Tim,

I am actually interested in something else, rather than what you experienced.

You have an Asian-Australian bride, as do apparently a rapidly increasing amount of other White Anglo Saxon men.

Who is going to marry the White Anglo Saxon Woman? It won't be the Asian man.

This is creating a social timb bomb in my opinion for both of these 'left out' groups. This is a far more serious problem than some yahoo's on a train.

Savvas, I can't say that I consider sociological timebombs in my relationships.

Tim, bad luck, but if you travel by public transport that's the risk you face in Australia. It's not pretty and it is not acceptable to many of us but it is to our government and the courts.

The tolerence of our legal system, the civil liberties groups, the judges and magistrates, not the police, they have to suffer in silence as well.

These offensive people have no fear of repurcussions, they know they will not suffer any consequence, so in effect, the system rewards and reinforces bad behaviour.

Our government in Victoria is making it a crime to speak out as you have done, and incite the community against any other part of the community, but it's OK with people being threatened by thugs and bullies.

One way to stop this, make sure your local member knows and if he doesn't do anything except smarmy letters to you - go check what the opposition is doing, maybe they might get the message this could be an issue.

Some people wonder why Australians don't want to travel by public transport, and stick to driving their cars - you make the perfect case for this - in my car, I am safer than being exposed to random violence on the street or public transport.

I would not expect you to have considered this. For all I know, and I expect, your relationship is ideal.

And as a one off situation, or even as a mild trend, it would not be a problem.

But think about the consequences of what appears to be happening, not for you, but for those that have missed out.

Great article, Tim Watts - I particularly like your practical suggestions for action by ordinary people against this blight on Melbourne's social landscape. I'll be joining your Facebook group today and publicising it among my friends, particularly those in Melbourne.

If our relevant authorities are unwilling to recognise a problem that clearly exists, then the kinds of community action that you suggest are well and truly warranted.

Your articles assumes only minorities are targets and this is the grave msitake. We need to drop the word minority all together. Many of these areas there is no minority.

Recent attacks on Indians has been in the main by minorities.

Anyways I was in Sydney for much of the 90's and the race hate crime was rampant, I could not believe it and I was forced out, never will return to that dump.

Who was racist to who? You name it. I was in one suburb at noon and two groups of ethnic school kids were in the main shopping centre chasing each other down with machetes! there were kids lying everywhere oozing blood.

At least you got on the train. A couple of times I had to let trains go by as they had been taken over by ethnic gangs.

Then of course the hate mail I received suggesting my kids were going to get killed and all skips will be driven out. Police were not interested and we were all labelled racist for being afraid. Xenophobia they called it lol. Anyways we all know the outcome of police and government not acting on that crime spree. Cronulla Riot anyone?

Anyway the trains became populated by Nazi transit officers. So go from ethnic thugs to legalised thugs. Still stressful riding trains and may are being driven from their own cities to escape this dysfunction.

In Brisbane Pacific Islander are targeting Indigenous Australians.

Sinhalese and tamils, they fight each other. Croatians and Serbs. Sexist against white women. In fact I think white women take more anyone but women are not as important as race relations.

Indian students seem to like sex crimes, pedophilia and rape charges and also scams, I guess sexist is not as important as racist.

We need to admit multi-culturaism simply does not work. FAIL.

I was 100% for it. I apologise to Australia for being the generation that forced this social experiment on you.

Integration policy, although not racial did emphasise cultural fit. We should have stuck with that policy.

Tim it is sickening to hear of your experience. I have no doubt it is a regular event in our secular society. We are becoming more and more selfish and it is being encouraged by pathetic judges who rarely give out punishment that fits the crime. It actually starts with pathetically weak parenting where children receive little to no discipline and rarely receive consequences for bullying and bad behaviour. We have lost our moral compass as we have departed from Christian values. I also have no doubt that such bullies would do the same if the victims were African (if they were smaller) or even elderly people.

I hope you achieve some good in your quest other than raise up another group of people with victim mentalities. We already have enough of those and generally they end up feeling justified in causing more trouble than what has come to them. Hopefully one day we will vote in a Government who is willing to listen to the people of Australia rather than suck up to the failed dogmas of the UN.

runner makes a good point. We have become too lenient in the Courts. All nations are racist to some extent some moreso than others. I think Australia is pretty good by comparison based on my travels.

I would be wary of using a dishevelled person (begging for money) and a skinhead as indicative of the average Australian. Most people I know are not racist and get a bit tired of the casual accusations of a racist Australia bandied about lately. And the potential, as runner pointed out, of a growing victim mentality.

I think we become defensive (I do) when the implications are that it is white anglo/European Australians alone that are guilty of racism and the attacks against Indian students (for example) when it has been clearly shown that a large majority of these attacks are from other minorities with their own set of problems and issues.

The experience you had on the train was I imagine more than just unpleasant.

The map idea sounds good but it could be misused. How many attacks have to occur before an area is blacklisted and how does one prove it was racially based? Wouldn't it be better to highlight danger areas in terms of the growing trend of violence against all innocent victims regardless of race.

As for the police. Police have to go by the evidence they cannot just make an unubustantiated statement about racial motivations if the evidence does not support it. If there is evidence that attacks are racially based then they must be dealt with and perhaps more education is needed about what it means to be a secular and multicultural nation. Minority groups that may not embrace secularism may need more education about our system of justice, the Constitution and the division of State and Church.

Best of happiness with upcoming nuptials.

Tim, this is a great article and I applaud you for taking a stance. I'll try and help in anyway that I can. I think you speak for the moral majority in this country of every race who are sick and tired of being hassled or seeing the appalling behaviour of thugs, hooligans and low-lifes. We need to take a stand of those people - who really are life's losers - will take over our country.

Savvas, Tim and any other person in this country can marry whoever they like from whatever ethnic group they like. I'm sure that most of the Anglo-Australian girls will get married too .... relax champ, is something on your mind?! ;-) Just kidding.

The Missus, do you actually have any evidence to back up those claims? particularly the one about the shopping mall? The Bosnians, Serbs and Croats issue was understandable given the intensity of the civil war in the 1990's. Ditto the Sinhalese and Tamils ... in fact during the 25 year civil war the only major clash if that was a few isolated incidents in Australia at the time the war ended. Otherwise the vast majority of the people from these ethnic groups are
upstanding Australians. I emphasise the fact that they are Australians. Again, deal with it or move on.

Also, the"ethnic" train guards were mostly older Sikh, Anglo, or other Indian guys in Sydney. I doubt that many or any of these men were ever involved in any youth violence?!

Tim, don't feel bad about saying nothing. I did the same thing when a group of similar trash were grafitting a train. Only one old lady complained. The rest of the carriage was too scared to intervene

The first character in Tim Watt’s story was an unpleasant and ignorant character. So was the person who opined that ““I hate how this (I had to remove the profanity, Tim did not racist this country is sometimes”.

To deal with the first one: how dare he ask strangers for money but, more importantly, how dare he harass a group of Asians for not speaking English; they could have been tourists without any English. My wife and I, both mono-lingual, have never been insulted in such a way using public transport as tourists in a non-English speaking country.

The second person made an utterance about “this racist country”. How dare he or she decide that Australia is a ‘racist country’ just because of one lout, and another who agreed with him, in one instance?

Tim Watts himself is not much chop, either. Having identified himself as someone who claims to be “…“not backwards in coming forwards”, he was too frightened to do anything about the harassment: he sat “fuming” next to his Asian fiancée. What a hero she must seem in her eyes! Of course, his really wanting to call someone a (name I had to remove as a profanity even though it was a quote from Tim's article) probably wouldn’t be the right way to about putting the aggressor in his place and protecting the victims. Rightly, he thought he might get his head punched by calling such a nasty person a (the same name again)

Had he acted properly, Tim might have found he could influence the boofhead by not being and thinking as aggressively as the boofhead.

The only person who came out looking good in this situation was the woman who hugged the crying girl.

The writer goes on to blame the police and everybody else for racist attacks. But, what right does Tim have to do this, when he could have done something about the particular instance that he reports, but didn’t?

Don’t tell other people what to do Tim, unless you are prepared to do your bit.

Leigh, I've been around situations on trains where I've wanted to speak up but all things considered silence at the time seemed the lesser evil. Situation's which at the time were verbal but which appeared to have the potential to quickly become physical. Silence can deny the aggressor the "justification" they need to take it to the next level.

I'm left with mixed feelings from those experiences. I'd feel better about myself if I'd stood up to be counted but am also left with the knowledge that doing so could easily have added to the problem and would be unlikely to have changed the attitudes of the aggressors.

I think that if it ever came to the situation where physical violence was occurring I'd step up but I while it remains verbal it's not such a clear call. I don't want to be the one who gives someone the excuse they feel they need.

The situation's I've seen have generally involved alcohol or what appears to be mental illness. Some have have a clear racial element but those have been from people who appear to be from minority racial groups expressing views about others from different racial groups and have as far as I could tell involved alcohol. All have had the appearance of social and economic disadvantage being a significant factor.

R0bert

David

I never said the transit police were ethnic. They were mainly white or closer enough to it. Not the issue if you can read at all. Like Singapore, when you have cultural clashes day in, day out you need to become a police state to deal with that. Sydney has become very much over policed. As someone who was there in the 80's and then again late 90's early 2000 is is glaringly obvious the town has sunk.

And no I will not simply get over it, same as the Indian students who have faced the same dysfunction in our suburbs are not going to simply get over it. Same as the girls on the Camberwell train will probably not simply just get over it. Who does it make happy? Nobody. The immigrants who are a cultural fit will obviously contribute a lot more but more importantly be far happier in their lives because of it. Australians already present will have fewer cultural clashes.

Saying just get over is mindless and intellectualy barren. People simply do not just get over it. Perhaps you shoud get over thinking we are a nice rosy tolerant society. How much proof is required?, I it s not he case.

The wealthy like it because they are quarantined from it and make money from it. People in lower socio-economic circumtsance undergo the greatest upheavel for not only zero economic benefit but need to compete for job that are often, almost usually under legal rates. Normal night rate I would say could be $8/hr. Then the rich do not even tip! Oh no we paying a living wage in Australia, we do not have to tip. Really people live in la la land and perhaps they should get over that!

Tim,
It's been a long time since I traveled on Victorian railways. However don't the trains have cameras? they do in other states

Being a bit of a don Quixote, my response would to have gotten my mobile out and dialed the railway security and said out loud,

" the duty sergeant please....... sergeant My name is John MacIlwraith (made up name) I've just down loaded a video of an young man panhandling and then assaulting some Asian passengers.....have you received it?...... and the sound? good. I'm currently on the X line between Y&Z station, if it continues, I'll call into your offices and fill out the statement for prosecution later to day.... Right sergeant... got that... I'm sure the train's camera will confirm the actions. Thank you"

We had a not dissimilar situation like that interstate only there were 3 of us that "made" phone calls. At the next station you should have seen the 4 trouble makers move once the train stopped....scalded cats come to mind.

As it happened they were later apprehended.

PS. Congratulation Tim on your up coming nuptials

The Missus - I've lived and worked in Singapore. It doesn't have cultural clashes every day. No more than any other place.

A lot of the claims you've made in your posts aren't verifiable. Where is your evidence that race hate crime was "rampant" in the 1990s? Where is your evidence that the attacks on Indians are mainly by "ethnics"? You also claim, "Indian students seem to like sex crimes, pedophilia and rape charges and also scams." This is outrageous, no sane person would write that. Again, theres no evidence to support it. Absurd claims without evidence do not make for a rational argument.

Get over it and get help. And why should the "rich" have to tip for using public transport. Its public .... everybody pays the same rate!

Dear Tim, why exactly is "racially motivated violence .. worse than other forms of violence in our community"?

I would hope that all forms of violence were acted against by our police force and our courts and not ranked in some sort of hierarchy due to who the victim is.

Congratulations Tim,
I was appalled at the police response to the effect the stabbing death of the Indian Student was not racially motivated.
I am concerned at the increase in violence generally, but I believe it is the duty of our representative governments to take action to apprehend and express intolerance towards such acts, particularly on Public transport where inspectors have been removed in the interests of saving money but to the detriment of public safety. I will support your call and post it on my profile to promulgate the move to map the violence.
Keep up the good work.

Tim a sad but true every day thing, but more of us are offended than not.
The first post in comments? almost see that poster as being one of the two on that train.
Never ever give in.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but...

Isn't the anti-Indian violence almost entirely committed by Muslims?

Indians are usually Hindu, and Muslims consider Hinduism another enemy... Pakistan was seperated from India because of this religious schism.

Isn't this anti indian violence the result of one migrant group bringing their hatred and violence of another people to Australia?

partimeparent - I haven't heard that, I kind of doubt it really since it is very difficult to tell someone's religion by looking at them, well it is for me

Nothing will be achieved until there is some truth and honesty in this debate. Until perpetrators are caught and motivations ascertained, it is a waste of time to speculate on any one particular act of violence.

As far as India is concerned, the Government just needs to reassure India that the investigation is being carried out and all is being done to bring the criminals to account.

David,. Multi –cultures you often require a police state to deal with it. Singapore is an example of this and why they DON’T have clashes everyday.

No, we should never understand why people bring their hate from historic conflicts. We should not have to tolerate it at all. Zero tolerance. Some come to escape this brutality and we just accept it? Too bad? Get over it?

Indian Students riot due to ethnic gangs targeting them in Harris Park in Sydney , the same ethnic gangs whose reign of terror sparked the Cronulla riots. People do not riot of they feel justice is served and the state protects them. Denial is the reasons these riots occurred. Denial.

Part time parent is correct. Much of the violence has been by minorities. Why? Imported historic conflicts or prejudices? That could be the case but denial only increases fear. Only a few race related attacks instils fear in many.

Ethnic leaders demanded race not be publicly known when these types of attacks occur because it damages the image of their group. This is wrong. It does not create vilification of an entire ethnic community, it is denial that creates frenzy and the outright vilification of a race. When the attacks first were reported the prejudiced and racist people simply decided it was white subjecting them to racial vilification on a horrific scale. Only white can be Australian according to many – racist! Nice try but the world has shown how prejudice it is to make such an assumption. So apparently anglo also started to resent Indians. Prejudice breeds prejudice.. Circles start when issues are denied!

It is so easy. If a victim claims any sort of hate crime against them then the victim should have the protection of the state and the police. Trying playing denial games, you get riots.

Nobody seems to understand this concept so we should deem multi-cultural policy a failure. It is clear we have a problem. Cannot find anywhere on earth where this utopia exists. We are reminded daily it does not work. Why deny it.

"Indian students seem to like sex crimes, paedophilia and rape charges and also scams."
Your reply - This is outrageous, no sane person would write that.

A women gets abused on the train by a yobbo and it is terrible yet a child gets sexually molested but no sane person would write about that? Why not? Are we not supposed to be against victimisation? Or not? A whole article is submitted based on the action of one person who has not been charged, no verifiable facts and indicator of little, yet children are sexually molested by non-whites so hush? The race is important than the child?

Why I wrote it. I knew if I were to get a sane response I would never need to write it. A victim is a victim and only a victim has rights. If we start selecting who are victims based on race then we are being racist.

The crimes that happened in Sydney were denied over and over. If they had been taken seriously then perhaps the Indians students would never had to relive the same set of circumstances by the same ethnic thugs. By the way plenty of proof, easy to locate. As a result a Middle Eastern specialised crime unit was established ... too late. If only people listened to the truth rather than what they wanted to hear.

We take sex crimes seriously, people are charged, no hysteria, or rarely. We treat racism like the Olympic Games, over analyse, ignore in some, accuse others but never ourselves, people make money trying to find it to keep themselves in work. It is like a mental illness. Google - Is Canada more racist than the US, or - Is the US more racist than Europe. It is sickness. The only answer is call a spade a spade. When everyone discovers that there are bad apples in every batch then, and only then, will people move on. Like sex attacks are treated. People accept some are dysfunctional, but not all, so why people keep trying to prove that is simply hate on their part.

The Missus

You can't seem to substantiate any of your claims. Do you have any links to any new stories backing up your claim about Indian students?? You have also smeared a rather large group of people with some very unsavoury remarks. And how do you know that the "ethnic" gangs identified at Harris Park are the same people as those who created disturbances at Cronulla prior to the 2005 riot? Where is your evidence?

Can you actually prove that Singapore is a police state? Have you ever lived there?? And what about the US, Canada and the UK? For the vast majority of people other than a very small group of extremists, multiculturalism is perfectly fine. None of these countries are police states. Though you could say that Nazi Germany, which was definitely not pro-multiculturalism, was a police state.

I would think that Tim's story is true because (a) he put his REAL NAME to the story and (b) his fiancee and other witnesses can verify his story. That is the crucial difference between his quite excellent article, and your somewhat wild and florid claims.

David Jennings, it is apologists like you which have given some of the curs we are supposed to embrace under multiculturalism, the encouragement they need to become the problem we now have.

Here's a fact.

My son was attacked by a group of 4 "lebs" yesterday afternoon, in broad daylight, as he walked home alone, from Hurstville railway station. Being well trained, he had taken one out, & had another loosing interest, when he was hit across the side of the head, with a lump of timber, probably a 4X2.

He was on the ground, & had taken a couple of kicks, when a couple of cars stopped, & 2 REAL ozies got out of them. Not liking these odds, the curs fled.

My son now has no feeling, taste, of smell on that side, & the doctors have said that will "probably" return in a few days, or months. Great hay!

The cops have said, "don't expect to hear from them" as the car they fled in was too far away for anyone to get the number. The number may not have helped, as they also said that the cars these ethnic gangs use, generally have false plates.

So David, until you you live close enough [say 10K] to one of the areas infested by this scum, to know what you're talking about, your pontificating is just so much hot air.

Phil West

Phil, whilst I'm very sorry about what happened to your son, I think you're missing the point. The boys who attacked your son don't represent multiculturalism - they're just thugs.

What bugs me is how people can conflate violent crime committed by youths of "ethnic" descent with multiculturalism. Where exactly in Lebanese culture is street violence condoned?

What about all the other law-abiding people of a variety of ethnic and other cultural backgrounds who live decent lives. Why should their right to live in a pluralistic society be threatened because some people don't like multiculturalism (and almost by necessary definition ... multiracialism).

And for the record I've known a lot of decent Lebanese guys who have held down good jobs, worked hard and obeyed the law all their lives. Why should these guys be smeared by anti-Lebanese sentiments that emerge from the actions of a fairly small group of people. After all, there are over 70,000 people of Lebanese descent in Australia.

Hasbeen

Sorry to hear about your son. Be sure this won't be considered racist. If the boot was on the other foot the ABC would have it as a lead story inferring racism.

David, go to Brighton, Sydney, alone. Park your car, & wander into a shop. Try to have a meal, or a cup of coffee.

Then repeat the same post.

Take your crash helmet, because about 50,000, of those 70,000 live around there, & they are mostly thugs.

Then try around Logan, in Qld. Different race, same result, just not so masny of them, yet.

Once these people know they are on the no penalty list, with out courts, the sky's the limit for them.

But, remember, as the saying goes, be careful out there.

Hasbeen, it's everywhere.

My pre-school teacher has an adult son with permanent brain-damage from being beaten-up in his (my) home town. Despite knowing exactly who and when, and all of them being able to pass muster as "white", they got such lenient sentences as to be risible, by them, in court.

Their right wing "charismatic" pastor spoke emotively on their behalf.

Your son did the right thing, made it expensive to attack him. I just wish my old teacher's son had had similar training. Pastor might have had hospital visits instead.

Oddly enough, when I moved to the city, in the very parts of town considered "rough" I felt safe, and have never been bothered, except by a drunk twenty-something in a bar.

Rusty.

'Their right wing "charismatic" pastor spoke emotively on their behalf.'

no doubt the secular judge went light on the offenders

Having worked in the law i've seen and its been said a lot that white defendants get treated more leniently than Aboriginal defendants in criminal cases. So Hasbeen what does that prove?

David
“And for the record I've known a lot of decent Lebanese guys who have held down good jobs, worked hard and obeyed the law all their lives. Why should these guys be smeared by anti-Lebanese sentiments that emerge from the actions of a fairly small group of people”

I agree 100%. It should never have got that far but it did because ....DENIAL. Yet you support a repeat of that.

Here is an attempt to start a witch hunt based on one person and you agree with article author! Make up your mind.

Your quote : who really are life's losers - will take over our country.”

Take over the country? I find majority all people hold down good jobs, work hard and obey law, not only Lebanese.? True?

So this one homeless, mentally unsound social outcast is representative of Australians and these ferals are going to over run the country soon – hysterical much?

I see no need to reprint what already has been said, done and dusted and I certainly do not mean it to be inflammatory but seems everyone is having a field day irregardless so for defence rather than vilification..

“The journalists, academics, legal brains and politicians who tried to claim last August that the gang rapes of south-western Sydney were just a run-of-the-mill police blotter story being beaten up by racists, scaremongers and political opportunists don't ever want to acknowledge the truth about that ugly episode in Australian history. They don't want to acknowledge the fear and tension that ran through a part of Sydney they rarely visit and can never understand. “
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/07/13/1026185124700.html

I have never been so disgusted in my life and yet still denial from some. Everyone trying to shout for justice and protection screamed down as racist, xenophobic and evil while their children hosed down in between rape sessions. I will never forgive Australia for that. Never!

That was a crime against humanity.

Where is the train trip symbolism for these crimes?

continued

Quote Indian Student Website

“Indian students must remeber Australians of Anglo Saxon backgrounds aren't perpetrating the violence and therefore not slander them which only increases the negative perceptions of the Indian community.”
http://www.fisa.org.au/content/safety
How prophetic!

Arrested for race hate crime against Indian Students.
A gang of racist youths nearly killed a man during an armed rampage in an Indian grocery store in Melbourne's west for the "sheer thrill" of the attack, a judge said today...Hussien described : The court heard he had migrated to Australia from Somalia, aged about six, with his older brother and mother, who were both later diagnosed with bipolar disorder.
http://www.theage.com.au/national/man-jailed-over-racist-attack-on-indian-student-20091023-hcnr.html

Indians Say Lebanese behind Race Attacks

SYDNEY: Indian students on Thursday alleged that Lebanese youths were behind the attacks on them here as they took to streets for the third consecutive night protesting against racial attacks.

The spate of racial attacks against Indians spread to Sydney after members of the community were targeted in Melbourne.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indians-in-Australia-say-Lebanese-behind-race-attacks/articleshow/4646950.cms

Article author wants the police to protect minorities, perhaps that is what they are doing. Ethnic leaders have requested race not be disclosed when an offender is born in Australia. They have complied. They want to suppress details of crimes to protect minorities. By tracking down these crimes and whipping up a witch hunt I only say one thing “be careful what you wish for”.

The reaction from across the board automatically blaming “whites” has incited hate against Indians. Very sad because it was simply not there before apart from the odd thug or drunk, people not worth being offended by. Threats against each other now because of prejudicial unsupported claims and witch hunts.

Article sub heading - Victorians need to send a message of aggressive intolerance towards the racist and prejudiced bottom crawlers in our society.

Seems the message was sent to the wrong address – again.

Save the vilification for the attackers.

Lucy Montgomery
Indian students have blamed a lot of races for the crimes, including Pacific Islanders and Aboriginals. So what does your post prove?

The Missus,

You cite Miranda Devine's article in the Sydney Morning Herald in support of your position. But shortly after writing that aricle the NSW Police provided her with some information and she has since modified her position.

Nobody is suggesting that all the perpetrators of the attacks are white. But that some of them are non-white in no way supports your allegation that the attacks are being done "in the main" by non-whites.

You have still failed to substantiate your claim that Indian students are pre-disposed to certain types of crime. Care to explain?

It seems to be a running theme in your posts that commentators and others have inferred that only whites can be racist. I do not think that any intelligent person holds that view.

I'm not suggesting that the homeless person that Tim encountered represents all Australia. But as Tim notes, the others in the train were cowed into silence by the acts of two distasteful individuals. It seems reasonably clear that the acts of violence, along with all the other acts of violence, including those against Indian students, are diminishing the freedom of all Australians including our visitors.

Runner, I wish he had been secular, rather than easily swayed by shallow religious boilerplate, as are you.

Rusty.

Phil the Hasbeen

Congratulations for ensuring that your son has some ability to defend himself. The amount of violence in our society will never reduce while these thugs can pick fights every week without much risk of losing. Fighting is only fun while they are winning. The parents of the 'soft targets' should hang their heads in shame. They have failed their children.

benk, "The parents of the 'soft targets' should hang their heads in shame. They have failed their children."

I don't think that many people could handle thugs who spend their lives in backyard gyms and have been living hard by their wits all of their lives. Remember too that thugs are always careful to pick their targets and opportunities to get the drop on you and are likely to have mates spread around the vicinity.

If you haven't seen the problem coming you are unlikely to be equal to the task of dealing with it, so a better approach is to be aware and cautious to reduce the likelihood of something negative happening. That means choosing transport, times, train carriage and so on. It is a real pity because this isn't the Australia of twenty or thirty years ago.

I agree with you that people ought be able to defend themselves, especially in their own homes. However the laws, except perhaps in NSW, are very much on the side of the offenders and they know that. Offenders also know you are defenceless (by law), have no chance of police assistance and it is unlikely they will ever be apprehended.

Cornflower, I too am often angered by the difficulty in apprehending these violent thugs- especially those that target people in their own homes. Our home is meant to be somewhere safe we can retreat to.

However, I would hate to see Australia go the way the US is- where gun laws are too liberal and guns are too easy to obtain.

If many people in their homes were armed with guns, then this would be the weapon of choice they would use if they found someone breaking into their home.

Should people who are stealing from homes be shot dead on sight?
What if they weren't even armed?
Shoot first and ask questions later?
What if it was a relative climbing in through a window after locking themselves out?
How does the home owner decide in one split second if this person is a threat to them or not?

Having said that, I don't know what the answer to home invasion is. Maybe concentrating on effective home security in the first place.

There are two issues here, the first being the solicitating of monies which I experienced last week on the city to Belgrave line by two young people a woman and a man working in tandem and the second being the drop off in Transit Police controlling bad behaviours on our rail system. We can add racial hatred which continues to dog our society and once again requires increased Police intervention. I can fully understand the passive intervention by individuals against this unruly behaviour.I can fully understand also your frustrations largely created by a State Government that plays lip service towards the protection of its people,on our Transport system. Of all the actions you are recommending I would be sending a strong message to Mr.Brumby, calling for urgent action.Then again how many of our politicians actually travel on our trams, trains and buses. Very few I would suggest.

suzeonline,

I was not talking about the method of self-defence. That is another matter entirely.

Somewhere in recent history we have lost our fundamental right to defend ourselves and those precious to us. I can only assume that the rights of criminals have trumped the rights of their victims and society. This article excerpt is from the UK but it would have been no different anywhere in Australia, except maybe NSW:

'TV star Myleene Klass 'waved knife in self defence' By Huw Borland, Sky News From: NewsCore January 10, 2010 7:22PM

A UK TV star warned over waving a knife at teenagers says she acted in self defence.

Myleene Klass, a TV presenter and model, was warned by police after she waved a knife at teenagers who were intruding in her garden in Hertfordshire after midnight local time on Friday, Sky News reported.

She was in her kitchen upstairs with her daughter when she spotted people peering into her window, before grabbing the knife and banging on the windows, scaring the trespassers away.

Hertfordshire Police officers warned Klass she should not have used a knife to scare off the teens because carrying an "offensive weapon" - even in her own home - was illegal.

Klass told Sky News in a statement: "My family are totally fine and I thank the police for being so re-assuring and comforting.

"However, I was left shocked and surprised to be told that a private individual in the privacy of their own home runs the risk of committing a criminal offence if, out of fear for their own safety and their loved ones, they grab something with which they could defend themselves if an intruder enters their home."'