The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Discrimination study > Comments

Discrimination study : Comments

By Andrew Leigh, published 19/1/2010

Three experiments were undertaken to gauge racial and ethnic discrimination in Australia.

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. All
I must confess I find your results underwhelming, Mr Leigh; they seem to indicate underlying and perhaps even some degree of unconscious prejudice or filtering going on--and/or, of course, blatant non-compliance with that sacred secular dictum we all hold dear, "non-discrimination". Shock horror!
Anecdotal evidence is of course not something measurable, but in my experience racism, and other prejudices, are widespread and commonly spiteful (maybe I just hang around with a rough crowd?). Protestations of the opposite, often from political figures, that Australia is all-embracing, or "tolerant" at worst, are politically correct spin--or tourism advertising. Appearances are everything--quite literally--or at least "politique".
Racial prejudice is no doubt an education issue primarily, but the tertiary enlightened--and political rhetoricians--are hardly representative; I doubt they'd even qualify as "Australian" in the popular/political sense.
So I'll trump your notion, Andrew, of a "redneck Brissie", with my notion that it's Australia wide! with honourable, though "unAustralian", exceptions :-)
Posted by Mitchell, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 11:00:47 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
This study clearly demonstrates that the policy of multiculturalism in Australia has failed and if the Austrtalian Labor Party continues to pursue this policy as resources like oil, water and food become more scarce - then racial, religious and ethnic tension will continue to rise making Australia ungovernable.
Posted by TRUTHNOW78, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 11:16:12 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Try applying for a job with the national broadcasters. It seems being a feminist, homosexual, socialist or ethnic is a pre requisite or at least will help you get the job.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 12:34:03 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Recently I was employed in an Australian hospital, recruiting pregnant women for a clinical study with the aim of improving the health of the mother and baby. My job was to basically call the ladies names who were waiting for their appointment, and then briefly speak to them regarding the study.

This hospital has patients from range of races/ethnic groups. However, I had some trouble in the pronunciation of many of the chinese and indian names, while I was fine with the european/anglo names. This lead me to speak to many more Anglo women than those of other backgrounds.

Now obviously this does not make me a racist, however, If I was an employer, would you say this is discrimination?
Posted by Stezza, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 12:46:46 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
How hard is it to say Lee, Chan, Singh or Gupta?
Posted by David Jennings, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 12:52:24 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
There has never been a shortage of people wanting to ‘prove’ that Australia is a ‘discriminatory’ country, a ‘racist’ country.

Unfortunately and disturbingly, many of the culprits are themselves Australia. They totally overlook the fact that ‘dreadful’ Australia allows people to rubbish it, even those people who we are supposed to be discriminating against. If Australia was as bad as they claim, they would have been in strife long ago, and they would not be advertising what they found in ‘studies’ which rarely prove anything anyway.

Another thing they overlook is that thousands of people are busily trying to get to Australia to live, legally and illegally. When they have been here for a while, they then busily try to get all the relatives here. As most of these people nowadays are of totally different culture, colour and are non-English speaking, why are they coming here to be discriminated against?

As usual, the Anglo-Australians are the bad guys. There was, it seems, no study on how Bill Smith, 7th. Generation Australian would get along if he tried to get a job at a Chinese restaurant or even an Italian, Greek or other ‘ethic’ workplace, when there is a firm tradition of keeping everything in the family or the particular ethnic group.

As an aside, I would be interested to know how “Gabriella Hannah, formerly Ragda Ali” got two years experience in the type of job she was after, but was knocked back 30 times for the same work until she changed here name. And, as for the “return to sender” experiment, I find that very hard to believe. It doesn’t stretch the imagination all that much to suspect that the “48-49% per cent of letters” not returned fell into the hands of people who have no patience with others who can’t get addresses right.

And the fact that Italian-Australians, whom nobody even thinks of as migrants these days, are being lumped in with Asians and Middle Easterners makes the whole thing suspect. Anyone having a problem with Italian - Australians died long ago.

........
Posted by Leigh, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 3:40:11 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
..........

As for the jobseekers who couldn’t get jobs, there was recently a TV programme about this and, although technically qualified, the complainants could not speak decipherable English. From medicine to the service industries, they were the same. Who want’s to employ someone to deal with people when they cannot speak the only official language of the country?

Don’t blame Australia or Australians. Blame the politicians and their rampant multiculturalism, their stupid carelessness in type of people allowed to immigrate, and their unforgivable conning of immigrants who were led to believe that they would have no problems getting work. Also blame the nitwits who cry ‘discrimination’ if anyone dares to demand proficiency in English as a prerequisite for settling in Australia.

Employers will employ people they want, not those the social engineers think they should employ. And, yes, there will be some discrimination; anyone who doesn’t expect that has to be as naïve as a new-born baby. People are generally more comfortable with their own kind, no matter what country they live in - fact of life, Get over it.
Posted by Leigh, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 3:41:22 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Leigh,Mafia ?
Posted by bully, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 3:55:50 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Discrimination in employment? The elephant in the room would have to be old people, where 'old' means anyone over thirty-five. State and federal public services do no better in this respect than the private sector.
Posted by Cornflower, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 6:29:11 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
There is nothing revolutionary in the comments made but it’s a subtle truth of what is happening in the Australian job market at the moment. I am a manager of a successful technology firm. I regularly get CV’s that pass my desk that contain Islamic and Asian names. I have first hand knowledge of HR and Senior managers passing on names that end with an Islamic or Asian twist.

It’s the sign of the times that have caused this situation. Australia is not uniquely racist on the matter and the facts back it up by the author.

I myself am of Indian decent but have been raised and bred in Australia. This country is my home and I know of no other country that adore more than this one. I have travelled and worked abroad and have seen similar attitudes in hiring practices.
I would suggest those on the receiving end of this discrimination to ensure that communication via your CV is clear and concise. Don’t give anyone a reason to question your intelligence and competence.
Posted by NoSoupForYou, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 7:48:01 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Multicultural has failed, we should deport all rednecks/ racists to an offshore island somewhere. They just don' seem to get it - and we should not spend a cent more trying to educate them about the wonderful benefits of many cultures. Their hate is rusted on hate - its just a waste of time. Get rid of them now! They don't like it so they should just leave!
Posted by Rainier, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 11:01:53 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Australia is probably one of the least racist countries I have visited with the possible exception of Sweden (although that may have changed).

However, there are racists in all countries even if they are in the minority. I don't suspect Mr Leigh's experiments but I would wonder what the results would have been if the tests were Australia-wide. We all make judgements subconsciously or consciously about other people.

Years ago when I worked in HR and recruitment I must admit when I read a CV with a non-Anglo name I would look more closely at the resume to ascertain education and how long in Australia etc mainly because I acted on behalf of my employer and jobs which required very good English. It was just not possible to even positively discriminate in favour of migrants if English was not up to par in the sorts of roles we were recruiting. This would be the same whether the person was Chinese, Middle Eastern or broad Scots or Jordy.

Perhaps there is an assumption which needs to be actively suppressed in us all not to assume that a non-Anglo named person necessarily has poor English, or at least to give that person an interview and a chance.

I once tried my own experiment with government agencies. Generally I get an interview for every job I apply for - mainly because I know which jobs are most suited to my skills and experience. However, if on the application form I mention a disability (despite the fact it has no bearing on work performance) offers of interviews dry up. This is despite the government's lip service policy to promote the hiring of disabled people. This years reports show that the government figures have dropped in relation to the number of people hired with disability.
Posted by pelican, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 8:21:45 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Rainier - amen to that.
I think multiculturalism has worked for most of us. But I am sick of explaining to rednecks and boofheads why racism is wrong. If they are too dumb to get it they should be asked to find another country. Whether they are 7th or 8th generation Aussies it doesn't matter. They have to contribute positively to this country. The rednecks should realise that they can't tell the immigrants to fit in etc when they themselves are being disruptive. The rednecks should fit in or leave.
Posted by Lucy Montgomery, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 10:22:39 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Lucy, Ok so whats your definition of redneck? Low income, low education.

I have seen this type of discrimination by senior executives, CEO’s, senior managers etc. They have all travelled and been exposed to greater things than a VB stubbie.

What I am saying is that discrimination does not occupy one particular group. Prejudice always has and always will exist. You will never change people’s minds on that. You might expose there flawed thinking but the core of what they think will be the same.
Posted by NoSoupForYou, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 11:05:21 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Maybe those people who are now senior executives, CEOs and senior managers were bogans to begin with, but they would have got access to a university education, and a free education at that, in the 1980s courtesy of the tax payer, and many of those tax payers would have been migrants.

But they will always be ingrates.
Posted by David Jennings, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 4:05:49 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
First.

It is a male world. Preferable age 30.

After that there is discrimination on language, sex, age, weight, accent, appearance, teeth quality, even home address.

Clone only need apply. Suit, no outward sign of any cultural affiliation or personality acceptable.

I go for job interview. There is Australian born Chinese male applying for the position. Does clone well.

I am middle aged female with far too many ideas and opinions.

They will employ the Australian born Chinese male.

Same Australian born Chinese male applies for another position. White male, healthy, one of the boys, is his opposition.

White male gets the job.

Aussie Chinese male applies for another job and is up against a chain smoking over weight white male aged 40.

Australian chinese gets the job.

Growing trend.
Due to over play of race card some employers are refusing to employ migrants from fear of being sued for racism. They fear if the employee has poor job performance and needs to be let go they will cry racist. Fear of being called racist, especially seeing such vague things like offering people chicken is racist.

Growing number of complaints.
Some recent migrants lack cultural awareness when dealing with the public and cause offense usually by being too pushy, invasion of privacy and also lack of language skills. May see drop in telephone related employment opportunities. There is also some employers wary of employing white South African males due levels of complaints of bullying and arrogance, so not all racial at all. Culture is the key.

On returned mail. Well not too bad considering most mail for people who have left address is for people with foreign names. So perhaps people get fed up being a mail forwarding service.

Summary, The corporate sector especially favours Australian born male aged 30-33 give or take a few years. The corporate culture is ideally attained by following the pathway of the Australian education system that brainwashes people to be wage slaves of capitalism.

So to measure true discrimination one should only measure men born 1975-1980.

It is a system compliance issue.
Posted by TheMissus, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 5:01:40 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Oh no... she's back!
Posted by David Jennings, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 5:33:57 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Yes back. Not sure why they bother with these studies, they should just ask me. :)
Posted by TheMissus, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 5:54:20 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
David, education is not always an answer to racism. Don't confuse wisdom with education.
Posted by NoSoupForYou, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 8:40:48 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
The Missus you seem to have a huge chip on your shoulder about employment. Do you think that you have been discriminated against?
Posted by Lucy Montgomery, Thursday, 21 January 2010 6:36:44 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
I do not believe we are a racist country. Along with most other countries, we have a number of racist within our community. Our laws are frame to discourage racism.
Posted by Flo, Thursday, 21 January 2010 9:40:01 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
NoSoupForYou,
wisdom is a myth, a conceit. It doesn't actually exist.
Posted by Mitchell, Thursday, 21 January 2010 6:24:46 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Am I racist?

Hypothetical:

I don't like the people on one side of me because he has a yappy dog, reves his car engine & does burnouts on my front lawn & plays head banging music loud all night. They are white.

I don't like the people on the other side of my because they are filthy unhygenic people who with all their rellies are always drunk & fighting. they are Aboriginal.

I voice my opinion to them, to them. I am accused of being racist.

What is your opinion. Am I racist. I'm Asian or Anglo-Saxon Australian.

This IS a hypothetical.

I just think that is someone of one race has an altercation with someone of another race then race hatred isn't always the answer. It's individual "dislike," for the want of a better word. But that's only my opinion. Some Politically Correct persons may have a different view. God bless 'em.
Posted by Jayb, Tuesday, 26 January 2010 1:29:57 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy