charge level is reached.
I do not know which chargers or cars have this facility but I read about
it a long time back in UK. It should be a standard fitting.
My son went down the St Coast all the way to Victoria and back a week
before Easter and had no problems with chargers. Different at Easter
I presume.
My son always leaves home with a fully charged car (@ zero cost) and
if needed only charges enough to get home.
A whole new protocol & practice will learnt by drivers.

I saw a video the other day, a big queue of people waiting hours over Easter to use EV chargers, it seems many bought their electric car decided to go out on a nice Easter road trip, and they all found out that there's just not enough charging stations to charge their vehicles.

'Not a great situation’: EV queues surge over Easter during Australia’s fuel crisis
http://youtu.be/Vh9r5D_lhFw

Hi AC,

The niece in NZ with her Tesla gets 2 hours free charging from home, (Hamilton) I think from 9pm to 11pm. There were, maybe still is, free government slow charging stations. The down side is they have to pay a fee for Km's I think something like $700 for 10,000km.

Here's one, the niece was at a free station, 2 outlets the only one "waiting" in the parking area, one car left so she hooked up, (most people disappear while their car charges, I think 45 minutes) the other car had charged but the owner hadn't returned. This guy comes running from Meccas across the street, abuses the niece, saying "I'm next!" well you can't do that, you should be with your car in the waiting bays, his car was at Macca's or on the street, whatever."

Bezza- Thanks for the information on the phone app. But I don't think I would buy an EV. I can't see the benefits in the package of technologies. I think that rocket fuel such as Al + Air + recycling + electric motors is a better more sustainable technology for less weight, but given the anti-innovation policies of western governments that isn't going to happen either, until they get desperate enough. In the past they seemingly let people do amazing things with their cars, but now there seems to be red and green tape everywhere, then they wonder why we can't solve simple problems anymore. The IT industry expanded exponentially when they created open architectures. I suspect the same was true for automobiles, aeroplanes, etc. Woke-ism creates scarcity because it believes in equality over excellence. Excellence can be dangerous, but it's also dangerous not to have it.

My understanding is that if you come to charger with a Que and you
do not have enough to reach the next charger and there is a que on
this charger you only charge enough to get home or to the next
charger which may not have a que.
Not a very good solution but it averages out the delays.
Use apps that list chargers not only on the main roads.
It will eventually be one of those things that Granpa talks about.